List(s) of OPR?
 

Is there a website/place I can find historical OPR lists (ie. the OPR for all teams in the 2014 season) as well as a current one for this season (every team who has competed this season so far, with updates being done at a reasonable time)?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Ed Law has been keeping track of OPRs for a number of years in Excel spreadsheets. This is what he has going for the 2015 season, and you can check his posts for his spreadsheets from previous years.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

The Blue Alliance also has all the OPRS for each event in their API's.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

How do they handle DQs and surrogates?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

We don't.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Well, when it comes to surrogates, you actually had to make a choice:


1) Change the negative team number (surrogate) to positive and do the computation. When a team plays as surrogate, the alliance score will count against their OPR.

or

2) Leave the team number as negative. The surrogate will be considered a completely separate team, and will be assigned its own OPR

or

3) Replace negative team number with 0 (or some other placeholder). Team 0 will be assigned its own OPR, even though it represents contributions from several different surrogate teams

or

4) Ignore the match entirely (leave the entire match out of the design matrix). The alliance scores for that match will be omitted from the remaining non-surrogate teams in the match.

or

5) Include the match, leaving the surrogate team out of the design matrix


I realize some of the options above are poor choices.

I think Option (1) is the best approach. Is that what you did?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

I don't understand why surrogates need to be accounted for differently. Can you please explain? Thanks.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

I should have been clearer. I wasn't suggesting that they need to be accounted for differently.

In fact, Option1 (which I suggested is the best one) treats them as if they were not surrogates.

I was just asking if that's the way TBA does it.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

I guess I should have been more clear as well. When I said "We don't," I meant that we don't do anything special (your option 1). I'm not sure what you mean by "negative team number."

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

That was for the benefit of readers who don't have access to (or don't know how to use) the API. FIRST displays surrogate teams in parentheses (accounting lingo for negative number) on their Match Results pages.

AFAIK (I haven't confirmed this yet), when a team plays as a surrogate for an alliance, FIRST does not include that alliance's scores in the surrogate team's totals that they report on the Rankings page.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Ah, that makes much more sense.

I haven't confirmed it either, but the a team's points in the rankings better not be affected by the alliance's scores in which that team is a surrogate. That would completely defeat the point of surrogates.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Agreed. But it creates a problem (mathematically speaking) for the computation of component OPR: If you include the surrogate in the design matrix, but the component scores reported in the rankings do not include the surrogate match alliance scores in the surrogate's totals, it skews the data.

This is one of the issues Ed Law strives to address in his scouting database by doing some manipulation of the data, but there's really no totally correct way around this with the data currently available.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Does anyone know of a place to quickly access (live) OPRs at a match? TBA does part of the job (top 15), but is there anywhere that does the same thing but with more than top 15?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

http://team955.org/apps/opr/

It won't be super accurate until more matches have been played than teams. This is true with all OPR calculations though.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

How are you handling surrogates in the computation of OPRs using data from the Team Rankings table?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Quite simply, we don't.

I've noticed you asking about surrogates and DQ's on every OPR thread, why?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

This looks like the kind of thing I'm looking for! However the numbers look a bit low - is it calculating OPRs with a score of 0 for all future matches?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Because I'm interested in how various OPR app developers are handling that question.

In a match with an alliance containing a surrogate team, the scores (Coop, Auto, RC, Tote, Litter) for that alliance in that match are not included in that surrogate team's totals as reported in the Rankings table. So without some algorithmic legerdemain, the computed category OPRs for every team that plays in an event as a surrogate will be lower than they "should" be.

Unfortunately, there is really no mathematically "correct" way to deal with this, because this year FIRST does not provide the data required to handle this issue properly.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

I am glad that everybody is not doing anything special to calculate OPR. This means it is just another match and one more data point. This is how it was done starting from 2006. I am doing it the same way also. I don't think anybody should change that.

What Ether is asking everybody about has to do with calculating Component OPR only. I already explained that in my post and how I did it in case anybody wanted to duplicate that in their own program. It is very important to me that as a community we all calculate it the same way.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

The numbers won't be correct until there are more matches than teams.

We aren't sure, but it seems that OPR is still somewhat correct for in-progress events with less matches than teams. Obviously, the numbers aren't right but they appear to be representative. For example, Waterloo shows 1114 with a higher OPR than 2056 which makes sense given their prior performances. The remaining teams flesh out pretty much where I would expect them too as well.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Can you explain what you mean by this?

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Correct. And the reason I asked Dunngeon is because Team 955's (excellent) online OPR calculator does compute component OPRs.

To see what I am talking about, go here and look through the list of links at the top of the page to find the one described as follows:

ZIP file containing 47 CSV files (one for each event in weeks 1 thru 3).
CSV can be opened directly in Excel (if file association is set).
Each CSV contains all Match Results and Team Standings data
in columns. The last 3 columns in each CSV illustrate what happens when
there are DQs or surrogates.

... and click the link underneath that description to download it.

Open the ZIP file and look at the FLFO event.


I don't think that's going to happen until FIRST provides the data necessary to do these computations in a straightforward manner (requiring no special work-arounds for missing data).

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Hey - just checked, and it looks still pretty low. Does 2056 seriously just have a 46 OPR at Waterloo? TBA says they are >100.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

No, there's an issue in how we are calculating OPR/component OPR right now. It won't be fully accurate until the quals matches conclude. The guys who developed the app are looking into it.

The data does seem to be correct if you take it as representative. Once the issue is corrected, it should be more accurate throughout the event.

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

I don't think so. I think one of our matrices is pulling data from matches that haven't happened yet (from the match schedule) which is diluting the OPR values. Once quals are over the numbers will look correct. I think the values are correct relative to each other (so ranking should be correct). I'll find where the problem is and fix it today.

EDIT: Found the problem. We have a Tx2M and a 2MxT (T = team count, M = match count) matrix. The problem was that M is based on the match schedule, not the qual matches played so far (exacerbated by the fact that our score vector has "-1" for unplayed matches). Being fixed now, should be live soon. Numbers for partially completed events will now be accurate.

UPDATE 2: Everything is fixed now and it works; will be live soon. No more low numbers for incomplete events!

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Waterloo OPR after 42 43 44 matches:

1114 122.338771908684
2056 115.255462997957
5406 79.45256087752726
1676 65.22743639565435
3683 56.35364504850799
4039 52.26278702460058
4678 48.29159643066427
1285 44.16440103647798
4917 43.75946019638102
2935 30.76809371505734
4308 30.52351397120633
4618 29.35071188804886
1305 21.71971062966638
1241 18.99280792584136
865 18.79165128654639
244 17.84078561299089
4907 17.48879720367756
5158 15.5599957215479
1334 13.88992749860653
3161 12.39563411206913
4083 12.26564544482614
4617 11.19964476997339
2702 7.470182890478237
4943 4.825685466295547
4939 3.778595533262281
329 3.103572087743411
288 1.448370672968942
5719 -0.08024046235556673
3161 -0.6562681350470999
216 -0.7921025379218417
4807 -2.33763700274084

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Thanks a ton Ether - that's exactly what we need. Is there any chance you could update it one more time? :D

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Waterloo OPR after 50 matches

1114 122.8710504019499
2056 116.2557850405053
5406 80.06950509762898
1676 64.40149746437767
3683 55.91593164015401
4678 55.71080239608892
4039 44.9412470979139
4917 43.95207215339877
1285 41.46928340006868
4308 30.22048321822589
4618 25.36043901805233
2935 22.91431768515232
1241 20.22770469917203
1305 20.04854300153818
244 18.54876078530159
4083 16.90792113132018
4907 16.65883546791113
865 15.46803263708945
5158 14.97792812172438
3161 14.18264169426083
2702 12.2284514799007
329 11.06831273146025
1334 10.70220852534225
4617 10.55560155303972
4939 10.46369201225559
4943 9.032886869085649
288 8.815010374948916
4807 0.2033059668629823
3161 -1.93564781465679
5719 -2.081060153546635
216 -6.879362560292123

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

Hey microbuns try again using this link while we update the version on our website. :-)

Click download to keep a csv of the data (sorted however you like).
(keep in mind our OPR doesn't include coop, so add the Coop component OPR to get values similar to the blue alliance).

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

script stopped responding

Re: List(s) of OPR?
 

What browser and version are you using?