Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

I don't see anyone pointing this out. Frank has mentioned the same thing in the past. See: http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprogr...g-New-for-2015

So, this hint is not new, just reworded from "something new" to "Change is coming"

FRC teams may experience a big enough change that he feels it should be said twice . . . or the video is more cryptic ;)

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

What you just described is a brand new game. New goals, new game piece, new match setup. That is already what they do and I personally like it that way. Plus, you can't use last years robot or any assembly built before kick off. Unless that rule changes too but I don't think that would happen.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

I suppose. In my mind, though, Aerial Assist is a game which is played with a single game piece that's passed around between the alliance before being scored at the opposite end of the field; the rest of the rules are just details.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

Do you have a source to FIRST approving this field?

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

I totally agree.
Maybe I shouldnt say this. Rumors from last season said that the truss was part of ............;)

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

If we see any big parts of Aerial Assist "recycled", wouldn't it be in 2-3 years being how long it takes to fully develop a game?

Maybe this is why they said change is coming, specifically showing the 2014 manual. Perhaps we won't see (major) assisting or no end game this year because by the time they knew if it was a successful venture, the 2015 game was already in major development.

Are there really coincidences in the game hints, I mean how could they accidentally put the wrong video for 1999? We have been shooting projectiles for three years in a row, if we go to a fourth most FRC students won't have experienced anything but shooting. 1997 and 1999 both included inner tube type objects- so we might be seeing a very heavily modified version of the past inner tube games.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

It's right there in the link.
From http://www.andymark.com/Field-p/am-2800.htm :

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

16 pages in five hours... on three words.
Huh.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

If we look at both the 1997 game and the 1999 game, the objectives were fairly similar. Raise the game piece to a great height. In 97 big points were received for placing the toroid (an inner tube) on the top peg. In 99 a lot of points were received for raising "floppies", another tube-like game piece, over 8 feet in the air. Going off of that, and the thought that FIRST wouldn't send out a game hint with an error in it, I would guess that we are lifting a tube-like object high off the ground.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

The paper clip represents those who hold everything together: refs.

Paper recycling plants remove paper clips.

Here's the catch - not all paper clips are always removed.

Frank is recycling the 2014 game (and the very visible paper clip) completely - no changes at all, we get to play aerial assist again (prolly).

But this time around, there will be half as many referees (or no refs) on the field for efficiency.

Cant wayt fo 2015 the yere of the sheep

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

Emphasis on robot size and weight increases, alliances including more robots, and a different field surface and shape.

Also hinting that the majority of the rules are different from last year by throwing away the game manual (ok yes he threw it in the recycling but that is what he would have done anyways if the recycling part had nothing to do with the hint).

Subtle hint that 1999 wasn't worth showing. 1999 was quite a bit different than any other game in first, the game pieces were floppy and a lot harder to pick up than any other game piece that I can think of.

The side rails of the field that Frank was on was almost waist high, much higher than previous years.

Give me until the 3rd of next year and I'll have figured it out by then.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

FIRST has already tinkered and changed those things. I think something will change that hasn't been changed before; possibly drastically. If it IS one of those things, I can imagine it being something like completely getting rid of the robot weight requirement. However, I'm not sure how likely it is. Also, let's not forget that several well-established rules could drastically change.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

Then the game name will have something to do with change? I wonder how the showing of previous years could fit in with that.

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

Could the reference to "Change" be as simple as sorting game pieces based on size or color like sorting change? Still could leave open for shooting or picking up and placing. If the 1997 and 1999 video repeat was not a mistake, it was based on placing game pieces. Add into this the new linear actuators that iR3 has come out with along with the linear actuator that was in First Choice, could support a pick and sort type of game. I also find it interesting FTC's game is "Cascade Effect" which if you have a change sorter, they have a "cascade effect" when sorting. Has FIRST ever had similar games between FRC and FTC in the same year?

Re: 2015 HINT DISCUSSION
 

I do not believe the GDC will re-use the 2014 game because:
1. It would be SO boring, even with a major change, and if they are going to make a major change they might as well call it a new game
2. Huge advantage for veterans (again unless there was a major change but again that would just be called a new challenge
3. They already returned the trusses to whatever company they rented them from, someone said this earlier in the thread I forget where

If we follow the pattern of the past 3 years' challenges:
2012: shooting round balls, easy to pick up/manipulate/shoot
2013: shooting frisbees, harder to pick up/manipulate, still easy to shoot
2014: shooting massive ball with tons of drag, much more difficult
2015: shooting some object that is oddly shaped, hard to pick up and shoot, a football, maybe a football challenge, my team (3941) has been discussing this idea for about a month now

However there is something to be said for having 4 years of shooting in a row. This does mean people like me (in their senior year) will have had a shooting challenge every year in FRC, Do you think the GDC would think it was bad to have all shooting challenges and try to mix it up? Or keep what was working in the past regardless of the lack of variety?

Now looking at the hint. I believe the footage mix-up for the 1997 and 1999 challenges was not a mistake, definitely something there. Also I believe there might be a hint in the scores of the matches, however would FIRST have enough footage to search through to find specific numbers for the beginning games? Probably not, however they definitely have enough footage from the past few years to get the scores they want, so at some point the scores in the challenges may start to have more meaning. I'm suggesting that point is 1999 because that is where the mix-up is.

Of course we are assuming someone spent some time making this hint if the there is a message in the game scores. Maybe I'm over-analyzing but if you remember the 2013 game hint that definitely took several complex steps to solve, just a thought, let me know what you guys think