Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Hello Everyone! Happy Pre-kickoff season!

I would like to introduce you to a new modular control board system tailored to the needs of FRC Teams.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_UQ4ymBXSo

The system is deemed the "T811" in honor of the chairmans-award-winning team that got me hooked onto FIRST during high school.



The system works with two parts: "cells" and "mounts"



Cells:
-interlocks with one another via a lip and notch system
-bolts to robot with 1/4x20 bolts
-streamlined to reduce weight
-each cell has a built in lock down system for 2 anderson powerpole connectors



Mounts:
-bolts to: RoboRio, PDB, PCM, Voltage regulator, old talon, new talon, new victor, spike relay, breaker switch
-bolt hole have nut retainers for ease of use
-quickly and easily clips into cell parts (tool-less) (with experience, can be done with one hand)
-streamlined to reduce weight
-four corner slots allow wires to reach sublevel

Once clipped together, a small gap forms called the "wiring sublevel". This sublevel allows you to route your wires underneath your board. Wires are protected and neatly concealed, giving a very clean look to your board that didn't take hours of slaving with zipties.

For more info, head to my website: http://t811modulus.com/

MSRP is $90 for a kit of 60 parts total (which satisfies the needs of most robots)
Preorder now on my site to guarantee a kit for your team this year.
AndyMark will also be distributing kits.
Check out my special rebate offer to get $15 off (under blog posts).

The system was designed by a FRC student for FRC teams and their needs and goals. Such as:

-Easy modularity while prototyping or making design changes during build

-No more sticking hardware "where it fits", because sometimes it just doesn't
fit (and what kind of engineering lesson is that?). Students can now easily plan out their board on pad and paper or use CAD.

-Addressing the need to make wiring easier for rookie teams.

-Remember seeing a team miss a match because they had to replace a hardware piece? During bracket matches you barely have time to go to your pit. With the T811 you can replace a motor controller in under two minutes without having to use tools.

-Strategic teams design robots that can be modified to different match strategies (did you see Einstein last year?!?). A modular control board makes it easy to mechanically adapt robots legally between matches.

As FRC teams we have standards for robots mechanically. It's why we have chassis kits:the basic standard. We also have coding standards: the WPI libraries and etc. Now there is a wiring standard: the T811.

Like Modulus on facebook for updates: https://www.facebook.com/ModulusLLC?ref=hl

Thank you for taking the time to read this. Thank you to the mentors who made this possible.

Feel free to ask questions or post comments here. Good luck this year teams!

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

This looks awesome!

How does a full board set up effect weight? Essentially, how much weight does the "average" set up weigh? Also is there a cad up online that we can gain access to?

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Good questions.

Weight: I cannot give an official weight until I receive final parts from my manufacturer.

Based off my 3D printed samples, using a full kit on a robot would add less than 4lbs to the bot.
*Side note: I believe we are losing almost 5lbs this year with the hardware updates if you were using older hardware
*FIX. I am a little rusty on the exact weights

Working to get the CAD up on the site, but here is what will be released:

https://grabcad.com/library/modulus-t811-1

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Great concept. I have a few questions:
What is the material used?
Is it 3D printed? (I ask because you can see the raster lines in the video, but could be a prototype of the final product) For mass production would a different manufacturing technique be cheaper/more efficient? Think injection molds.
What is the individual weight for each, cell and mount?
Why such a large fastener size? Why not provide a #6 (or similar) clearance hole as a pilot if teams need to use something larger. For the weight of the components, a 1/4" screw is way overkill. In the game of pounds, ounces matter.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

10 lbs?!?!?. That seems a bit much... The cRio-frc II is listed at about 22 oz per the official spec from NI, less than 2 lbs. Even with the modules and digital sidecar, I don't know how your going to get a 10 lbs reduction.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Correct, the samples in the video are 3d printed. Those are PLA (not safe to print ABS in my dorm :) )

The final parts are being injected molded and will be ABS. So the finish will be far superior.

ABS is what was used on an older version of the system on team 811's robot last year. It worked very well. The right amount of flex for the clips. Plenty sturdy.

I don't have a scale to measure my parts but this is what I base my estimations off of.

There are ~330 meters in a 1 kg spool of 3d printing plastic.
Printing a cell takes me 8.5 meters with support
Printing a cell takes me 10 meters to print with support

A final cell should be less than 0.03 kg or 0.066lbs.
A final mount should be less than .045 kg or 0.1lbs.

This is calculated with PLA, which is slightly denser than ABS.

I hope that answers the weight question.

I did an early poll with about 30 teams. The majority of teams preferred the larger bolt which was also easier to use with a peg board. The way the lip system works we only had to bolt down every other cell last year, which was actually close to overkill.

My opinion on it was that if teams are diligent about weight at the beginning with a similar concern level to yours, then they will unlikely have a problem with the weight of 15 1/4x20 nuts and bolts.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Good call. I was off. I remember hearing a while back that if you were using the original crio, digital sidecar and other old hardware you could shed up to 10lbs by the 2015 hardware. In reflection I believe 2012 to 2015 difference is around 5 lbs. However I may still be slightly off with that.

I edited my response.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

How does this work with the new motor controllers?

Talon SRX
Victor SP

Both of these have a significantly different footprint and needs for wires to exit at the ends of the speed controller.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

I think that it's more in the neighborhood of a 2 lb savings.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

I agree 1/4-20 sounds like overkill in this situation but you could probably use much lighter and cheaper plastic (nylon) bolts in this situation. I believe the reason he could not design to have a drilled out hole is because there is a nut capture hex indent that matches a 1/4-20 nut.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

I'd love to see how well these works with the new Talon SRX and Victor SP speed controllers. Those are a different form factor and also use their entire body as the heat sink. I don't know if they'll get so hot as to melt the ABS (105 C) but it may soften it.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Boy, that video. I like it :)

I would love to see some of this hooked up in various configurations with the new control system though. Lots of possibilities.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Here's what they look like with the new motor controller. The wiring is a little different but should function fundamentally the same.

If the hardware is getting so hot that its softening the ABS I would say there are likely other issues occurring.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Luke,
I am impressed, nice job!
Al

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Does it seem possible to mount two controllers to one board? You might lose some of the air space for heat control, but the space savings might be worthwhile.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

The reason this wasn't built-in was because you can only drill so many holes in the places you want them. On top of that when you decide to do it this way, it becomes harder to route the wires below because it blocks the channels.

BUT.... the 811 is an adaptable system. You want something to fit? Drill new holes or make an adapter plate. They are pretty simple to make and are great intro CAD/machining/3D printing projects for new students.

The picture attached is just to show that you can fit two per part.

I will release CAD so that teams can 3D print/manufacture these motor controller adapter plate.

They will work by:
1. drop in the nuts for bolting to mount
2. bolt the hard ware pieces on top (this capture the previous nuts)
3. bolt to mount through holes already in the mount for some other hardware (lots of options)

easy peasy :D

If your team doesn't have 3D printing/manufacturing resources I am happy to help work something out.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

What about using Jaguars with this?

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

I bought it! I think it's a great idea! I'll make sure to let everyone at the Midwest regional know how well it works.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

I was about to be all snarky and say "what problem is this solving that DIN rail doesn't already"...

...and then I saw the sub-level wiring channel. Take my money.

PS - Have you considered making "vertical mount" modules? You could probably get two victors (or 4 of the new design) onto a single module if they were supported "on edge".

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Due to the Jaguars large foot print and uncertainty in current lifespan, it was not incorporated into the built in bolting options.

I hope the attached images help justify this decision.

It is possible to create adapter plates to fit 2 jaguars on 4 cells.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Thank you for your order! I look forward to your feedback!

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

At the top of the page you can see how to easily fit 2 new controllers onto 1 mount.

I think the attached image shows what you are trying to describe.

Issue #1: Wires extending out of the bottom create slight wiring complexities and add required height. A possible work around would be do drill out holes for routing the wires immediately to the sub-level.

Issue #2: Coupling 4 controllers like this so close can create heat problems. Its possible to use heat shielding or insulating. But this is at your own risk and should contact Vex or CRE before trying this.

Issue #3: Wiring all those wires can become complex.

Still doable. Proposed alternative to better use the 3rd spacial dimension:
In the videos you can see how to double the Cells back to back.
-Mount 12 cells in a 2x3 grid back to back.
-On one side mount the Power Distribution Panel to 6 cells. (or whatever you want)
-On the other side mount up to 12 of the new motor controllers, or whatever the robot needs/your heart desires.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Wow Luke! Thanks for sharing totally a great idea!

The more I think about this the more of an internal dilemma I face with the "one-size fits all" against the "customized to the max"... ultimately the trade-off is time and money (typical of a lot of things I suppose).

I guess if the BOM doesn't fit the budget print something custom... otherwise if BOM can fit and you need time (don't we all)... this may be the way to go. Thanks for the new option! :)

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Do you already have the molds? :-/ Those can easily be $100,000 per, and it looks like you'll need two of them. Have you worked with anyone who has done injection molding before? Because you can't directly translate from a 3D printed part. For example, vertical sides are very difficult to achieve with injection molding, so you generally use about a 1 degree angle on all sides (check out the CAD file for the roboRIO if you don't believe me). There are also quite a few other things to be wary of.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

The two cavity mold is being machined currently and will be finished within the next two weeks.

I've received a more than decent amount of guidance from several very experienced mentors. One of them ensured I was setup with a trustworthy molding company. He also made sure that my designs were optimized for mold injection and walked me through it. The part is properly drafted and cored out for wall thicknesses associated with part cooling.

This same mentor organized the 3D printing award last year and is a large part the reason we are seeing more 3D printing in FIRST. :yikes:

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Update 12.13.14:

Here's a picture of part of the molds machined. Still some work to do. I will be visiting the shop at the end of the week for part approval and paperwork. I'll get some more pictures for everyone then.

Thanks!

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

The cost of mold making has come down in price significantly over the last decade. You can do a full set of molds for this size part for 15-20k. Also depending on the molder he is using you could just do a family tool for both parts in a single mold, to reduce the cost even farther. Even less if you go to asia instead of domestically. You can save even more if you choose aluminum molds for low quantities (less than 5,000 pieces) as the machining time is much less.

You are actually looking at a pretty good designed part for plastic, as it uses some of the best tricks to reduce the cost, large draft angles, using shut offs to create hols instead of slides, fairly constant wall thickness, and generous radius in the corners. I would say luke has it all under control and I look forward to seeing these in action.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Hi Everyone!

Sorry that I've been quite recently. Spent a solid week devoted to tackling my first college finals and driving from Center County Pennsylvania to Arkansas City Kansas.

Anyway, the trip has certainly paid off already by being able to see the molds and check out one of the facilities.

Ladies, Gentleman, Robots a like....I would like to present you the molds:

Everything together:



Base of Cell:


Top of the Cell:



Base of Mount (even though you see the lines from cutting, I guarantee that it is all extremely smooth and flat):



Top of Mount:

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

This would have made our lives so much easier last year on 4464. Purchased a set, and will try to convince other teams I know to do the same.

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Awesome to hear! Our year before this system was actually pretty rough from a wiring perspective. Too much magic smoke haha ::ouch::
Make sure to go for the rebate if you get another team to order.

Also, here are some picture to prove that the system actually bolts to hardware. The pieces are all 3D printed, but still pretty accurate representations.

New Motor controllers:


Spike:


Talon:


PCM:

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

VCM:


PDB simplified:


Roborio simplified:

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Here are some pictures of the first run of cells!

Army man green won't be the final color, but its cool to see no doubt.

Apologies on quality. Was really excited :D

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Happy Holidays Everyone!

I asked a close friend of mine on Team 811 to write a testimonial of the T811 System. Sam was the wiring lead last year and was very involved with its development and actually has the most experience using the system out of everyone. She is the wiring lead again this year and a Junior on Team 811.

Unfortunately she hasn't really gotten into CD yet so she doesn't have an account to post:

"My name is Samantha Beauchemin. I am currently the Wiring Lead for FRC Team 811. During my 3 years on the team, organization of my wiring has always been my top priority, a focus not always shared with my predecessors. Before the creation of the T811, Team 811’s control boards were messy, disorganized, and confusing. Wires were tangled and unlabeled, creating a tangled mess of wires and PWM’s. I hope to improve these messy habits and clean up the wiring during my time on the team.

Wiring my first robot was not exactly my best work. Though still a significant improvement over the previous year, it still was a mess of coiled wires and scattered components. Making repairs was especially difficult, because once the board was in the robot, many parts became virtually inaccessible. Those that were accessible were held down by so many zip ties, that a simple repair became a twenty minute project. By the end of the season, I became fed up with blindly reaching into the robot to find the part I was trying to repair. I advocated for a more modular board, ideally one that could fully detach from the robot in order to make repairs easier for both the mechanical and wiring sub-teams.

Coming into my second year on the team, I continued to advocate for a modular control board. This was around the same time that Luke Yost fell in love with 3D printing. He found a brilliant way to connect our high priorities: the T811. He began designing several versions of the mount system, coming to me each time asking for more suggestions. I was thrilled at the idea of a routing system for the wires rather than just using zip ties. Finally Luke finished the final design and began printing and replicating it. Though printing the parts took a significant amount of time, it was worth it in the end. The T811 cut the timing of producing a neat and efficient control board in half. It allowed for increased modularity, productivity, and adaptability, along with allowing me to create the most presentable control board my team has seen.

The T811 has significantly improved the practicality of the control board. It allows us to organize components into a set area, encouraging neat, labeled wires and components. It has given us the ability to maintain neatness while still adapting to the changing needs of the robot. It also allows us to overcome space difficulties, because its increased modularity allows for two boards or even a double sided control board. The cell system also significantly improves timing, taking far less time to initially organize and allowing for speedy repairs in the pits. If necessary we can also use extra mounts with pre-wired components to allow for instant repairs. Another benefit of the T811, though not originally intended, was a decrease in electrical malfunctions. In past years, many problems occurred as the season progressed due to the disorganized fashion of the wiring. The T811 has significantly less room for error, contributing to a decrease in electrical malfunctions.

Overall, the T811 has significantly contributed to a neater, more professional, more efficient, and more effective control board that can adapt as needed. It is something that has been a focal point of our robot and brought our team lots of attention. The ease of use gives us more time to focus on other priorities and has significantly improved our design and prototyping process. Now that I have used the T811, I couldn’t imagine going back to the messy wiring that we had before, and team 811 plans on using it for many years to come."

Re: Introducing a New Modular Control Board System
 

Very, very nice job.