Chief Delphi - Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

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Re: Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

Quote:

Originally Posted by PayneTrain (Post 1453200)

gg. You can if you want. From disassembling an OTS gearbox all the way up to bringing raw stock and knowing what you need to cut, it's simple to cut down a change to 30. It just keeps getting simpler after that (simple doesn't mean easy, but it can).

We're doing it.

This is how we bagged at Inland Empire.

Check back in 1.5 weeks for an entirely new Sandstorm.

Re: Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamHeard (Post 1453220)

We're doing it.

This is how we bagged at Inland Empire.

Check back in 1.5 weeks for an entirely new Sandstorm.

Hey we did that last year!

If you don't switch out a major assembly between events you're doing it wrong (or very very right, good on you!)

Re: Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

Quote:

Originally Posted by PayneTrain (Post 1453231)

Hey we did that last year!

If you don't switch out a major assembly between events you're doing it wrong (or very very right, good on you!)

I think we one upped you. Between our at champs we tore our entire robot to pieces except for the drive train. New electronics board, new pick up, new holder. All in four hours at champs. I remember our alliance partners coming over to us every 30 minutes asking if we were going to make our match. And I am glad to say we did :D

Re: Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnets (Post 1452969)

One of the teams I'm working with this year is considering switching their robot to an autonomous container grabber if they qualify for the championship. The "robot" would be four container grabbers. I don't want to disclose the exact strategy, but let's just say they have a good chance to win almost any container grab competition.

At first, I dismissed it as crazy. Sure, containers from the step are important, but can you really justify picking a robot that can only do one thing? After autonomous mode, the robot doesn't move - not the most exciting thing ever.

A few nights ago, a student and his brother came to me and explained why they thought it was worth it. They would only make the change if/when they were at the championships. After watching teams play, it's clear that a good team can make two full 42 point stacks. It's not unimaginable that two of these teams could end up together on an alliance at the championship. If these teams each scored their two stacks, and we grabbed the auto containers, the other teams would have to stack 21 totes to make up for our fourth stack and tie with us. It gets even better if the other two teams score more points. I was worried that this alliance might not make it out of quarterfinals, but the four team alliances would let us sit out and the other three bots rack up points to boost our average. In semis, we'd score fewer points, but we'd severely limit the number of points our opponents can score.

What do you guys think? Is it worth it, or are we just crazy? How desirable is the ability to be amazingly good at grabbing center containers? If we're the best at it, are we sure to be picked?

Is it worth it? It really depends on what you do now. I would suggest that if you are an RC specialist, like to play in the landfill, and/or can easily deal with tipped RC's, you are far better off making a less drastic change: A very fast 2 RC autonomous grabber isn't that hard to do. This would rally augment your abilities and make you very desirable as an alliance pick. Even if you are, overall, a mediocre robot, you could be an outstanding 2nd pick - or even a 1st pick, depending on how well you do other things. (i.e., if you can only make one 3 tote stack with an RC in 2:15, but if one of those RC's came from teh center during autonomous with a second, you have potentially just added a huge value to your alliance.)

As for the "grab 4 every time" idea, I don't buy into it. I am of the opinion that if you can do something, there is always somebody out there who can do the same thing just as well, if not better. For every 4 RC grabber, there will be 2 robots that can grab 2 RC's in half the time - or with double the strength.... Frankly, I'd have to be very sure of myself before selecting a 4 RC grabber for eliminations, especially if it does nothing else.

Re: Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

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Originally Posted by GeeTwo (Post 1453167)

If you're going to make such a drastic change on a Thursday, I would definitely want to have already built one so you don't have to do nearly as much tweaking at competition.

The interesting thing about planning for a complete Champs rebuild into a 4 RC auto specialist is you don't necessarily have to be working Thursday. If your whole plan is to be good enough at 4 RC auto to get nabbed by a stacking fiend alliance, then you clearly don't care about your ranking. All you need is to show up at enough matches to convince one of the higher ranked teams that you're worth a pick. It's entirely possible to do that with your handful of Saturday morning matches, though you're better off if you fit one or two demos in Friday afternoon.

57 accidentally did this in 2007 at Great Lakes. We had a double ramp lift that was broken all thursday/friday till we had the the BB gearbox shaft welded to the planet carrier. Lift worked flawlessly Saturday morning and 1114 was the only team that noticed and nabbed us as the last pick of the draft.

Re: Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnets (Post 1452969)

If you... (or anyone else considering this for that matter) wish to go in this direction... check out 3310 (fast 2 can) and 2848 (4 can).

Note 3310... grabs cans in 0.25 of a second!

I'm guessing a lot of top tier robots will end up adding a similar capability on their robots, so what probably will happen is a multiple robot / 2-can auton going on... in which case can probably beat the 4rc.

It will be interesting to see the outcome of a tug-a-war case, and who will let go... and who neglected to add that feature... etc.

Re: Should we rebuild our robot to be an autonomous container grabber?

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Originally Posted by JamesTerm (Post 1453502)

A tug of war like that is highly unlikely, given that from what I've heard from week 1. We may see a few where it's theoretically possible before Championships, but I have a feeling that one robot will play chicken or an agreement will be reached. BUT, that doesn't mean I wouldn't enjoy such a battle. :D

Also, Auto isn't that valuable this year in terms of points unless your alliance is VERY co-ordinated. If you are able to pick up 4 cans from the middle and score 8 points in auto, that's great, but you will have to find a way to keep them from going everywhere, find a way to put them down semi-relaibly, and not waste time. Auto this year is probably the most difficult it's been in a while now.