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-   -   Future First Championship News (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136491)

Madison 09-04-2015 13:05
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnFogarty (Post 1468344)
12 h 55 min (823.3 mi) via I-77 N

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=charleston+to+detroit+drive
Right -- all distances on that map are "as the crow flies." No time this morning to figure out how to map all places that are 12 hours by driving from a single point on the map, although that might be a fun exercise to try someday.

Knufire 09-04-2015 13:06
Re: Future First Championship News
 
After seeing Warren Central High School (where the Indiana State Championship was held), the buiding could definitely hold a two field event. It's only 15 minute away from Lawrence North High School, the current IRI venue. In case they want to expand...

MrTechCenter 09-04-2015 13:06
Re: Future First Championship News
 
I was right. I said FIRST would go back to Houston and they laughed at me...but I was right...

But in all seriousness, this really doesn't make sense. I would totally get it if FIRST split up FRC, FTC, and FLL and had FTC/FLL at a separate World Championship just for the sake of space, but why split all of the programs?

Also, it seems pretty strange to me that they're using different venues for everything in Houston. It's probably because of conflicts with the NBA and MLB seasons which makes sense but that's a lot of juggling.

And it also seems backwards to have the pits at Ford Field in Detroit and the matches in the Cobo center. Should be the other way around.

EricLeifermann 09-04-2015 13:06
Re: Future First Championship News
 
This might be one of the worst decisions FIRST has ever made. They were doing so good too, actually listening to what teams wanted. This definitely wasn't what people have been asking for. Districts >super regionals > world championship . That's the route we should be taking l. Not this.

dodar 09-04-2015 13:06
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by George1902 (Post 1468355)
But you might sell your house and rent a few years until you can buy a better house.
So you renovate your house and before the workers are even gone and you havent even seen how the renovations look yet, you are already putting the house on the market?

pwnageNick 09-04-2015 13:07
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JesseK
Many FRC teams are part of larger programs that utilize multiple 'vehicles' already (have you seen recent Chairman's videos?). FIRST programs are great general programs and use a great set of ideals to achieve FIRST's goals, but the programs themselves do not address every STEM education-related need this country already has.
Considering Jared is part of 254 who has won the World Chairman's Award recently and has one of the most prestigious VEX programs in the world, I'm pretty sure he's aware of what you said.

EDIT: also a part of 341 when they won CCA.

saikiranra 09-04-2015 13:07
Re: Future First Championship News
 
One of the supposed sentiments behind this change is to reduce over all costs for teams who have to travel far to get to champs, but this hardly makes it better for teams on the West Coast. The PNW district and California need to travel farther (or the same distance), which doesn't improve the situation for us. Not to mention, this changes almost nothing for a lot of the non-American subcontinent teams.

Another sentiment of this change is to make FRC more inclusive. It seems like a more cost-effective and inclusive solution to change most areas to districts, where teams who don't usually make it to Champs can attend district champs.

This decision shows the large disconnect between HQ and the actual teams. Hopefully something constructive can come out of this.

Bob Steele 09-04-2015 13:09
Re: Future First Championship News
 
This just in....

FIFA, having heard about the new FIRST Robotics plan, have announced that for the next World Cup they will have 2 World Champions. This will allow more countries to compete and give everyone a more complete experience.

Upon winning, each Champion will be rewarded a half trophy and be allowed to put half of a star on their country's jersey.

NCAA also thinking of stopping the Basketball Tournament at the Sweet Sixteen and crowning 16 National Champions.

More to come....

Woolly 09-04-2015 13:10
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thad House (Post 1468291)
This will only be my 6th year in FRC, but this post really hits home for me.

I come from a region that has never even reached Einstein, and its one of the major goals many mentors from the PNW share. Being able to go to worlds, view all the INCREDIBLE robots, and see Einstein finals usually being the best matches played in FRC inspires us to push even harder. Only getting to see half the teams, and having to Einsteins is going to make the finals be basically the semi finals. The best of the best now will not happen in regular competition, which to me is basically unacceptable. Seeing the best of the best is what inspires me and my students to work harder each year to hit that goal.
This is year 4 for me, but PNW's goals sound oh so much like MO's goals right now. There's a lot of teams around here absolutely clawing for any chance to allow a World Champions trophy to stay in Missouri after it's presented in St. Louis.

If the motivation is to inspire more people, I'm firmly of the opinion that lowering the bar with 2 championships is the wrong way to go about it. On the contrary, it would be more inspiring if more robots were able to effectively play the game at district and regional levels, and it might help with potential sponsors' perception of FIRST and FIRST teams. IMO this is why instead of lowering the bar, FIRST as an organization and we as a community should renew our focus on making sure that everyone in FIRST knows about the extensive intellectual resources available to them (CD, Simbotics.org, team358.org for labview, old robot footage, etc.).

While some find emulating other teams to be uninspiring or even taboo, the idea is to use team X's design/process/corn dog dispenser once and then being engineers, scientists, mathematicians, programmers, etc. find ways to improve upon it, and then report your findings back to the community.

While I know this post is long and a bit non-sequitur, it's my opinion (read: Not team 1806 or any of it's sponsors' opinions) that dividing the championship in 2, and having the "everyone gets a medal" mentality is harmful to the end goals of FIRST. However, maybe that's just because I fail to accept that such a high number of teams are completely incapable of building a robot that can put up more than say 20 points a match by themselves, with the caveat being that would have to be made aware of all the resources they have, and also be able to meet a reasonable time commitment.

JimCash 09-04-2015 13:11
Re: Future First Championship News
 
I am VERY disappointed. I am grateful that my team gets to go to World's this year before this terrible plan goes in to effect. IRI will now be the true "World Championships".... If you want to have a "World Experience", go to the FIRST double championship. If you want to compete for world title, save your money and go to IRI.

JABot67 09-04-2015 13:13
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Two points:

First of all, I think that a major gripe a lot of people have about having two championships is that there would be two world championship winning alliances. I think this could be resolved by having the winning alliance from Houston hurry on up to STL or DET the next week to battle it out in an actual final series. This could address a lot of people's concerns about having more than one winning alliance. Most of the Houston crowd, however, would have to watch the finals from home.

Second of all, I'd just like to echo the sentiment that there is a difference between being at THE World Championship, and being at one of the two world championships. At THE World Championship, you know that you are really getting the big picture. All the qualifying powerhouse teams and VIPs and FIRST-supporting celebrities and CEOs and politicians are there with you. When you hear Dean talk between matches on Einstein, you know that competition season is coming to a close for everyone.

It's going to be hard for me. I can't wait for the time when someone starts to talk about 2017 Einstein and I have to interject and ask "Which one?".

Also, I imagine that the STL/DET teams are going to watch HOU Einstein and know what strategies to employ. Seems weird that one championship will have an effect on the strategy of another championship.

http://www.thebluealliance.com/event/2017cmp1
http://www.thebluealliance.com/event/2017cmp2

^ Can't wait for these events to happen! ^

AquaMorph 09-04-2015 13:14
Re: Future First Championship News
 
This is how I see this announcement

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYmHYQPaHaw

Abhishek R 09-04-2015 13:15
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Leonard (Post 1468335)
As a competitor, I'm very much against this decision.

I was drawn to FRC by the competition. In my freshman year of high school, my technology teacher showed the class some video of Team 20 competing in Breakaway. I saw Team 20's robot achieve a nail-biting win in the match I watched. It was awesome to me- students built a robot to compete with others- and not like Battlebots, where the only goal is destruction- but as respectful competitors in a sport-like environment.

I joined the team that fall and never looked back- not because I was all that interested in every part of the robot, but because FIRST is the best competition I've ever competed in.

I've been a part of competitive wrestling, swimming, diving, ultimate, and baseball, but FIRST is the best I've ever done- because anyone can win, all they have to do is be the smarter competitor, not have any inherent physical advantage. There's no name-calling in FIRST, there's little arrogance and no sabotage. FIRST showed me how to compete the right way in everything I do, not just robotics.

I'm now in college studying mechanical engineering at the Rochester Institute of Technology because of my FIRST experience. I wouldn't be here if FIRST wasn't a real competition. If FIRST goes through with this change, I see dozens of otherwise competitive, incredibly gifted students passing on the FIRST Robotics "Competition" because it's not a competition anymore at the highest levels.

You can't have two World Champions.



I hope if FIRST continues to pursue this solution, some other competition with full-size robots springs from the ashes FIRST leaves behind and gives students everywhere the competition they deserve.
I have exactly the same feelings, word for word. Competition is what drew me to FIRST the most, and this just doesn't feel right.

ijonny5 09-04-2015 13:16
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Bottiglieri (Post 1468177)
So....

Inaugural Vex Pro Competition in 2017?!?
Best idea I've heard yet.

Steven Donow 09-04-2015 13:18
Re: Future First Championship News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JABot67 (Post 1468367)
Two points:

First of all, I think that a major gripe a lot of people have about having two championships is that there would be two world championship winning alliances. I think this could be resolved by having the winning alliance from Houston hurry on up to STL or DET the next week to battle it out in an actual final series. This could address a lot of people's concerns about having more than one winning alliance. Most of the Houston crowd, however, would have to watch the finals from home.

Okay, on Monday, April 24th, 2017 I'll tell my future boss after I win the 2017 Houston Champs that I need to take an additional 2-3 days off and spend $1000+ on a last second trip to STL/DET


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