Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

I agree, I think everyone is overreacting. I didn't watch every match at the Wisconsin Regional today, but the game play generally seemed better and I did not see any over abundance of "ramming" calls though there were definitely robot parts on the field. (Our Axis camera got destroyed one match).

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

I know that at least at Wisconsin, the driver meeting was before the update came out. There was not another driver meeting after the update. The head ref did walk around and show teams the rule change. However, he was very unclear about how stuff would actually be called.
Thats not his fault, every ref at an event will call stuff differently.

Although, this is not the end of the world. Its not being called unfairly, in fact, its barely being called at all, and I'm fine with that. The update encourages teams to at least be more careful.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

When was the driver meeting. Because we missed it and I would like to know when it was.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

It was Thursday morning; 9am I believe.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

I'm not sure which competitions some of you are reviewing. If you're concerned about a bit of high speed defense, you're missing the bigger picture. Last week saw some "defense" that was clearly attempting to overturn or disable an opponent by repeated, aggressive ramming. That's just not right, in the context of FRC, and it seems that the GDC is making a statement to that effect.

Thank you.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

According to the refs at Lenape, this foul is going to be called as "no harm, no foul". Don't know how that'll work, we'll see tomorrow when we get some actual matches in.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

This. This right here.

I do not think one single team has gone out for a match with the express intent to break someone else's robot. Of course, robots do get broken--particularly under-engineered ones, or because of accidents (such as intakes inside other robots). Everybody is right. This is not Battlebots, and I am certain nobody pretends it is, but that does not mean it is BEST (with zero robot contact allowed). The bumpers are there for a reason, and that reason is because this is a contact sport.

Also, comparing this game to any other sport (hockey, football, American football, lacrosse, or anything else) cannot be accurately done.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

1 step forward...2 steps back. I would be glad I stayed home this weekend (avoiding showing my displeasure or any non-GP in front of students or anyone else), except the link to my teams Regional event from FIRSThas yet to even work at all today, concerning the standings & schedule.

So looking up where the team is in the standings at any time today, was totally impossible on the web, without bothering my scouting Wife via text or phone, who is super busy as always. And the link to the streaming video didn't even work until game #21 (Thank You theredalliance.com for finding a valid link, much appreciated here.

And, whoever is posting the vids to YouTube though they are also very much appreciated, & much better quality than the actual stream, doesn't stay on long enough to record any of the final scores (or any of those important penalties assessed), on even 1 of the vids, and on the stream of course, commercials always interrupt the stream at just the absolute wrong moment for sure. A tough day all around I'd say. 8th isn't bad for the amount of no shows they were force to not play with. Tons of short handed matches today for sure. And needless to say, I was lost all day...Thank goodness those little current seeding #'s were there next to the team #'s....I could at least somewhat tell something, when those went up or down the next match they played (much later though), whether they won or lost or tied the previous match.

Sure wish I had high blood pressure normally, so at least I'd have some medicine to take right now. Lol.

I don't disagree w/ the actual call of "less battle bots" and more FIRST Robotics update (except another subjective call added in that absolutely...nobody needed one more of those in this game...Especially the ref's).

Penalties overall seemed a bit lower thanks to TUESDAY's changes though, and the Ref. assistants seemed to help quite a bit....Some even hit balls back onto the field personally & repeatedly protecting the fancy pads they were operating...LOL. (You can trash any actual season points rating system if keeping track though, meaningless with all the existing changes now). anyone who is relying on one, is lying only to themselves.

It is the timing (announced while some are on the road traveling to a place w/ no real net access...Surprise! We changed things, let us tell you about it in the driver's meeting), of the actual change that really bothers me (personally, I don't care though...I'm not actually playing the game myself)....As long as they keep changing everything daily, and weekly (whether I personally like or don't like the changes matters very little), like this, it will be a completely different game by the time the Championships get here.

Of course nobody will remember exactly what the rules of the game really are...But, who really does now anyway? (Dead ball card...what is that really, except a 1 minute or so wall decoration, that isn't often seen?) 2 ball Auto...Nobody really cares if you have 2 balls contacting your robot to start....Their minds are no doubt elsewhere, trying to keep those penalties straight.

Are all the (truss crossing), 180 degree "wrong way auto's", I have seen so far, really NOT intentional? (can we allow them a rule change to put "FRONT" or "Point This Way!" on the front bumper please?) And I thought our team was confused when we built a bot that picks up on one end shoots out the other!

And how about all those sadly missed auto balls (But, why don't we truss it anyway just to see what happens), or are they just meaningless practice shots to burn up more time for no gain?

I'm beginning to wonder if it was only the adults who read the rules fully this year. Or are we only the confused ones. Maybe they changed that "Auto ball leftover," earns absolutely no truss points rule too, and they only told the students. Guess I'll go read the rules again...Nahhhhh. Not happening.

Good Luck Teams!

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

I haven't seen any rampant robot destruction or resulting penalties at AZ, but I haven't had a chance to see all of the matches. Our "damage prone" grabby mechanism is safely intact after a day of qualifications! We'll see how elimination matches play out tomorrow...

In case you are referring to our 2 ball autos, all of them have been 100% within the rules (the second ball is away from the bumper by about an inch). Ian was watching us pretty closely during our practice day antics to keep us in check. :)

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

We got the ONLY G27 call all of Friday at la while playing offense under double defense.

It's a bit ridiculous.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

Specifics?

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

I agree that the rule may be subject to abusive calling, like many others in this game, however imagine this:

A robot is performing its part in a cycle when suddenly it is rammed by an opposing robot from a high velocity. That robot, for whatever reason, loses communication. All of the sudden you have a dead ball and one less alliance partner for some time during the match.

For us, it was a matter of electronics rather than metal. Something completely out of our control even though we built a fairly tough robot and secured electronics well.

So while, no, I'd rather not encourage the rising foul points awarded, there is merit to preventing overly aggressive gameplay. Defense is integral to Aerial Assist, but not damage.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

Yes, I agree that it could the rule could use clarification. Perhaps something like the old 2 line pass in hockey rule.

Defense is part of every game ever played. Having said that, I have watched as robots travel from the Red zone, through the White, into the Blue to ram an opponent in the process of making a shot into the high goal. No attempt to slow down or minimize the impact ever made, sometimes completely disabling the opponent, and no foul was called. This situation, in my opinion, was why the rule was adjusted.

FIRST made adjustments to the possession of an opponents ball inconsequential vs consequential) that were necessary to the flow of the game. I saw this being called correctly at many venues. I don't understand why ramming with the intent to damage is not called more often.

Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014
 

Because if someone is trying to damage a robot (which they are hopefully not), how is the ref supposed to tell that between trying to stop the robot from scoring?