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Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player
I was ecstatic to see how effective team 900's truss shot to the human player was at the South Carolina regional was. I put together a video showcasing the shot. I truly believe this will be a very effective strategy at our next competition.
SECRET SAUCE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjSUAmLFnwY |
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player
Ooh, that's nice. Trussing right from the end of the field. It looks like it would be hard to defend you if you're between the wall and the low goal like that.
If you can do that consistently, I definitely think that will be useful. |
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Please take this thread down they are giving away the secret!!! Joking obviously :D I really enjoyed watching your robot play. I knew this strategy would be viable. I'm just glad to see it implemented so well.
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Honestly, the hardest part was convincing our alliance partners that cycle time was more important than points-per-cycle. I didn't feel like our robot was really showing off until Saturday when we were able to get in more than 4 cycles a match.
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I would like to see this if you get it successfully implemented. Keep us updated on your progress! |
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRK8UGR3vpI |
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I wasn't sure about this strategy prior to joining y'alls alliance for elimination, but it works amazingly. I really think some more practice with the human player/alignment stuff and the right alliance partners in St. Louis would have you taking a good look at Einstein. Keep up the good work!
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Very cool bot and interesting strategy. Wondering if risk of foul points factors in? At some of the competitions, fouls for reaching over were an issue. Did you guys find that the case at your event?
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We did get a verbal warning from the head ref because we were attempting to shoot to another team's human player a couple of times and our HP couldn't get the shot aligned properly from the back so the ball went out of play. This was easily fixed though and we are now working on a way to train other team's human players. Thanks for the compliments folks. We appreciate them. |
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It was a pleasure helping to prove your theory Sat. morning. (Q84). This game has done a good job of requiring alliance partners to work together to be successful.
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I find this strategy to be very viable because this way the ball is never on the ground bouncing around wasting time, the more time the ball is in the robot or in the hands of the human player the less is getting kicked around on the floor.
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So, why wasn't any of the defenders hitting you? The 900 human player was indicating that you needed to line up before shooting. Couldn't a defender have just rammed in and knocked the robot off enough to shut this down?
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We were planning on doing that as well we just need to find out how consistent it will be.
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We experienced little movement when hit because we were backed in the corner with a very solid drivetrain. Our driver was able to maintain his aim after being hit. Having a defender on us did make it slightly harder, but it did not affect us much. |
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a) it was out of bounds and he would receive it back within a few seconds or b) it landed on field in the general vicinity of the goals Plus our drivetrain is built pretty tough, so knocking us out of alignment probably isn't worth what little delay it causes our cycles. |
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We made a couple truss passes at Center Line, but stopped immediately when we found that the Refs decided to call technical fouls on us for intentionally shooting outside the field if the human player missed the catch.
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I loved this! You guys did great at Palmetto, and if I could give you just one piece of constructive criticism (I only have one), it would be this: Don't put your human player in striped pants. We knew that you guys would be loading horizontally across the field from the guy in zebra pants, so we knew exactly where to send the defense. Again, great job, and hope to see you guys at FIRST Championship in St. Louis!
Andrew - 1261 |
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Do you know if anyone questioned the Refs at Center Line about that decision based on G11? G11 BALLS may not be intentionally or repeatedly ejected from gameplay. Violation: FOUL per instance. Passing a BALL to a HUMAN PLAYER is within gameplay and not considered a violation of G11. What does the CD Community think is the proper interpretation of G11 in regards to missed passes to the human player? It seems to me if you were trying to pass it to the human player, but missed, that is not intentional, and therefore not a foul based on G11. |
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I would think that if an HP misses one or two catches, that's not a foul. If it happens much more than that, that becomes "repeatedly" and is worthy of a foul.
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The refs at the NC Regional are known for being extremely knowledgeable, so I don't think the Zebracorns have much to worry about.
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If I was this team I would Create a hard stop alignment device just drop it and drive into the corner... Awesome design!!!
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We might yet add something to prop us in the corner but it doesn't seem to matter much from what we saw in Palmetto. A team would have to devote 2/3 of their alliance to keep us out of both corners, which kinda swings the match in our favor anyway... Not to mention that we can always load the ball over the top of them. We are a fairly tall bot. We nearly won Palmetto with this... we are hoping to win the NC regional. |
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I used a canon Rebel T1i with a 50mm f1.8. I handheld these shots without a strap or rig. However, I do have a homemade steadicam. I used it with my iPhone to shoot this video recently: http://youtu.be/76lFi5nRXNc The T1i only shoots 720p(shh don't tell anyone it's not full HD :P) |
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player
Pardon the necromancy but has anyone seen this done with a decent goalie bot?
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As far as doubling up goes, 900 has been playing hard defense whenever we aren't setting up/shooting. Pushing other robots around seems to work better than putting something in front of the high goal though, especially when smart teams decide to go low goal instead.
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Mixed feelings are mixed, while I feel it is a very strong strategy I just don't see how it isn't being countered hard. If you have it working though nothing wrong with that. |
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Ramming us continuously was half working at NC but we have a solution for that. Your confused look is the same as ours though. What is even more perplexing to us is the lack of teams doing this same strategy at other regional events. We know that there are two or three others that can do it but aren't regularly. Ideally, we could literally park in front of the opponent's goal and then shoot straight to the other 1 pt goal and have another robot put it in without any human players being present. It's hard to wedge us out of the corner once we are in it too. |
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We don't need to peel you out of the corner if being in the corner is detrimental to your team. Every opposing robot that is sitting in a corner is one less robot we need to worry about disrupting a cycle. |
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We ran the math on all of this right after kickoff and came up with a strategy that has paid off for us. I'm not going to claim it is 100% effective in all cases and I know it can be disrupted. Fact is, it won us a regional and an engineering award and we have had a blast doing it. I'll take that any day. |
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Congrats to team 900 on winning the Raleigh regional! I really enjoyed watching your robot launch the ball so powerfully, and your team's strategy was amazing.
I have one question: when did your team have the idea of passing the ball over the truss to the human player? Did you plan to build your robot to shoot the ball that powerfully during the build season, or did you realize that strategy would work well during the competition? (I'm assuming the former.) |
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We planned from the beginning to build our robot the way we did. After kickoff we did a couple of things. The first is that we read over the rules thoroughly to ensure we fully understood them. In addition, we also looked at statistical analysis of the game. From there, we began to think through possible strategies and the scores for them based on that analysis. (This lead to a 4D graph and some other stuff that I won't bore you with.) I am proud to say that our strategy is based on that analysis and that it was arrived at on the day after kickoff. From there, it was a matter of designing a robot to accomplish the goals we set out to accomplish for our strategy. Thank you for the compliments. |
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