New rookie team
 

Hey guys!

I just decided to give myself a pretty cool challenge, in my opinion... After three cool years on Evolution 2626, I decided to create my own team. So, i'm the only student on the team for the moment and I would like you to help me...

First of all, my main language is french (I'm from Québec, Canada) and I am not really good at writing in english... So could somebody please take a look at my website (frci.weebly.com) and my Facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/frcteami) and give me a feedback on the texts? It would be really appreciated!

Second of all, I would like to know if you guys have any crazy ideas that I could try this year on my team... I want to act differently then others to inspire the people around the team...

Finally, do you know resources for rookie teams that could be useful? Grants, robot parts... Anything?

Thank you for your support!

Re: New rookie team
 

Cool idea for a team name, and nifty logo. I dig it.

Now, if you want to start a rookie team, here are some tips:

1) Find mentors. As many as you possibly can. This is the single most important thing you can do, and if you don't do it well you cannot succeed.

2) Have a plan. Make sure every person in the team administration has a clearly-defined role that they and everyone else knows, and that they are able and willing to perform. Try to stick to pre-determined schedules as much as possible - people at meetings need to know what they're supposed to be doing. I've seen what happens if you're not good about this, and it's disastrous.

3) Work within your means. This goes for any team, but is especially salient for rookies. Trying for too ambitious a goal will much more often result in failure and disappointment than success and inspiration. Figure out what you can do with what you have, and do that well.

Re: New rookie team
 

Thank you for your advices :)

For point 3, the thing is that this team was created to be ambitious... Since it's my fourth year in an FRC team, I would like to try new things...

I'll try to apply your ideas! Thank you again :)

Re: New rookie team
 

Working within your means doesn't mean that you can't be ambitious. It just means that you should make sure that your ambition does not outstrip what you can realistically achieve.

It's also worth bearing in mind that, in FRC, there are many directions in which you can innovate other than the strictly technical, which may be better-suited to the resources of rookie teams. Finding new and innovative ways to interact with your community and promote interest in science and technology is just as important a part of FIRST (if not moreso) as the actual robot.

Re: New rookie team
 

Oh, I didn't understand that expression :)

And yeah, that's true... I'm working on the community aspect too (well, I try but I'm not the best for that point!).

Re: New rookie team
 

If you need help with French-English/English-French translations let me know! I'll do my absolute best.

Re: New rookie team
 

I try my best on that point but if you want to help I won't say no :)

Re: New rookie team
 

Will you have your team within the same school as 2626? Or do you plan on starting off in a new school?

Re: New rookie team
 

I'm planning of starting it either in Sherbrooke's CEGEP or just as a team without any link to a school :)

Re: New rookie team
 

-Try to stay consistent in which side you put English and which side you put French (it looks like English his more on the left, so make sure that it's always on the left.
-In Team, change Historic to History
-Add a section (probably under Team) about past robots- this is very helpful in getting scouted, and also just overall documentation
-Try to make a more interesting background, such as a video or photo slideshow- this will make your website look more complete and professional, both of which are important in getting scouted and making a good website

Overall, congrats on being brave enough to start your own team!!! :] :D :)

Re: New rookie team
 

First of all, thank you for your feedback :)

I made the changes for history/historic...

I don't feel comfortable about adding a section about my past robots because I was with another team and I didn't do team alone at all :) I don't want to take the credit for that...

I'm currently gathering pictures and videos to add on the site :) It will soon be there!

Thank you again for you feedback!

Re: New rookie team
 

Liked on Facebook. Best of luck! :]

Re: New rookie team
 

Can your area support another team? FRC teams are expensive, both in manpower and monetarily.

Re: New rookie team
 

Well, we don't have a lot of team in Québec... And I'm on good tracks for the monetary point... So I think it's ok :)

Re: New rookie team
 

If I'm understanding this correctly, you want to start a new team, as a student, even though you have access to a team already, because it would be "fun?" Can you please clarify why you want to start a team? What is the demand for a new team in your area?

People on here who tend to say "go for it!" and "wow great idea!" typically have not started their own teams before or have never ran one (successful one at least). That's a blanket statement I'm willing to make, sure.

Please know that starting and running a team is an extremely challenging thing to do as an adult, so I'm concerned you want to start a team for no real reason. Starting a mediocre or terrible team is easier, but ask yourself if that's really what you want. I only know of less than a handful of high school students who brought a new and successful FRC team to life on their own.

So, I have to ask; why?

Re: New rookie team
 

First of all, I had a conflict with one of the main mentors of my last team for the past three seasons... This helped me to quit the team... I didn't want to join another existing team because it seemed like an act of treason toward my friends... So, instead, I decided to give myself a challenge : create my own team. But I wanted to do different from other teams. So I'm the only student on the team, I'm not affiliated to any school and I do everything I can to promote FIRST.

That's why...

Re: New rookie team
 

I'm going to be as polite as I can... As someone who was involved in running a rookie team (unsuccessfully)... that's a really BAD reason.

Sort out your problems. In the real world you can't just pull a Bender and start your own casino with hookers and blackjack and beer. Instead of running away like a chump, figure out what the conflicts were and how you can resolve them because that's what you're going to have to do in life.

And joining another team isn't an act of treason, I've joined plenty of other teams (moving around the country does that) and I've played with and against my former teammates, no hard feelings. If you can't resolve your issues, join another team.

Re: New rookie team
 

I understand your point but my main goal is to have a challenge... I want to learn things, to get experience. The team is created, it's on TIMS... I started looking for sponsors and I'm already working to prepare the build period. My goal is not to have the best robot ever, I only want to prove myself and everyone that if you want something, you only need to put efforts.

Re: New rookie team
 

...You can also challenge yourself by joining an existing team and helping them become stronger, win a regional, or more.

There are plenty of ways to challenge yourself and striving for excellence without wasting a good chunk of money, and your sanity.

Re: New rookie team
 

I'm already insane... Nothing to lose there :) And I will stay with this new team... I'm quite stubborn :) I want to create my way, to do different from others...

Re: New rookie team
 

I'm going to be 100% honest here: I think this is a bad idea. I understand you had problems with your previous team and want to challenge yourself, and you probably got really mad one day and thought "Ya know what, I'm gonna make my own team." That sounds like a good idea when you're mad, but actually it will be a nightmare for you. Running away and starting your own team without first setting up sponsorships, getting mentors and team members, and finding a place to work will not only be challenging, but is a very short-sighted view of what it takes to run any team, not even a successful team.

I would caution you that, no matter how stubborn you are and no matter how much effort you put into running the team, you will have a very hard time making a robot, let alone being at all competitive. You are probably better off taking whatever sponsors, team members, mentors, etc. you found for your new team and bringing them to help your old team or any other team you want to join. If you are already registered on TIMS it might be too late to back out, but I hope not for your sake. There are other, more rewarding and accomplishable ways to challenge yourself besides starting a new team.

You have every right to reject my suggestions, and if you do (which is likely judging by your previous responses) I wish you good luck with your new team.

Re: New rookie team
 

First of all, you guys put too much emphasis on the problem I had with the other team... Maybe I did not say it correctly but it's not that much of a big deal... I understand your point and many people told me that... But you know, I want to try it. Maybe I'm crazy, maybe I just don't know yet but I'll try until I succeed or fail. And if I fail, I wont mind. Because trying and failing makes you a better person then fleeing after the first couple obstacles.

Re: New rookie team
 

I forgot to thank you :) I hope we meet in competition!

Re: New rookie team
 

So you're saying you can work things out without starting a new team?

For one last time, I'll echo what Andrew and Ari have stated. This is usually a bad idea. You should work with your old team, or another area team, to become better and accomplish much more. Sometimes being a one man team and being stubborn about wanting to do something challenging isn't the smartest thing.

Poor execution of a new team doesn't affect just you. It affects sponsors, students, mentors, and parents.

Re: New rookie team
 

That is true. I've seen many examples of this... But the people I'm working with know the risks and they like it... And, even if the robot of this team fails miserably, our job will be done... We are currently working with a school (and one more in a few months) to show them the experience of FIRST so they can start their own team next year. We want to help the community, not to be the very best, like no one ever was (see what I did there? :) )...

Re: New rookie team
 

As I already told you, my team would be happy to see you with us :cool:
If you want a challenge, there is one of our mentors who is starting a program with the CEGEP to help teams in the region next year! Maybe you could spare some of your time on this instead? :yikes:

Re: New rookie team
 

Would it be terrible to say there is no "I" in "TEAM"?

I think you have a really good idea here for giving yourself an engineering challenge and working towards promoting STEM and FIRST, however, you have acknowledged on numerous posts that you are the only student on the team. It sounds like this is a great idea for a local STEM non-profit organization, but not for an official FIRST team. You can't do it all on your own, and while it sounds like you have found some support with sponsorship and community interest, it is important that you are clear on your business plan and what you intend to accomplish. As much as we all love FIRST, it is possible that the competition format of the program is just not the correct venue for what you had in mind.

Re: New rookie team
 

If you want to start your own team, there's nothing stopping you besides the negative comments you'll get here. Don't let someone's bad attitude keep you from reaching your goals.

But, seriously, it's going to be really hard to manage a team as a student. Your #1 priority should be to find mentors and sponsors. If you want to be competitive by January, you'll need all the help you can get. Throughout this fall, you'll need to find students to join your team, which will be hard if you're in the same school as an already-established FRC team. If this is the case, start your team in another local school so that you have a large group of interested students, who aren't already on another team.

Connect with teams in your area, find elite teams your team can visit before the season, to show students and new mentors how a successful FRC team works. We recently lended our practice robot to a pre-rookie team, so they could compete at an offseason event. I'm not sure if there's video of it, but they competed at R2OC as team 9999 (although the robot was labeled 8338 :rolleyes: ) and did really well. Find opportunities like that. They are a great way to get your new students acclimated to the competition environment.

You'll need money and a shop, too. If there are any major businesses within 100 miles of you, schedule a meeting with their executives. Bring a really (REALLY) good sales pitch, you're gonna need it. Find grants, find sponsorships, find someone willing to let you use their workspace. Get all the money and resources you can get because it'll likely make up for a little bit of the people-resources you're going to lack in your first year. Now, I'm not saying money can make up for all of the human resources you'll be missing as a rookie, but money can help a little.

Also, you need to develop a stronger identity. I like the FRC-i idea, it has potential. However, it's very vague. It doesn't say anything about where your team is from or what you guys do. Therefore, you need to have strong core values and a very strong team identity to back it up. You say you want your team to do FRC differently, you want the team to challenge the normal process for an FRC team. Think- how are you going to do this? What normal aspect of FRC are you going to challenge? Especially in your first season, don't go and try out an entirely new drivetrain style, or something like that. Designing your mechanisms differently, or programming the robot in a different way will likely leave you with a completely nonfunctional robot, especially if you haven't had an off-season to refine the new idea. Hold off on that kind of thing until the team is better established.

What you're doing sounds awesome. It's daring and adventurous. Keep me updated, and I'd be happy to help in any way I can.

Re: New rookie team
 

I don't know... Maybe I'm doing an error, maybe not... I have many ideas in mind to make this work both during the build season and in competition. And you are right, there is no I in team... There is one in équipe though, the french translation :)

I think that it's not because I'm the only student working on the robot that there can't be anyone else supporting... You see, a student from Ontario manifested his interest toward my projects and wants to help me brainstorming and building a strategy... I can't understand why you guys don't want me to give it a try... FIRST is about new things, it's about challenge, it's about helping others and learning...

Re: New rookie team
 

I agree with all the comments above discouraging you from starting a new team as a student (and you're the only student?)

In addition, it sounds like this team is going to be a one-season team? Just 2016, then you graduate and the team no longer exists?

If you're that set on having your own team- start a VEX or FTC team at least. It's still a challenge to build a successful VEX or FTC robot on your own.

What mentor support do you have? Are you the only student, or will there be more? What skills do you have? What sponsors do you have?

I'm concerned that your failure could mean more than just failure for yourself. It could disenchant sponsors in your community, and create just another failed FRC team that failed to make an impact on it's community.

Re: New rookie team
 

Thank you for this :) (I had a jump scare when the video starded... hahahaha)

I'm currently working on finding sponsors... I have a list of 50 of them to contact in my region.

I have connections with existing teams in my region and out of it, I'm talking to them often and I try to get a bit of support from them :)

For the team image, I don't really know what to do haha :) And, you say it's hard to be different in the first season but this will be my fourth... So I have a few ideas I'd like to try (even if my budget is low :yikes: )

Thank you again!

Re: New rookie team
 

Not discouraging you from trying something new. I am however suggesting that based on the goals you have outlined, if you made this a local STEM non-profit rather than a competitive team, you'd probably find you could make an even bigger impact in the FIRST community.

(I believe I in French is Je? Which is not in equipe. So the sentiment still stands ;) )

Re: New rookie team
 

First of all, thank you for your opinion, it helps a lot :)

Then, let me add that this team won't end this year. I know people that will take the lead right after me... (Question : I'll be 18 next season, the 2017 one) can I still compete on it?). And I'm not the only student... Someone from Ontario manifested his interest and his helping from there... If in need, I have a few friends who would probably join the team.

I currently have a few engineers as mentors and one for the financial aspect. I mainly program the robots normally but I am also pretty good at electric and financial... I need to get better in mechanics though. I am currently looking for sponsors and will start meeting them very soon.

I am also concerned by my failure and I do my best to keep the team from failing...

Thank you again for your opinion...

Re: New rookie team
 

Pretty true! hahaha

I plan on using the robot built this season on a non profit organisation to promote FIRST in other schools... But for the moment, I need to build one and I really want to compete! :)

Re: New rookie team
 

Two things:

#1.
FIRST's mission, from usfirst.org:
"Our mission is to inspire young people to be science and technology leaders, by engaging them in exciting mentor-based programs that build science, engineering and technology skills, that inspire innovation, and that foster well-rounded life capabilities including self-confidence, communication, and leadership."

Take a look at that description of FIRST and see how this team fits in with those goals. Who are your mentors? What experiences do you hope to draw communication & leadership skills from? Building a robot alone might help foster your engineering & technology skills, but what about the rest of FIRST?

Even going back to your definition of FIRST - how exactly does this team help others?

#2.

Akash mentioned earlier in the thread that students have run teams on their own, unsuccessfully. I'm going to jump in as one of those people.

I've posted about the early days of 1923 before, so I won't get too preachy here, but I cannot stress enough how much I do not recommend running a team on your own. At 14, my team (all 4 of us) was administrated, 'mentored' and captained by yours truly, without a mentor to our names for three years. It was exhausting, and I can't say I got what you're 'supposed' to get out of a FIRST experience. In my case, that was worth it to me - I've known FIRST all my life, I knew I wanted to go somewhere in the STEM fields, and I could hit the check box of being 'inspired' - so my focus in running the team was to provide that experience for other people in my school, even if I didn't get it myself.

Your case doesn't sound like that, since it doesn't seem like this team is even really open to other students. As others have mentioned, you seem to have some good pieces in place - and with that, you can definitely contribute positively elsewhere.

Edit:: Whoops - OP has addressed a few of my questions while I was composing.

Re: New rookie team
 

You see, I want to be exhausted, I want to work hard... FIRST was the best thing I ever lived and I did it for the past three years. From January to April, I did nothing else then FIRST and school... I have involved myself in my team really hard and one of my favorite part was the organisation of a video game tournament. For a month I was working on that non-stop, asking students their preference, discussing with the direction, creating logos, finding sponsors, creating friendship with passionate people... And I learned that the making process of such an event gives you, in my opinion, more fun and knowledge then the event itself. I want to reproduce that in FIRST... Organize the team, meet sponsors, explain my passion to people. You see, after posting this thread and joining a few groups on Facebook, I've met awesome people with great passions and great stories and its one of my goal... To create my story... I want to do what I really like and to live my passion to the maximum. I understand you guys have a lot of experience and saw teams fail during your FIRST career but I won't give up.

Thank you for your comment and have a good day...

Re: New rookie team
 

One more thing and then I will stop trying to convince you that this is a bad idea. You said that last year you spent all of time between FIRST and school. If you only had one other student on your team and no mentors (which I'm sure is not the case) you would have to double the amount of work you did from last year. More likely is that your team had at least 10 students and a few mentors, meaning you would have to work more than 24 hours a day every day to come close to making up the same amount of man-hours as your team did last year. And don't forget, you will have to apply to colleges and keep up with your school work.

Also, there is the problem of mentors. Mentors on FIRST teams exist to teach students how to engineer well. Without mentors, your robot will only have your engineering knowledge, which can't be that much given your age and the fact that you are a single person compared to an entire team. (No offense, but no one knows everything.)

Now I'm done trying to convince you (unless you post something else that I find absurd and no one else attempts to correct you). If you want to form your own team, more power to you (you will need it). Good luck, and I hope to see you at Championships.

Re: New rookie team
 

Last year, I spent all my free time at FIRST because I liked it... I did my job (programming the robot) in a few days and the rest of the time I tried to find new ideas, like new ways do control the robot or new possible functions... Which was not necessary at all...

I think I previously said I had mentors... And no, I don't know everything (the object of this thread)...

If you find my work absurd, good for you.

See you in competition :)

Re: New rookie team
 

Most of my thoughts are reflected by others in this thread. However, I think that if this sentence of yours is true, then you could certainly be successful. If you have multiple mentors who are planning to work fully on this team with you, and are committed to mentoring you, then it is very likely that you will be successful.

Getting companies to agree to sponsor a single student with thousands of dollars rather than giving those thousands to a whole team however, is going to be tough. Possibly even selfish.

Re: New rookie team
 

I totally agree with that point... But I think that if the team is able to help many other teams, to even create new ones, it's not that much selfish... This is why we try our best to find new ideas to help around us...

Re: New rookie team
 

Speaking from a company perspective, I would rather give $3,000 to an organization that ONLY works on building new teams than $8,000 on a team that builds other teams but also sends a single student to compete in a $5,000 competition.

Wait, who is going to be on your drive team? At the very least you will have to have a human player in addition to yourself.

Re: New rookie team
 

I am not going to tell you whether or not you should start the team, as I don't feel I have enough experience to make either of those statements.

However, it does sound to me as if you are looking to obtain a leadership role of sorts, and I don't think starting a FRC team is the most practical way to go about getting said role. A FRC team isn't just a team, it's a business and a program as well. You said you have been in touch with possible mentors and sponsors, that's fantastic. Maybe those assets would be better strengthening a team you are already part of, maybe not. It also sounded like you would be the only student working on many aspects of the team, with possibly some other student members. I highly suggest having more student members to fill more roles, and that way there are some with experience when you leave.

There are many other ways to be ambitious and to"have a lot on your plate" without there being so much ante. One option being like Kevin said- start a VEX or FTC team at the least. That experience will at least give you more knowledge about how all that stuff works, without such a high risk.

Advice if you're looking for leadership while you are still part of another team, or decide you want to be: Ask, it can be as simple as that sometimes. Ask to lead a sub-group. You like some (if not all) of the aspects the program stands for and want to spread it throughout the community- ask to lead a demo, be a spokesperson for the team and talk about what the team does. Want to be a leader that also teaches? Return as a mentor, teach the students that are there and want to learn.

Taking the OP seriously, you want info on starting a team. There are resources out there. I also suggest asking more questions, and answering others' without the slight retorts. I wish you the best of luck on whichever path you decide to take.

Re: New rookie team
 

I thought the best way to fix that is to give the opportunity to students from the other teams in the alliance to come and help on the field, filling the holes in the drive team. This way, they get the opportunity to live what it is like to drive or be the human player and everything goes fine :)

Re: New rookie team
 

Unfortuantely that is typically against the rules of FRC:

The entirety of the Drive Team needs to come from your FRC team. You may be able to find a loop hole if you call other non-member students "sponsors" of your team. In some circumstances sponsors can be considered as members of your team. :P

Re: New rookie team
 

$@#$@#$@#$@#, didn't see that one :( Even if I say all teams are forming a great team all together? :)

But, as said before, another student from Ontario kind of joined the team... We will not meet until the competition in Montreal and he will drive or be the human player, we don't know yet... Maybe both if the human player can control the robot too like during this year...

Re: New rookie team
 

This will make for an interesting experiment.
I thought that a team had to have 20 students signed up to register, but I'm not sure if I just imagined that.

Re: New rookie team
 

Hum, either your imagination, either I didn't see that...

Re: New rookie team
 

20??? Nope.


There have been ONE TWO FRC teams with one student that I am aware of. However, his circumstances were that the rest of the team basically didn't show up after a certain point in the build, and he kept going. As I recall, the rest of the team kind of showed up for the next year after some "prodding" in the form of hardware from the regional.

Re: New rookie team
 

Nice! So I'm legual! Yay!

Re: New rookie team
 

In 2014, 5110 Elks (Elk Rapids, Michigan) was a single girl, her parents, and a friend dragged to the competitions who I think was human player for the team. They won a judge's award that year, and in 2015 were semifinalists then quarterfinalists. (I think the team has more members now, but we weren't at any of their events this year)

Re: New rookie team
 

That's cool :) I'm in exactly the same situation (with someone else from another province to assist me)...

Re: New rookie team
 

You know, there is something I might be wondering if I were you. Seeing as you brought up "legal"...


In the U.S., where FIRST is based, if there is any sort of paperwork that might be needed to be legal (waivers, contracts, etc.), you MUST be of legal adult age in order to sign it (and thus bind yourself by its terms). In the U.S., that legal age is 18 years. (I am not sure what if any such restrictions Canada has.) If for some reason someone under 18 needs to sign said paperwork, usually a parent or guardian is also required to sign it--essentially backing up that the person under 18 will fulfill their part of the paperwork.

Given that you're admitting to being under 18 at this time, and FIRST's usual policies (which I believe include an adult being the one in charge of the team/registering the team), you might consider taking a good solid look at that paperwork again--and, if necessary, getting a responsible adult to sign it. Why, you ask? Because you really don't want to have to deal with any potential fallout from "falsely signing documents" or whatever the proper term for that action is.



Is Tristan Lall around? I can't wait for him to poke a few holes in this one...Particularly as involving Canadian law, which I know just about nothing about.

Re: New rookie team
 

Majority in Canada is at 18... And yes, my father, who is also my main mentor, will sign the papers, even if I fill them.

Do you know if I will still be able to compete in 2017? I'll be 18 for that season and I'm wondering...

Re: New rookie team
 

As a student or as a mentor? BTW, age actually has almost nothing to do with it. I was 18 during the last half of build/all of competition in my last year as a student.

The dividing line is: At that point, will you be a pre-college student (high school or below) or a college student (or otherwise out of high school)? If you are a pre-college student, you are considered a student. Otherwise, you are considered a mentor/coach (as far as FIRST is concerned).

Re: New rookie team
 

But the education system is different in Québec... I'm entering CEGEP now (which is after secondary 5)...

Re: New rookie team
 

For the purposes of FRC I'd consider CEGEP as pre-college. Are there other CEGEP teams? What's the precedence?

Re: New rookie team
 

Canada has a form of College right? (University, Community college, trade school, Grad school, etc.) As long as you aren't yet in one of those then I think you qualify as "pre-college" under FIRST's rules.

Re: New rookie team
 

Yeah, we have University... CEGEP is like a pre-University and with certain programs, you can, for example, become a technician...

This is the first team in a CEGEP...

Re: New rookie team
 

1st year in CEGEP is equivalent to senior year in high school...
If you study in a pre-universitary, you're good...
If you're in a technical program, i think it's considered "College"

Re: New rookie team
 

That's bad then... :( I'll still try and see with FIRST, maybe it'll be ok :)