Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

The Arizona Interscholastic Association recognizes robotics as a sport in Arizona! We were lucky enough to have been chosen to be present when they made the announcement. We also got to deliver the game ball and the silver dollar for the coin toss. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9BV...ature=youtu.be
How do you like that Dean and Woodie?AZ became the second state after Minnesota to do this! Its nice that AZ is not last for a change in something! There is nothing wrong with your sound there was no sound with the video. There was idle chit chat so I decided not to put it.
Extremely honored to have been chosen to be there for this!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Congrats you guys!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Very nice! Congratulations.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Great job!! Keep up the success through the season because I cant wait to see another great robot from falcon robotics.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Congrats!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Congrats, AZ!
Maybe someday I won't be laughed at for calling robotics a sport. Someday...

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Is that an inside joke?

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Awesome news!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Just to clarify, we did not have anything to do with robotics becoming a sport other than advocating for it like many other teams in AZ did. We were asked to be present during the announcement and were very honored to do so. Science Foundation Arizona is the group that made this possible with the AIA.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

We are near last in student expenditure, we are ranked near last in education, near last in adopting MLK as a holiday..... its nice to be high up in rank for something nice for a change...

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

That's cool. Is this the first step to organizing a state championship like Minnesota? What benefits does this come with?

I looked a little bit into doing this in the state of Oregon with our local sports sanctioning group (the OSAA) but I wasn't sure that I should since the benfits were unclear and they had some extra rules that you had to comply with. I'd love to hear your experience both with how this benefits teams and how hard the process was.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

MORE ROBOTS!!!!

ROBOTS EVERYWHERE!!!!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Congrats AZ! Maybe this will help more state high school leagues realize that this truly is a sport!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Is the title of this thread correct? Did "robotics" become a sport, or did the AIA decide to sanction a state tournament for FRC? There is a big difference. FRC is just a single program among many.

"Robotics", in this context, encompasses a broad spectrum of inspirational and educational programs supplying a wide variety of opportunities to students (with/without school involvement) with diverse financial, organizational, educational support/backgrounds.

If anyone gets a chance, please inform the AIA, and the people of Arizona, about all of the "robotics" opportunities they have to do good for their communities.

Don't fall into the trap of FRC tunnel-vision. Instead, perhaps, celebrate this announcement as the first of what will hopefully be many more (for FTC, VRC, FLL, VIQ, BEST, Botball, etc.)???

Blake

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

This is wicked cool! Is this mostly a "symbolic" victory, or does it confer some sort of specific benefits to robotics teams in the state (i.e. the can hang banners in gyms, have access to more school facilities, easier funding process etc.)?

Congratulations to the parties involved!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Congratulations! now to get it recognized:D in every state!

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

So far, I only know that we will be able to get varsity letters and jackets. Other than that, I am not sure.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

The state of Connecticut, though the CIAC (Connecticut Interscholastic Athletic Association) has also recognized Robotics as a high school sport:
http://www.firstct.org/news-events/c...-championship/

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I found this article that makes it sound like its only FRC and not all robotics.
http://www.aia365.com/articles/4644/...tics-is-coming

From this and what happened with UIL in Texas this summer it seems like HQ is lobbying state interscholastic leagues to make FRC tournaments like MN has.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

It is only FRC. The FTC side hasn't heard a thing from them.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

OK - So I'm going to be a bit of a broken record here... I know I seem overly grumpy but, dang it, it's so easy to get this sort of thing right. As a community we need to avoid wearing FRC or FIRST blinders.

These announcements are that FRC state championships are going to be endorsed/sanctioned by state bureaucracies. These are not announcements that "robotics" is an official / high school sport. FRC is not the end-all, be-all, of "robotics". FRC is an excellent part of "robotics"; but it is only one part of "robotics"; and by several measures it is not the even the biggest or best part of "robotics".

If "robotics" did equal FRC, and FRC alone, FIRST (and I as someone who has invested hundreds of hours in FIRST's success) would have failed. The cultural shift FIRST seeks can not be gotten by only forming FRC infrastructures. Many would argue quite effectively that FRC infrastructures should be put into place only after other programs' infrastructures exist to create a solid foundation for FRC activities....

Switching gears a bit - This is both excellent news on many levels, and maybe not so good news of a few others.

Some of the things to consider are that:

• Team membership rules created by the states are probably going to slowly start to encrust the FRC events governed by these organizations, and then effect student participation in the teams.
• Many/all aspects of Mentor and volunteer participation in the teams that compete in these events) are probably going to slowly start to be affected/governed by the state organizations sanctioning these events.
• Expect that state rules and regulations will begin to creep into determining when and where teams may do their business (activities like building the FRC robot).
• Expect a constant low-level of confusion about how non-school FRC teams participate in state championships (and the events that feed into to them). FRC teams usually are associated in some way with a single school, but that definitely isn't required or always true; and it certainly isn't true for other, popular, non-FRC, robotics programs that also deserve our best efforts.
• Etc.

To exaggerate a bit to make a point, let me quote Mark Twain, “No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session.”

To sum up: Please, please embrace (and ensure your actions reflect) the fact that neither FRC, nor FIRST, nor any other single STEM program is the right "robotics" solution for the entire culture we seek to change; and be careful what you wish for, because you just might get it.

Blake

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Maybe I have too strong of a libertarian streak in me, but I think that maybe I would be happier seeing headlines that joyfully announce something like this:

"Popular, affordable and inspirational, grass-roots, student-robotics competition(s) avoid(s) entanglement in government bureaucracy, and remains free to continue charting its own course."

Think about it....

Blake

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Good to hear!! Hopefully soon, robotics will be viewed and treated as a sport nationally and internationally

News stoy on NPR affiliate KJZZ
 

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I can't speak for the AIA but I can say that it is a great step. As far I as I know it is FRC, they are concentrating on high school right now. As the popularity grows and everyone become used to the idea I am sure it will include more robotics categories just like there are many different sports. rather than looking at this as for what it is missing, try looking at it for what is there. It's a start! Let run with it. I agree that FRC is not everything, in fact we, TEAM 842, know this to be true. We also do AUVSI Robosub and NURC.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Fredi,

Can you point us to any material or narratives about HOW this was accomplished? It think making an example road map available would give other areas some ideas about how to undertake the process. Who were the principles actors, who were the champions, what were the challenges and how were they resolved?

Congratulations!
Sam Geckler
Mentor
#4926

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

We have an organization in AZ that is called Science Foundation Arizona, http://www.sfaz.org/, that we have been in contact with for many years. We send them updates on what we are doing and other teams are doing in the state. After many years of watching what robotics can do and seeing teams struggle for recognition and funding they thought they would lean on the AIA to consider it. The AIA went on a trip to Minnesota to check out what they had there and were blown away! They decided that they wanted that for Arizona and here we are. They also consulted with FIRST before implementing the plan. So basically keep blowing your own horn and the horn for others to who ever may have any political sway to move the powers that be. Invite them to your school and show them what you can do. Let them see the kids excited. Send the all the press coverage to them. Invite them to tournaments. anything you can think of to engage them. The more teams that band together to do this with the help of your regional FRC directors the better. Ours RD was very active in providing info and pushing forward the agenda with Science Foundation AZ and the AIA. Does that help? Let me know if you need more detail

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/...tion/19811795/

from the state paper

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I should hope this is an >inside< joke cause <outside> in some parts of Arizona is not so funny hot :)

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I think it is in reference to the MLK holiday.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Among other things, both real and perceived.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

One really fascinating part of the endorsement was the AIA's comment about robotics being the only sport that will be allowed to solicit/accept donations from the private sector. I am just a little skeptical that the average school district's liability insurance for a football season (much less salaries.stipends for a head coach and multiple assistant coachs) is less than the $6K it takes to start an FRC team. If we could get football assistant coach stipends for robotics mentors, we'd have a math teacher and a graphics arts teacher involved (and I'd be in the stands cheering).

The Olympics gave up the farce of "amateur athletes" some years ago, Let's leave the highest tier of the NCAA as the last bastion of that non-profit (for the grunts involved) foolishness. FIRST has always been about growing into the real, business, profit seeking world. As a high school "sport" it can be the best start we give the students, with competition that will be, as opposed to artificial demonstrations based physical endowment, where those who cooperate, think and do, even the potentially totally physically incapacitated (op cit Steven Hawking), exceed their own expectations, and blow the rest of us away.

The Arizona high school sports authority made an extraordinary step, along with Minnesota and Connecticut. We must build on this.

Unfortunately for the other worthy robotics programs, FRC is probably the best way to go right now at the high school level. It takes a basketball court sized endeavor to capture people's attention. 6x120lbs of robot running around on that size field is probably the minimum it takes to get the world involved.

Let's work for a proper set of district competitions, where the incremental cost of additional events is not 80% of the first, but 10%, so that everyone gets a couple of shots at glory.

Tim

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

That's Amazing! :yikes:

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Hey Ledge,

I have been watching this develop all year long now....And, while it is always great that Robotics is getting the recognition early on in our Great State (we all know we are usually last in line for major AZ State changes).

And, I don't want to be a "Debby or Danny Downer" whatsoever, but we are a huge mixture State of Larger Big Cities like "The Valley of the Sun", & Tucson, and a whole lot of smaller rural towns across our big tall & wide State...I know what it means in the larger 3 metro areas (comprising the majority of the teams in the State for sure, & that is why we could not ask the questions early on). But, I have been asking what it means for longstanding 22 yr. FIRST Community wide teams like ours, or even new rookie teams from the Rural Areas of our Great State also that may pr. up to create a team.

Our Specific Example...We are a 22 yr. FIRST FRC Team (60), our specific team is a Community wide team, made up of Students from 3 different High Schools -2 from HS's in the Kingman Unified District, 1 from Kingman Academy of Learning HS, and covering 2 different School districts (1 Public, 1 Public Charter), and we also invite Home Schooled children in the area to also join our Community Team. (The AIA has specific rules concerning that last bunch, very specific rules too, we recently found out...Home Schoolers playing on Public school sports teams or clubs, though I heard maybe they ironed those out a bit lately, or are doing so).

When we win, our Whole Community wins! (When we play the game, our whole community plays the game). So, let us say (though I have another question right here...State Championships AIA, 30 teams from each AZ Regional held qualify? Or Top 30 from both regionals 15/15? Do you know that answer?....The background didn't make for real easy reading), OK, back to the thing I have been trying to get answered as it relates directly to our specific Community team.....Let's say we do qualify, and we are blessed with winning the State Championships...Are all 3 of our Team consisted High Schools, now Combined State Champions? (A big question that begs an answer...Just in case...Or do we flip a coin or draw straws?)

We do have 3 different Robotics Clubs, at those 3 High Schools, and another Home schooled Club...But they all belong to FIRST TEAM 60 "The Bionic Bulldogs" when it comes to FRC. FTC or Lego Robotics are still under the banner of "The Bionic Bulldogs" and their individual team numbers, Kingman, AZ (One big happy family, inseperable as an entity).

I cannot see how this is going to fit the AIA rules easily. (All 3 schools are AIA members now though also. The Charter District use to be a member of another Charter School Athletic Assoc., no longer so).

I'll go one step further...Do to location and semantics, and dollars of course (Our team chose this year only, to do as usual, 1 AZ Regional, and 1 NV Regional back-to-back, those choices were made before the AIA final announcement of course...& also, the students made that choice based on our location (Vegas is an hour closer to us than PHX, is all, and we have longstanding donated church lodging in both places we really appreciate year in year out, hard to ask 1 twice in a few weeks in PHX is all to put us up again, and risk losing the other in later years also)...Will that only attending 1 AZ Regional, have a bearing on possibly qualifying for the State Tournament?

I hope asking important questions "to us" does not look like a selfish attitude, it isn't really (am trying to speak for many rural teams in the State, and many we hope to come in the future)...I would just like to know what the rules roadmap is before we reach a summit or crossroads, if possible, not after.

Our specific Community Team (which originally grew out of 1 High School Team, whose membership over the years dwindled a bit to lower membership long ago, then Team 60 "The Bionic Bulldogs" went Community wide), has been in this ever changing game way too long, and all the Students it impacts, deserve to know what road we specifically are on today, and in the years to come, with the AIA Recognition. (Overall a great positive AIA move!)

Though, any exposure and recognition for ROBOTICS in AZ is great for the entire Robotics Community at large, and FIRST also as a whole, along with other Robotics organizations, teams, classes, etc! (Our specific High Schools recognized Letters in Robotics a number of years back....But, AIA rules are different concerning Lettering in Recognized AIA Sports, though).

We just see many questions, few answers yet (though we will be patient & kind as the kinks for a few may be ironed out). Just personal observations, and I know you were just touting the Good News here, and are not the go to guy, for the answers to our specific problems.

The News is certainly great for you and those others in the major metro areas of AZ, having sole single High School Teams, and I think it is great news for you and us together. I just hope it does not lead to other issues, I can see happening on the horizon.

if you do know the sources for any of said answers...Please share. OK?:D

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Hey Tim...If you started an FRC Team w/ only 6K...I need to sit with you and pick your brain a little please. While that may register you for an FRC Kit OP and a Team number, and recognize your Team as a member of FIRST ROBOTICS (FRC)...That is only the very rock bottom beginning my friend. You might be under the umbrella, but, you certainly are not out of the money rain.

Pennies from heaven! Please...lots of pennies from heaven.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Personal opinion only...Our State is not necessarily too small (But for some of us Too Spread out), for Proper Districts yet (except in the Central & lower half of the State of course)....We, The Bionic Bulldogs Team #60 would probably either play The Coconuts Team #2486 in our District, and the winner would head to PHX (or 1 sent to 1 district, 1 to another). Those are the only 2 currently true operating teams as of last year (FRC), in the whole entire top half of the State. (And that is a huge area, of relatively smaller populations). There was another northern AZ rookie team formed & registered last year, but they were no shows at Regional for some unknown reason (and I just checked, not on either E or W AZ Regional list this year)...We tried really hard though.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

It will certainly be interesting to learn the answers to cglrcng's questions. They involve exactly the sorts of bureaucratic rules that I was writing about in my earlier post.

I'll repeat this sentiment too: It appears that folks interacting with the the athletics organizations, and with the media, aren't graciously ensuring that FRC is clearly identified as the FIRST Robotics program, one of many robotics programs; instead of as "robotics". To me it seems a bit rude and misleading to implicitly dismiss all the other programs (both non-FIRST and FIRST).

I am curious whether anyone involved in these states is attempting to make this important distinction clear to the athletics organizations, or to the media?

This good news, "The AIA went on a trip to Minnesota to check out what they had there and were blown away! " makes me wonder how much *more* they were blown away when they found out what was going on at the Minnesota FRC State Championship was an example of only one of the successful, popular, growing, high-energy, worldwide, robotics programs. What did they say when they were told that?

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

congrats

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

More information on the State Championship. Specifically, we now know how the top 30 teams will be selected. It is determined by using the district point system to rank teams, with some modifications.

http://www.aiaonline.org/activities/robotics

Also notable, the State Championship is a bag and tag event.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Looks like the AZ model was lifted pretty much with minimal (if any) change from the MN model.

See

MN rules: http://www.mshsl.org/mshsl/arts/MSHS...Procedures.pdf
vs.
AZ rules: http://www.aiaonline.org/files/14680...de-2014-15.pdf

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I hope they drop the Bag and Tag requirement. Its technically classified as an "Off-Season event" right? Its after Nationals. A co-worker of mine (AZ FRC Judge and Mentor) has sent in an email regarding this requirement to them. We shall see.

It just seems weird to have it as a Bag and Tag, as I know our team has done some outreaches after the AZ Regional, where we like to use the newest robot if we aren't advancing to Nationals.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

If so, then the rules concerning "Who is the champions" are probably very similar-- I know in MN any FRC team, including those not associated with a school or associated with multiple schools, are eligible for the State Championship-- and if they win, it's that team that's recorded as having won, not the schools that they're from (of course, most schools are in the team name, so they're recorded, but that isn't the emphasis).

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Congratulations! That is the second state that I know of that recognizes robotics as a sport. The other one is Minnesota.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I do find it odd that the State Championship has to be a bag and tag event. As far as demoing the robot, that's not a problem. Also...Gregor has been summed, escape while you still can.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I don't.

Championship is bag-and-tag, albeit with the bag in the crate. Why? To make it a lot more difficult to cheat the schedule. (Or, alternatively, so everybody is on an even playing field with respect to time working on their robot.)

It makes sense, if you want to compete on a level(ish) playing field, to require bagging the robot until the event starts. I believe MN has done this, as have other similar types of events, though whether that's current or not I don't know.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

In Georgia, i don't think its an official sport, but it might be close to one, because my friend said that our team has varsity and letters and other stuff associated to sports and other activities. But I doubt it's considered a sport. It's like the state of quiz bowl. Texas considers it a sport (they're the best at it), but in other states its just a game or activity (I think it's a mental sport).

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

MN State Championship is indeed a bag and tag event, and I would hazard to guess it will remain so regardless of being after the FRC season or during it (as a District Championship).

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I agree. Personally though, I would love an unbagging period for Arizona teams that are not going to championship to work on their robot.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

I haven't read your rules, but MN does an 8-hour unbag period between a team's last official competition and the State Championship. If you guys don't have it in your rules it's definitely a good thing and I'd recommend it going forward.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

There is a robot access period. But, under the current wording, it applies to all teams, including world championship teams.

I suppose the date of the State Championship (May 23) is close enough to the World Championship that teams who advance to world have a disadvantage over teams who didn't advance. As they would lose 2-3 weeks of time because their robot is sitting in a crate (plus some other variances that could add more time to the 2-3 weeks). But, that world team also has 4(ish) days of access to their robot at Championship, along with competition drive time, which in invaluable.

2-3 extra build weeks or 4(ish) days of world championship time. which is more valuable? I imagine a large majority would choose the first option.

So, with the date of State too close to World, It does make sense to bag and tag if you want to "level" the playing field. But, what if State was pushed forward one month to June 23, would it still be worth having everyone bag? What difference of time between World and State is considered enough time to not bag the robot? (I'm by no means suggesting the date should be moved, I like where it is now, it's just a thought).

I guess the reason I found it odd initially was this State Championship is still technically an off-season event, with no actual season advantage to winning, it doesn't qualify your team for anything, you just win bragging rights (and maybe a blue banner?).

It all comes down to the question of how seriously you want to take the event. And with the title "Arizona State Championship" It's obviously implied that it is to be a serious event.

Re: Robotics becomes official sport in Arizona!
 

Hey folks,

I find myself more confused, the more I read this thread.

Are various states simply recognizing that the FRC program is going to declare some teams FRC state champions (in this case FRC rules, such as FRC's bag-and-tag restrictions, are important);
... Or
Are states creating a competition system for students who design/build/integrate/test robots (in this case the FRC rules about bagging, practicing with, reprogramming, etc. robots are irrelevant (because the states will have rules for their non-FRC, state, robotics competitions)).

Are these State Championships run/governed by the states; or are they FRC Championships run/governed by FIRST, and simply acknowledged by the states?

I'm certain many people consider my posts in this thread less than helpful due to my desire for clarity before enthusiasm, but ... Questions like this should be easy to answer, and should have been answered in the initial descriptions of what is occurring. Gracious professionals *do not* gloss over these topics.

Blake