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-   -   2014 Greater Toronto East Regional (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127556)

audietron 06-03-2014 11:50

2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
I have not found any thread for this regional yet.


Here is the Team list: GTR-E Teams

Here is the webcast: http://www.watchfirstnow.com/

Good luck at the competition!

Kearse 06-03-2014 11:55

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by audietron (Post 1354465)
I have not found any thread for this regional yet.


Here is the Team list: GTR-E Teams

I have not been able to find a webcast anywhere.

Good luck at the competition!

http://www.watchfirstnow.com/

Christopher149 07-03-2014 09:52

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Did anyone just see Q4? I think we have a new match high score of 420! 250 from teleop, 170 from fouls. Red alliance.

It flowed like the 290 pt match at Palmetto, but with 3 bots.

Mastonevich 07-03-2014 09:55

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
The webcast appears offline. bummer

Christopher149 07-03-2014 09:57

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mastonevich (Post 1354909)
The webcast appears offline. bummer

Well, not on TBA for me.

Mastonevich 07-03-2014 10:01

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Glad to hear it is working for some. Could be an issue for just me being behind firewalls and such.

Tem1514 Mentor 07-03-2014 10:04

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
For me the video link is on and off. Just saw parts of the 420 score, lots of fouls.

Matt_Boehm_329 07-03-2014 10:11

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
30 auto
220 tele
170 fouls

420 total... Wow

epylko 07-03-2014 10:33

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Is there any way to watch this on android without having to pay for the justin.tv app?

BigJ 07-03-2014 10:36

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by epylko (Post 1354943)
Is there any way to watch this on android without having to pay for the justin.tv app?

Twitch.tv (same original company) relatively recently made their streams able to stream from browser on mobile. Not sure if the justin.tv player has caught up yet.

Bochek 07-03-2014 10:46

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by epylko (Post 1354943)
Is there any way to watch this on android without having to pay for the justin.tv app?

Install a flash enabled browser (i suggest FlashFox)

Bochek 07-03-2014 10:49

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
All matches are available for re-viewing just minutes after ending.

Check http://www.watchfirstnow.com/archives frequently.

epylko 07-03-2014 11:33

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Thanks Adam, flashfox is working great.

sammyjalex 07-03-2014 11:38

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Did anyone catch what produced the Red Alliance score in Match 4?

plnyyanks 07-03-2014 11:53

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bochek (Post 1354955)
All matches are available for re-viewing just minutes after ending.

Check http://www.watchfirstnow.com/archives/ frequently.

This is 404ing currently...

audietron 07-03-2014 11:56

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyjalex (Post 1354975)
Did anyone catch what produced the Red Alliance score in Match 4?

That was just good cycle times with all three robots and a truss toss. Which was the 250 points of the total. The 170 were fouls. It was a really exciting match!

mototom 07-03-2014 12:05

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Still not much effective defense going on.

Robotmmm 07-03-2014 12:39

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mototom (Post 1354980)
Still not much effective defense going on.

Exactly.

The MAR event I was at last week was like Battle Bots. Those robots that could not shoot just beat the heck out of those who could. And NE will be even worse. I predict heavy damage to occur and the refs, even with an extra set of eyes, to have a hard time catching all the fouls.

Cullenwelch88 07-03-2014 12:45

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Webcast Down?

Thanks

Cullen

tim-tim 07-03-2014 12:47

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cullenwelch88 (Post 1354989)
Webcast Down?

Thanks

Cullen

Lunch break. Matches scheduled to resume at 1:04 per thebluealliance.

Racer26 07-03-2014 12:48

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cullenwelch88 (Post 1354989)
Webcast Down?

Thanks

Cullen

Both streams appear to be running for me. The event is, however, at lunch (being that its 12:45pm here now). Stream 1 is showing the field's slideshow, Stream 2 is just showing the Vexpro logo.

Keiko 07-03-2014 12:49

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cullenwelch88 (Post 1354989)
Webcast Down?

Thanks

Cullen

It's lunch break. Streaming the field has stopped

Webcast was working just before the break.

Cullenwelch88 07-03-2014 12:52

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Hello,

Okay thanks for letting me know!

Cullen

Bochek 07-03-2014 13:06

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
My bad, Fixed the url in my original post.

StAxis 07-03-2014 13:18

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
According to the Justintv page for me it's saying there was a copyright DMCA violation and the watchfirstnow channel was taken down :(

Tem1514 Mentor 07-03-2014 13:27

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
We heard that a team from Calgary has had their robot lost in transit for this event. :eek: :confused:

Team 2935 that competed in GTRW and went to finals 3-3 with their bot offered to the Calgary team to allow them to borrow 2935's robot. Unfortunately HQ stated that this would have been the greatest GP they have witnessed but have disallowed this to occur as it would be unfair to the other contestants at the event.

Team 2935 fully respects HQ's decision and wishes the best of luck to all our fellow team members at GTRE.

Bochek 07-03-2014 13:28

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by StAxis (Post 1355005)
According to the Justintv page for me it's saying there was a copyright DMCA violation and the watchfirstnow channel was taken down :(

We're working on it. We where suposed to be expempt from the DCMA robots. but i guess they forgot.

idahorobot 07-03-2014 13:44

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Any chance of getting the live score on. There is no scoreboard showing.

Tem1514 Mentor 07-03-2014 13:51

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by idahorobot (Post 1355015)
Any chance of getting the live score on. There is no scoreboard showing.

the only place i can find it so far is here;
http://www2.usfirst.org/2014comp/Eve...chresults.html

Steve W 07-03-2014 13:57

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
All webcast down now

Keiko 07-03-2014 14:03

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Same here

Both webcasts are down

Bochek 07-03-2014 14:05

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
I have moved the streams to ustream for now. You can find them at

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/gtr-east-2014

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/frc-gtr-east-2013

dodar 07-03-2014 14:10

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
GTRE1 video froze and GTRE2 page doesnt exist on ustream.

Like, the GTRE1 stream is froze in place and vibrating, but sound is working perfectly fine.

Cullenwelch88 07-03-2014 14:12

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve W (Post 1355023)
All webcast down now

Fixed now!

Cheers!

Libby K 07-03-2014 14:15

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1355028)
GTRE1 video froze and GTRE2 page doesnt exist on ustream.

Like, the GTRE1 stream is froze in place and vibrating, but sound is working perfectly fine.

I'm having the same issue - thought it was my internet (traveling) but yeah - I can't see anything but can hear.

Steve W 07-03-2014 14:18

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Neither are working. They must be working on the issue as the first one went totally down.

Cullenwelch88 07-03-2014 14:24

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Stream went out again! :(

Steve W 07-03-2014 14:29

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Watchfirstnow.com is on now

seannoseworthy 07-03-2014 14:31

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Justin.tv had our accounts blocked due to a DCMA request, they have now featured our channels, this shouldn't happen again.

Everything should be running fine now, watch at http://www.justin.tv/watchfirstnow and for the full feild view http://www.justin.tv/watchfirstnow2

Cullenwelch88 07-03-2014 14:32

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by seannoseworthy (Post 1355038)
Justin.tv had our accounts blocked due to a DCMA request, they have now featured our channels, this shouldn't happen again.

Everything should be running fine now, watch at http://www.justin.tv/watchfirstnow and for the full feild view http://www.justin.tv/watchfirstnow2

Thanks a lot!:yikes: :yikes:

Steve W 07-03-2014 14:32

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
The full field (without scores ) still not online. Showing Offline

seannoseworthy 07-03-2014 14:34

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve W (Post 1355040)
The full field (without scores ) still not online. Showing Offline

Fixed.

dodar 07-03-2014 14:35

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Neither page loads.

seannoseworthy 07-03-2014 14:37

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1355042)
Neither page loads.

All should be back to normal now. Try the direct links to the broadcast posted above or at watchfirstnow.com

dodar 07-03-2014 14:38

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by seannoseworthy (Post 1355043)
All should be back to normal now. Try the direct links to the broadcast posted above or at watchfirstnow.com

Thats where I did go. The Justin TV layout loads but the middle part(where the streams should be) stays gray and doesnt load.

Steve W 07-03-2014 14:38

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Both working on watchfirstnow.com

idahorobot 07-03-2014 14:38

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
this works now
http://www.thebluealliance.com/gamed...w_1=2014onto-2

Matt_Boehm_329 07-03-2014 14:48

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Does anyone have a score breakdown from match number 18? I believe one of the scores was 261 but i missed it and was unable to see tele-op, auto points, and foul points.

audietron 07-03-2014 15:31

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt_Boehm_329 (Post 1355049)
Does anyone have a score breakdown from match number 18? I believe one of the scores was 261 but i missed it and was unable to see tele-op, auto points, and foul points.

Blue Auto points included 2 10 point goal balls with the second double auto ball from simbotics missing. Only one red ball was scored.
Blue strategy was 2 assists with a truss and high goal 2 technical fouls were called on the red alliance , not sure what for (there is a jump in the stream).

Final score 261 blue , 16 red. around 100 foul points were given to the blue alliance.

Racer26 07-03-2014 15:32

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt_Boehm_329 (Post 1355049)
Does anyone have a score breakdown from match number 18? I believe one of the scores was 261 but i missed it and was unable to see tele-op, auto points, and foul points.

From the FMS Twitter:

TY Q MC 18 RF 16 BF 261 RA 3988 1075 1547 BA 2198 3386 1114 RFP 0 BFP 100 RHS 15 BHS 50 RTS 1 BTS 111

Red
3988
1075
1547

15 Auto
1 Teleop
0 Foul

Blue
2198
3386
1114

50 Auto
111 Teleop
100 Foul

Blue wins, 261-16

Matt_Boehm_329 07-03-2014 15:42

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Racer26 (Post 1355063)
From the FMS Twitter:

Fantastic, thanks!

Jonathan Norris 07-03-2014 18:21

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Any update on when the archived matches are going up??

ErvinI 07-03-2014 18:36

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
They already are.

EDIT: the search feature doesn't seem to work for events, but it works for teams for me. You could use that if you are having troubles on the WatchFirstNow site.

Duncan Macdonald 07-03-2014 19:30

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ErvinI (Post 1355118)
They already are.

EDIT: the search feature doesn't seem to work for events, but it works for teams for me. You could use that if you are having troubles on the WatchFirstNow site.

"onto" is the one you want "gtre" leads to no man's land

Duncan Macdonald 07-03-2014 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navid Shafa (Post 1355149)
Are any of the matches archived yet?

See posts 52-54

ErvinI 07-03-2014 20:15

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Duncan Macdonald (Post 1355134)
"onto" is the one you want "gtre" leads to no man's land

Upon further investigation, it looks like the search feature gets stuck in an infinite loop whenever something that is not the 4-letter regional code is entered. "ONTO" works, but "Greater Toronto East" doesn't, for example.

Michael Hill 08-03-2014 07:35

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
I watched a few of these matches yesterday and the gameplay was SO BORING! Do they even play defense in Canada? :D *hides behind a fire door*

billylo 08-03-2014 11:20

Ha ha.. #sobait #simbotrisestothechallenge #fightthroughthetraffic

Tem1514 Mentor 08-03-2014 13:42

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Okay now I don’t get what an assist is, may be someone could help me out.

If robot B passes to the Human player and then the HP passes back to robot C, how did robot C get an assist from robot B?

Just saw it happen in QF1-2

Jay O'Donnell 08-03-2014 13:46

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tem1514 Mentor (Post 1355345)
Okay now I don’t get what an assist is, may be someone could help me out.

If robot B passes to the Human player and then the HP passes back to robot C, how did robot C get an assist from robot B?

Just saw it happen in QF1-2

I think you're misinterpreting what an "assist" really is. It's not about the pass between robots, it's about different robots possessing the ball in different zones. Therefore it doesn't matter if robot B didn't directly pass to robot C as long as they each possessed the ball in a unique zone.

dodar 08-03-2014 13:46

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tem1514 Mentor (Post 1355345)
Okay now I don’t get what an assist is, may be someone could help me out.

If robot B passes to the Human player and then the HP passes back to robot C, how did robot C get an assist from robot B?

Just saw it happen in QF1-2

Unique robot in a unique zone.

Racer26 08-03-2014 13:48

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Because ASSISTs are only related to unique ROBOT/ZONE pairs of POSSESSION.

To use QF1-2 as an example, HP inbounds to 4718 in the blue ZONE. 4718 passes to 3683 in the blue ZONE. 3683 drives to white ZONE, then throws over the TRUSS to the HP. HP passes back to 1114 in the red ZONE, who scores it. 4718/BLUE, 3683/WHITE, 1114/RED. 3 ASSISTs.

Tem1514 Mentor 08-03-2014 13:59

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1355347)
Unique robot in a unique zone.

Okay fine, then a robot A gets the cycle start ball from the HP then travels through each zone with the ball and scores the ball. So according to “unique zone” robot A did just that so that should be three assists, correct?

Justin Shelley 08-03-2014 14:01

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tem1514 Mentor (Post 1355351)
Okay fine, then a robot A gets the cycle start ball from the HP then travels through each zone with the ball and scores the ball. So according to “unique zone” robot A did just that so that should be three assists, correct?

Must be a unique robot in a unique zone

Hallry 08-03-2014 14:02

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tem1514 Mentor (Post 1355351)
Okay fine, then a robot A gets the cycle start ball from the HP then travels through each zone with the ball and scores the ball. So according to “unique zone” robot A did just that so that should be three assists, correct?

You might want to go back and take a closer look at the manual. ::rtm::

Tem1514 Mentor 08-03-2014 14:42

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hallry (Post 1355353)
You might want to go back and take a closer look at the manual. ::rtm::

Since the manual, (and yes I did read it) is unclear, I'm asking here since I don't have posting rights on the Q&A.

JohnFogarty 08-03-2014 14:43

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
How bout them penalties tho.

eddie12390 08-03-2014 14:43

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tem1514 Mentor (Post 1355360)
Since the manual, (and yes I did read it) is unclear, I'm asking here since I don't have posting rights on the Q&A.

It's unique robot in a unique zone. You can only get an assist for one of the zones that a robot was in. If another robot had possessed the ball at any point they would have two assists.

engunneer 08-03-2014 14:46

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Simbotics just got knocked out in the SF. They haven't missed a finals for a regional since 2009 at the midwest regional.

They were knocked out in the second SF by a opposite possesion error.
and by the #5 alliance even (captained by the 6th seed), which shut the red alliance down pretty effectively in the first SF.

insane matches all around, showing again the super high quality of the ONTO region teams.

pwnageNick 08-03-2014 14:51

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by engunneer
Simbotics just got knocked out in the SF. They haven't missed a finals for a regional since 2009 at the midwest regional.

They were knocked out by a opposite possesion error, and by the #5 alliance even (captained by the 6th seed)

insane matches.

They've only missed the final round of eliminations at a regional 8 times total in their entire history. I bleive they've only missed eliminations all together twice.

Congrats to the blue alliance. A couple of great matches to watch.

-Nick

Racer26 08-03-2014 14:51

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Being totally fair to 1285/4476/2198,

Blue won SF1-1 on strategy and defense once ahead, and they were forced to play SF1-2 with 2198 disabled.

Cullenwelch88 08-03-2014 14:53

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Pure epic!!!

1285/4476/2198 knocked out the #1 alliance. They knocked out the #1 alliance with 1 robot (2198) disabled too. Wow!!!

What a match!!

I love this years game!!!

Cullen

Bochek 08-03-2014 15:00

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by engunneer (Post 1355363)
They were knocked out in the second SF by a opposite possesion error.


They accidentally caught the blue ball after it was shot over the truss. And quickly (as they could) removed it from their robot. I'm not 100% on the rules on this one. But shouldn't that not be a T-Foul?

cmwilson13 08-03-2014 15:09

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bochek (Post 1355373)
They accidentally caught the blue ball after it was shot over the truss. And quickly (as they could) removed it from their robot. I'm not 100% on the rules on this one. But shouldn't that not be a T-Foul?

i agree

Steve W 08-03-2014 15:13

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
They had possession. T foul

Tem1514 Mentor 08-03-2014 15:14

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Wow :ahh: Blue just played F1 with only two bots :yikes:

I wonder why they didn't call for a backup bot:confused:

Bochek 08-03-2014 15:15

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve W (Post 1355378)
They had possession. T foul

But it could be argued that the other alliance caused them to take the foul.

Bochek 08-03-2014 15:15

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tem1514 Mentor (Post 1355379)
Wow :ahh: Blue just played F1 with only two bots :yikes:

I wonder why they didn't call for a backup bot:confused:

1241 spent the match fixing their robot.

Racer26 08-03-2014 15:18

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bochek (Post 1355382)
1241 spent the match fixing their robot.

Suspect they didn't call for a backup cause winning 2 against 4476/2198/1285 replacing 1241 with a backup would have been more impossible than coming back from losing the first match of the finals.

Duncan Macdonald 08-03-2014 15:20

It's really hard to replace the second overall pick.

PriyankP 08-03-2014 15:29

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bochek (Post 1355373)
They accidentally caught the blue ball after it was shot over the truss. And quickly (as they could) removed it from their robot. I'm not 100% on the rules on this one. But shouldn't that not be a T-Foul?

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmwilson13 (Post 1355377)
i agree

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bochek (Post 1355380)
But it could be argued that the other alliance caused them to take the foul.

The rules state that if you possess the wrong ball, it is a technical foul. It explicitly states in the rules that you should design your robot to never possess the opponent's ball - even accidentally.

Now, if the blue team intentionally put the blue ball in the red robot, it would be causing them to take a penalty. But they just went for the truss shot that bounced into the red robot.


Either way, it is really heart breaking when the top seed loses before the finals. Kudos to the blue alliance for playing good defence and having a really well rounded alliance!

engunneer 08-03-2014 15:33

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
and now they have taken out the #2 alliance in the finals. Fantastic work all around. Congrats 2198/4476/1285!

Mr. Lim 08-03-2014 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bochek (Post 1355380)
But it could be argued that the other alliance caused them to take the foul.

https://frc-qa.usfirst.org/Question/...rt-to-immediat

This q&a addresses the direct question. It does leave the exact situation open to interpretation to the referees, but it does let you know what the GDCs line of thinking is on this situation.

Crazy matches. Crazy tournament.

Not surprised that members of both 4476 and 1285 were at GTRW and took some of the strategic play back east with them.

Gaurav27 08-03-2014 15:52

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Lim (Post 1355393)

Crazy matches. Crazy tournament.

Not surprised that members of both 4476 and 1285 were at GTRW and took some of the strategic play back east with them.

We definitely used strategies both employed and learned from the Greater Toronto West Regional.

Crazy to say the least. I've never seen an eliminations bracket like this, with such extreme circumstances. The penalty values make every match a swing match. Thus, making it heavily reliant on alliance synergy and strategies!

Paul Copioli 08-03-2014 18:43

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaurav27 (Post 1355399)
The penalty values make every match a swing match.

I agree with this above, but ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaurav27 (Post 1355399)
Thus, making it heavily reliant on alliance synergy and strategies!

This makes no sense.


To me, it's more like this: "The penalty values make every match a swing match. Thus, making it heavily reliant on referees implementation and interpretation of the rules."

C'mon guys. 50 pt penalty for inconsequential ball in another teams robot. I understand what the rule says, but think it is stupid. A rule like this should make it so the refs can determine if it was inconsequential to the score or not. Anyone watching this particular situation in SF1-2 could see what happened and the ball was immediately ejected from the robot. It was ejected much faster than even field reset can give the ball back to the human player.

These rules and point values are out of whack. Seriously out of whack. My comments after week 1 still stand.

Crazy game? That's one way of saying it.

Link07 08-03-2014 19:01

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli (Post 1355463)
I agree with this above, but ...


This makes no sense.


To me, it's more like this: "The penalty values make every match a swing match. Thus, making it heavily reliant on referees implementation and interpretation of the rules."

C'mon guys. 50 pt penalty for inconsequential ball in another teams robot. I understand what the rule says, but think it is stupid. A rule like this should make it so the refs can determine if it was inconsequential to the score or not. Anyone watching this particular situation in SF1-2 could see what happened and the ball was immediately ejected from the robot. It was ejected much faster than even field reset can give the ball back to the human player.

These rules and point values are out of whack. Seriously out of whack. My comments after week 1 still stand.

Crazy game? That's one way of saying it.

I take an opposite view point. It's as important to be able to score as it is to be smart and avoid these types of penalties. I believe any ref at any event would have likely called that possession (which in this case I don't think is very open to interpretation), so it would have been in the best interest of the team to avoid it. Saying that they couldn't is like saying they couldn't effectively do another task like scoring. The penalties in this game put a big emphasis on playing cleanly and designing your robot to play cleanly. Have there been inconsistencies with the refs? Sure, but that happens every year. Bottom line, it was the right call in the way the rules have been written for a game that placed heavy importance on playing cleanly from the very beginning. Some may not like that the game is designed this way, but it's the reality.

Anupam Goli 08-03-2014 19:04

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
i know this isn't a YMTC thread, but since we're bringing the point of possesion up...

If I'm lined up for a catch, my ally and opponent both fire, my ally misses, but my opponent's ball ends up in my catcher, what would you call that? I don't see how in a game where catching is an objective, you can design something that doesn't catch opponent's balls on accident.

mman1506 08-03-2014 19:12

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Anupam Goli (Post 1355474)
I don't see how in a game where catching is an objective, you can design something that doesn't catch opponent's balls on accident.

254, 1114, our robot and probably quite a few more have mechanisms in place to prevent catching the ball unless they are in their "catching position".

Pault 08-03-2014 19:15

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli (Post 1355463)
I agree with this above, but ...


This makes no sense.


To me, it's more like this: "The penalty values make every match a swing match. Thus, making it heavily reliant on referees implementation and interpretation of the rules."

C'mon guys. 50 pt penalty for inconsequential ball in another teams robot. I understand what the rule says, but think it is stupid. A rule like this should make it so the refs can determine if it was inconsequential to the score or not. Anyone watching this particular situation in SF1-2 could see what happened and the ball was immediately ejected from the robot. It was ejected much faster than even field reset can give the ball back to the human player.

These rules and point values are out of whack. Seriously out of whack. My comments after week 1 still stand.

Crazy game? That's one way of saying it.

Yes.



My biggest problem with this game isn't just that it is too easy to get fouls. It is that you can get easily get fouls for things which barely hurt the opposing alliance, all these common fouls are technical fouls, technical fouls are worth 50pts a piece, and 50pts are enough to change the outcome of most matches.

Richard Wallace 08-03-2014 19:16

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli (Post 1355463)
...A rule like this should make it so the refs can determine if it was inconsequential to the score or not.

I'm with you on this, Paul.

However, if we want the refs to determine which robot actions are consequential, we have to let them follow the big picture. As it stands now, they are too busy staring at trees (possessions, trusses, catches, goals) and then waiting for their scoring tablet lags to clear. So they miss the forest. That would not matter in the particular case being discussed here since the rule is very clear -- even if many of us agree it is "out of whack".

Being a ref is hard, any year. This year it is harder because they are also part of the real time scoring system. That is the GDC's mistake.

Abhishek R 08-03-2014 19:37

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mman1506 (Post 1355477)
254, 1114, our robot and probably quite a few more have mechanisms in place to prevent catching the ball unless they are in their "catching position".

He said the bot was lined up for a catch. I'm not sure what 254 and 1114 have that prevents catching the ball, do they distinguish between the color of the ball and then close the catcher to stop possession of the ball before it enters the bot? I doubt any teams have anything like that, it's unnecessary. I think you interpreted his question in the wrong manner.

ErvinI 08-03-2014 20:07

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Since this is not the catching thread...

Congratulations are in order for 4476, 1285 and 2198 for winning GTRE and 781, 3161 and 5036 for advancing to champs!

I'm wondering if 5036 knows yet that they qualified for champs...

Gregor 08-03-2014 20:10

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
781 has the best Chairman's award video I have ever seen.

mman1506 08-03-2014 20:20

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Abhishek R (Post 1355486)
I'm not sure what 254 and 1114 have that prevents catching the ball, do they distinguish between the color of the ball and then close the catcher to stop possession of the ball before it enters the bot?

The driver should be trained to do that. Not incurring fouls is an important part of the game.

Bochek 08-03-2014 20:27

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregor (Post 1355499)
781 has the best Chairman's award video I have ever seen.

I'm not sure I would give it the "best ever" award. But it was absolutely top notch! Congrats to 781!

Yipyapper 08-03-2014 20:30

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregor (Post 1355499)
781 has the best Chairman's award video I have ever seen.

I could not believe how well it turned out; the members of our awards team made something that I couldn't believe myself. I think by winning the Chairman's award two years in a row, we proved that we weren't just a one-off, and the video is huge proof of that. This isn't just a thing that started this year either--every year, we've been working towards our excellence on both the admin and the build side of our team, and every year of the team deserves incredible mention for their outstanding contributions (from our kilt days to our boring jeans of today).

I won't comment on the game, but I think my feelings are like Gregor's, but even stronger after this competition. The eliminations at the very least were exciting, and it was fun working with our alliance partners 3988 and 3386--I'm sure if 1241 wasn't pulling off that great defence with that fantastic chassis, we would've been able to shoot a lot more goals in the top.

I would also like to thank Karthik for being, once again, a great MC for how often I saw him. He really got our team pumped for the match, regardless of my prior mood or the importance of said match.

Oh, and if anyone was curious, our first few matches were iffy because the sprockets for the left drive's chain had gotten chewed out. I'm sure people noticed the vast improvement afterwards--too bad that took up the time that I (the programmer) could've used for a 2 or 3 ball auto test :rolleyes:

On that note, thanks to Team Dave for delaying the match by like 20 minutes. We would've missed our match for 1114 with the stuff we had to fix if they hadn't delayed.

Tom Line 08-03-2014 21:02

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Link07 (Post 1355471)
I take an opposite view point. It's as important to be able to score as it is to be smart and avoid these types of penalties. I believe any ref at any event would have likely called that possession (which in this case I don't think is very open to interpretation), so it would have been in the best interest of the team to avoid it. Saying that they couldn't is like saying they couldn't effectively do another task like scoring. The penalties in this game put a big emphasis on playing cleanly and designing your robot to play cleanly. Have there been inconsistencies with the refs? Sure, but that happens every year. Bottom line, it was the right call in the way the rules have been written for a game that placed heavy importance on playing cleanly from the very beginning. Some may not like that the game is designed this way, but it's the reality.

Have you been on the receiving end of some of these penalties? We've been forced into taking penalties that you literally had no choice about. Getting pushed into an opponents goal, pushed out of bounds, or had a another robot ram your collector while you are motionless, smash it, and YOU receive the 50 point foul for incursion into their bumper region.

The GDC worked on it some, but the penalty points are out of whack, and the refs are still overworked. That said, I suspect this is the game we're playing for the rest of the year. We're in the process of modifying our robot accordingly.

Undertones 08-03-2014 21:11

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregor (Post 1355499)
781 has the best Chairman's award video I have ever seen.

Is there a link somewhere?

Yipyapper 08-03-2014 21:19

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertones (Post 1355538)
Is there a link somewhere?

We'll post a link on CD once it gets posted.

Mr. Lim 08-03-2014 21:35

Re: 2014 Greater Toronto East Regional
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Line (Post 1355533)
Have you been on the receiving end of some of these penalties? We've been forced into taking penalties that you literally had no choice about. Getting pushed into an opponents goal, pushed out of bounds, or had a another robot ram your collector while you are motionless, smash it, and YOU receive the 50 point foul for incursion into their bumper region.

The GDC worked on it some, but the penalty points are out of whack, and the refs are still overworked. That said, I suspect this is the game we're playing for the rest of the year. We're in the process of modifying our robot accordingly.

Yes, our human player once took a 50 point penalty catching a poorly thrown ball from the Field Reset Crew. His hand extended for a short period past the yellow tape.

We've had our intake out to pick up a ball, and been slammed into from the side, and had the intake swipe an opponent's robot inside the frame perimeter as a result. Again a 50 pt penalty.

I'm being 100% honest in saying that both the situations above are very different than what happened in SF1-2. 4718 had the entire half of the field themselves when the opposing ball landed. No other robots pushed them or forced them to go towards the ball. The ball landed feet away from them, and they chose to drive towards it. I've told my drive crew not to play defense on the opposing ball, only the opposing robots - that's how the rules are written due to these tech fouls. We asked the Q&A quoted earlier in this thread to clarify too. "Accidentally" catching a ball was a risk just not worth taking.

I find it hard to say that 4718 was forced into taking this penalty.

My opinion is that they made a mistake driving towards the ball, that ended up being a very costly one.

10/10 times my strategy guys would've said the better move would've been to drive towards the robot expected to pick up the ball and score it, to seal them off from the ball.

I agree there are some "forced" penalties in this game that I have seen, that are less than fair...

...but this is NOT one of them.


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