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-   -   Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128475)

Rob3653 03-04-2014 12:35

Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Hello, I have a question about the starting configuration in the goalie zone.
Are we allowed to start with an arm that is about 8 ft high at the start of the match? Can you cite the rule please?
Thanks!:)

AdamHeard 03-04-2014 12:39

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Just for a little exercise, can you cite a rule saying you CAN'T start 8' tall in the goalie zone?

rlowe61 03-04-2014 13:12

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
HINT #1
Here is part of the answer:

3.2.5.6 G23
If a ROBOT is in contact with carpet in its GOALIE ZONE, and for only one ROBOT per ALLIANCE at a time, ......

But don't just look at the one place in the rules. Remember many places in the rules cover the robot and what can and can't be done.

Hint #2
There is another part of the rules that mentions "STARTING CONFIGURATION"

Happy Hunting.

tanmaker 03-04-2014 13:34

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
There is nothing in the rules that gives a maximum height for the starting configuration. We talked about this at OKC and allowed a robot starting in the goalie zone to have an unlimited height. We had Frank Merick there too, so I'm guessing if that wasn't allowed, he would have said something.

rlowe61 03-04-2014 13:58

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Hint #2

4.1.4 R4
In the STARTING CONFIGURATION, the ROBOT must constrain itself such that no part of the ROBOT extends
outside the vertical projection of the FRAME PERIMETER, with the exception of minor protrusions such as bolt heads,
fastener ends, rivets, etc.

Nowhere does it state a horizontal limit.

Jimmy Nichols 03-04-2014 13:59

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
I went back and re-read the rules and the glossary for STARTING CONFIGURATION and I think your interpretation at OKC was correct. I didn't catch that one.

tanmaker 03-04-2014 14:09

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rlowe61 (Post 1368867)
Hint #2

4.1.4 R4
In the STARTING CONFIGURATION, the ROBOT must constrain itself such that no part of the ROBOT extends
outside the vertical projection of the FRAME PERIMETER, with the exception of minor protrusions such as bolt heads,
fastener ends, rivets, etc.

Nowhere does it state a horizontal limit.

I'm guessing you meant to say vertical instead of horizontal.

themccannman 03-04-2014 14:17

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rlowe61 (Post 1368867)
Hint #2

4.1.4 R4
In the STARTING CONFIGURATION, the ROBOT must constrain itself such that no part of the ROBOT extends
outside the vertical projection of the FRAME PERIMETER, with the exception of minor protrusions such as bolt heads,
fastener ends, rivets, etc.

Nowhere does it state a horizontal limit.

It states the horizontal limit right there. "no part of the robot extends outside the vertical projection of the frame perimeter." That means the imaginary vertical wall that is 20" from your frame. There is no rule however stating that vertical height limits are any different in starting configuration than they are during tele-op.

RallyJeff 06-04-2014 10:14

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by themccannman (Post 1368877)
It states the horizontal limit right there. "no part of the robot extends outside the vertical projection of the frame perimeter." That means the imaginary vertical wall that is 20" from your frame.

The frame perimeter is the imaginary vertical plane defined by the outside face of the frame.

The 20" distance you mentioned has to do with the restriction during the match, not the starting configuration.

FrankJ 06-04-2014 10:20

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tanmaker (Post 1368859)
There is nothing in the rules that gives a maximum height for the starting configuration. We talked about this at OKC and allowed a robot starting in the goalie zone to have an unlimited height. We had Frank Merick there too, so I'm guessing if that wasn't allowed, he would have said something.

You do know there is a ceiling? Would that be considered contact outside of the field? :)

samfruth 06-04-2014 10:26

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
You can extend as high as you want, as shown by our static 8 ft robot ;) . But the biggest problems we came into were doors and loading onto the field.

themccannman 06-04-2014 15:00

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RallyJeff (Post 1369803)
The frame perimeter is the imaginary vertical plane defined by the outside face of the frame.

The 20" distance you mentioned has to do with the restriction during the match, not the starting configuration.

Whoops, I didn't mean to put in the 20", I was just referring to frame perimeter limits.

rich2202 07-04-2014 11:20

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Looks like you can have an 8' robot. Just be careful to always be in contact with the goalie zone.

In theory an opponent can push you out of the goalie zone. I would not call that a G14 violation because the purpose of pushing you out is to get you to drop to 5' to make their shots easier. Just because your robot is incapable of dropping below 5' is not their problem.

Boltman 21-04-2014 12:23

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Another question as per the rules, can a Goalie robot be pre-placed anywhere in the goalie zone or does it need to start centered and move itself to defend the goal after autonomous starts?

BigJ 21-04-2014 12:27

Re: Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boltman (Post 1377229)
Another question as per the rules, can a Goalie robot be pre-placed anywhere in the goalie zone or does it need to start centered and move itself to defend the goal after autonomous starts?

It may be placed anywhere, but you have to declare a final position, after which offensive (non-goalie zone) bots get to pick positions.


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