Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Among other things, both real and perceived.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

One really fascinating part of the endorsement was the AIA's comment about robotics being the only sport that will be allowed to solicit/accept donations from the private sector. I am just a little skeptical that the average school district's liability insurance for a football season (much less salaries.stipends for a head coach and multiple assistant coachs) is less than the $6K it takes to start an FRC team. If we could get football assistant coach stipends for robotics mentors, we'd have a math teacher and a graphics arts teacher involved (and I'd be in the stands cheering).

The Olympics gave up the farce of "amateur athletes" some years ago, Let's leave the highest tier of the NCAA as the last bastion of that non-profit (for the grunts involved) foolishness. FIRST has always been about growing into the real, business, profit seeking world. As a high school "sport" it can be the best start we give the students, with competition that will be, as opposed to artificial demonstrations based physical endowment, where those who cooperate, think and do, even the potentially totally physically incapacitated (op cit Steven Hawking), exceed their own expectations, and blow the rest of us away.

The Arizona high school sports authority made an extraordinary step, along with Minnesota and Connecticut. We must build on this.

Unfortunately for the other worthy robotics programs, FRC is probably the best way to go right now at the high school level. It takes a basketball court sized endeavor to capture people's attention. 6x120lbs of robot running around on that size field is probably the minimum it takes to get the world involved.

Let's work for a proper set of district competitions, where the incremental cost of additional events is not 80% of the first, but 10%, so that everyone gets a couple of shots at glory.

Tim

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

That's Amazing! :yikes:

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Hey Ledge,

I have been watching this develop all year long now....And, while it is always great that Robotics is getting the recognition early on in our Great State (we all know we are usually last in line for major AZ State changes).

And, I don't want to be a "Debby or Danny Downer" whatsoever, but we are a huge mixture State of Larger Big Cities like "The Valley of the Sun", & Tucson, and a whole lot of smaller rural towns across our big tall & wide State...I know what it means in the larger 3 metro areas (comprising the majority of the teams in the State for sure, & that is why we could not ask the questions early on). But, I have been asking what it means for longstanding 22 yr. FIRST Community wide teams like ours, or even new rookie teams from the Rural Areas of our Great State also that may pr. up to create a team.

Our Specific Example...We are a 22 yr. FIRST FRC Team (60), our specific team is a Community wide team, made up of Students from 3 different High Schools -2 from HS's in the Kingman Unified District, 1 from Kingman Academy of Learning HS, and covering 2 different School districts (1 Public, 1 Public Charter), and we also invite Home Schooled children in the area to also join our Community Team. (The AIA has specific rules concerning that last bunch, very specific rules too, we recently found out...Home Schoolers playing on Public school sports teams or clubs, though I heard maybe they ironed those out a bit lately, or are doing so).

When we win, our Whole Community wins! (When we play the game, our whole community plays the game). So, let us say (though I have another question right here...State Championships AIA, 30 teams from each AZ Regional held qualify? Or Top 30 from both regionals 15/15? Do you know that answer?....The background didn't make for real easy reading), OK, back to the thing I have been trying to get answered as it relates directly to our specific Community team.....Let's say we do qualify, and we are blessed with winning the State Championships...Are all 3 of our Team consisted High Schools, now Combined State Champions? (A big question that begs an answer...Just in case...Or do we flip a coin or draw straws?)

We do have 3 different Robotics Clubs, at those 3 High Schools, and another Home schooled Club...But they all belong to FIRST TEAM 60 "The Bionic Bulldogs" when it comes to FRC. FTC or Lego Robotics are still under the banner of "The Bionic Bulldogs" and their individual team numbers, Kingman, AZ (One big happy family, inseperable as an entity).

I cannot see how this is going to fit the AIA rules easily. (All 3 schools are AIA members now though also. The Charter District use to be a member of another Charter School Athletic Assoc., no longer so).

I'll go one step further...Do to location and semantics, and dollars of course (Our team chose this year only, to do as usual, 1 AZ Regional, and 1 NV Regional back-to-back, those choices were made before the AIA final announcement of course...& also, the students made that choice based on our location (Vegas is an hour closer to us than PHX, is all, and we have longstanding donated church lodging in both places we really appreciate year in year out, hard to ask 1 twice in a few weeks in PHX is all to put us up again, and risk losing the other in later years also)...Will that only attending 1 AZ Regional, have a bearing on possibly qualifying for the State Tournament?

I hope asking important questions "to us" does not look like a selfish attitude, it isn't really (am trying to speak for many rural teams in the State, and many we hope to come in the future)...I would just like to know what the rules roadmap is before we reach a summit or crossroads, if possible, not after.

Our specific Community Team (which originally grew out of 1 High School Team, whose membership over the years dwindled a bit to lower membership long ago, then Team 60 "The Bionic Bulldogs" went Community wide), has been in this ever changing game way too long, and all the Students it impacts, deserve to know what road we specifically are on today, and in the years to come, with the AIA Recognition. (Overall a great positive AIA move!)

Though, any exposure and recognition for ROBOTICS in AZ is great for the entire Robotics Community at large, and FIRST also as a whole, along with other Robotics organizations, teams, classes, etc! (Our specific High Schools recognized Letters in Robotics a number of years back....But, AIA rules are different concerning Lettering in Recognized AIA Sports, though).

We just see many questions, few answers yet (though we will be patient & kind as the kinks for a few may be ironed out). Just personal observations, and I know you were just touting the Good News here, and are not the go to guy, for the answers to our specific problems.

The News is certainly great for you and those others in the major metro areas of AZ, having sole single High School Teams, and I think it is great news for you and us together. I just hope it does not lead to other issues, I can see happening on the horizon.

if you do know the sources for any of said answers...Please share. OK?:D

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Hey Tim...If you started an FRC Team w/ only 6K...I need to sit with you and pick your brain a little please. While that may register you for an FRC Kit OP and a Team number, and recognize your Team as a member of FIRST ROBOTICS (FRC)...That is only the very rock bottom beginning my friend. You might be under the umbrella, but, you certainly are not out of the money rain.

Pennies from heaven! Please...lots of pennies from heaven.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Personal opinion only...Our State is not necessarily too small (But for some of us Too Spread out), for Proper Districts yet (except in the Central & lower half of the State of course)....We, The Bionic Bulldogs Team #60 would probably either play The Coconuts Team #2486 in our District, and the winner would head to PHX (or 1 sent to 1 district, 1 to another). Those are the only 2 currently true operating teams as of last year (FRC), in the whole entire top half of the State. (And that is a huge area, of relatively smaller populations). There was another northern AZ rookie team formed & registered last year, but they were no shows at Regional for some unknown reason (and I just checked, not on either E or W AZ Regional list this year)...We tried really hard though.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

It will certainly be interesting to learn the answers to cglrcng's questions. They involve exactly the sorts of bureaucratic rules that I was writing about in my earlier post.

I'll repeat this sentiment too: It appears that folks interacting with the the athletics organizations, and with the media, aren't graciously ensuring that FRC is clearly identified as the FIRST Robotics program, one of many robotics programs; instead of as "robotics". To me it seems a bit rude and misleading to implicitly dismiss all the other programs (both non-FIRST and FIRST).

I am curious whether anyone involved in these states is attempting to make this important distinction clear to the athletics organizations, or to the media?

This good news, "The AIA went on a trip to Minnesota to check out what they had there and were blown away! " makes me wonder how much *more* they were blown away when they found out what was going on at the Minnesota FRC State Championship was an example of only one of the successful, popular, growing, high-energy, worldwide, robotics programs. What did they say when they were told that?

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

congrats

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

More information on the State Championship. Specifically, we now know how the top 30 teams will be selected. It is determined by using the district point system to rank teams, with some modifications.

http://www.aiaonline.org/activities/robotics

Also notable, the State Championship is a bag and tag event.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Looks like the AZ model was lifted pretty much with minimal (if any) change from the MN model.

See

MN rules: http://www.mshsl.org/mshsl/arts/MSHS...Procedures.pdf
vs.
AZ rules: http://www.aiaonline.org/files/14680...de-2014-15.pdf

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I hope they drop the Bag and Tag requirement. Its technically classified as an "Off-Season event" right? Its after Nationals. A co-worker of mine (AZ FRC Judge and Mentor) has sent in an email regarding this requirement to them. We shall see.

It just seems weird to have it as a Bag and Tag, as I know our team has done some outreaches after the AZ Regional, where we like to use the newest robot if we aren't advancing to Nationals.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

If so, then the rules concerning "Who is the champions" are probably very similar-- I know in MN any FRC team, including those not associated with a school or associated with multiple schools, are eligible for the State Championship-- and if they win, it's that team that's recorded as having won, not the schools that they're from (of course, most schools are in the team name, so they're recorded, but that isn't the emphasis).

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Congratulations! That is the second state that I know of that recognizes robotics as a sport. The other one is Minnesota.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I do find it odd that the State Championship has to be a bag and tag event. As far as demoing the robot, that's not a problem. Also...Gregor has been summed, escape while you still can.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I don't.

Championship is bag-and-tag, albeit with the bag in the crate. Why? To make it a lot more difficult to cheat the schedule. (Or, alternatively, so everybody is on an even playing field with respect to time working on their robot.)

It makes sense, if you want to compete on a level(ish) playing field, to require bagging the robot until the event starts. I believe MN has done this, as have other similar types of events, though whether that's current or not I don't know.