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techhelpbb 11-12-2015 14:01

Re: SD540 Motor Controller (temperature specs)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by talon540 (Post 1511480)
If you are wondering how the SD540's heat up over time, mindsensors and Talon 540 performed a few tests on one of our old robots.

http://www.team540.com/sd540/

That's great! Can we get the drivetrain information that produced those temperatures? Wheels, ratios and motor configurations please. There seems to be a section of your website for it, but that information does not seem to be there.

philso 11-12-2015 14:19

Re: SD540 Motor Controller (temperature specs)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by talon540 (Post 1511480)
If you are wondering how the SD540's heat up over time, mindsensors and Talon 540 performed a few tests on one of our old robots.

http://www.team540.com/sd540/

Do you have any thing to show the test conditions such as ambient temperature, motor current. These have a significant effect on the measured value. Test results are meaningless without knowing the test conditions.

talon540 15-12-2015 09:03

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
I just realized... I need more caffeine! Apologies for an earlier post, but our robot does NOT use an SD540 for our pneumatics. It was for our lift mechanism.

Man, that's embarrassing. I'll drink some Redbull and be quiet now.

Chris is me 15-12-2015 09:25

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Will a firmware upgrade be released to remove the "safety feature" that cuts motor output if the input voltage drops below 9.5 volts? The "feature" is a deal breaker for me, as that is a surprisingly easy condition to reach on an FRC robot.

Also, the spec sheet claims the speed controller operates at voltages as low as 6 volts, but this "safety feature" kicks in long before that, so the spec sheet is wrong.

sastoller 15-12-2015 12:55

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Since you guys seem to be SD540 experts in this thread, I was wondering if you could comment on the very high output resistance of the SD540 that was measured by CTR in their tests (surely you've seen the results). The voltage drop (power lost) in the motor controller is drastically worse than the competition? Did you guys make a design choice or tradeoff that resulted in this? Or is it possible that CTR just got a bad (or damaged) SD540?

And I'll also echo Chris's question regarding a FW update to modify the 9.5V brownout feature. Could you make this voltage threshold user adjustable in the future so that users could control which motor controllers shut off first? Would it be possible to add a throttling feature to reduce output to 50% when a certain voltage threshold is reached?

http://www.ctr-electronics.com/downl...er-Testing.pdf

Andrew Schreiber 15-12-2015 13:58

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris is me (Post 1512444)
Will a firmware upgrade be released to remove the "safety feature" that cuts motor output if the input voltage drops below 9.5 volts? The "feature" is a deal breaker for me, as that is a surprisingly easy condition to reach on an FRC robot.

Also, the spec sheet claims the speed controller operates at voltages as low as 6 volts, but this "safety feature" kicks in long before that, so the spec sheet is wrong.

And claiming it's a safety feature makes little sense to me. I can run Victors off a 2S Lipo (7.2-8.4V) and be fine. No safety issue, just the robot only operates at those voltages (say for smaller than FRC robots) but this "feature" makes SD540's worthless in these applications. Despite them appearing to be a better fit because of lower cost. (Performance isn't as critical in this application, cost is more a factor)

pnitin 15-12-2015 15:02

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris is me (Post 1512444)
Will a firmware upgrade be released to remove the "safety feature" that cuts motor output if the input voltage drops below 9.5 volts? The "feature" is a deal breaker for me, as that is a surprisingly easy condition to reach on an FRC robot.


If you are letting down your battery 9.5 V your are basically killing your battery( actually 10.8V that is 1.8V per cell).
Lead-Acid battery will quickly built lead sulfide layers on plates ( no matter what is battery technology and what manufacturer claims)
you are basically screwing up battery and now it will have much high internal resistance so the you will start seeing voltage drop when you try to take out good amount of current.

notmattlythgoe 15-12-2015 15:03

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pnitin (Post 1512566)
If you are letting down your battery 9.5 V your are basically killing your battery( actually 10.8V that is 1.8V per cell).
Lead-Acid battery will quickly built lead sulfide layers on plates ( no matter what is battery technology and what manufacturer claims)
you are basically screwing up battery and now it will have much high internal resistance so the you will start seeing voltage drop when you try to take out good amount of current.

Don't think I've seen a robot get through a match without dipping that low in their battery voltage.

Andrew Schreiber 15-12-2015 15:08

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by notmattlythgoe (Post 1512567)
Don't think I've seen a robot get through a match without dipping that low in their battery voltage.

Pretty sure I've seen that on a non aggressively geared kitbot that only weighed 80 pounds... Unless the 9.5V limit only kicks in after a period of time in which case I'd like to see that in the documentation (and still complain because my use case for low cost controllers involves lower voltages anyway)

notmattlythgoe 15-12-2015 15:10

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Schreiber (Post 1512570)
Pretty sure I've seen that on a non aggressively geared kitbot that only weighed 80 pounds... Unless the 9.5V limit only kicks in after a period of time in which case I'd like to see that in the documentation (and still complain because my use case for low cost controllers involves lower voltages anyway)

I guess a robot that doesn't move would probably keep a pretty high voltage too.

geezloueez 15-12-2015 15:11

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by notmattlythgoe (Post 1512567)
Don't think I've seen a robot get through a match without dipping that low in their battery voltage.

I am a first year mentor for a rookie team. May seem like a dumb question, but I have not been involved first hand in a match yet. What is causing the batteries to drop so low? Are you using old batteries?

notmattlythgoe 15-12-2015 15:12

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by geezloueez (Post 1512572)
I am a first year mentor for a rookie team. May seem like a dumb question, but I have not been involved first hand in a match yet. What is causing the batteries to drop so low? Are you using old batteries?

Running any number of motors at the same time. Compressors running a lot. Pushing matches with other robots. FRC robots can use a lot of power and usually do.

geezloueez 15-12-2015 15:14

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by notmattlythgoe (Post 1512573)
Running any number of motors at the same time. Compressors running a lot. Pushing matches with other robots. FRC robots can use a lot of power and usually do.

What is the lowest you have witnessed in a match?

asid61 15-12-2015 15:15

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pnitin (Post 1512566)
If you are letting down your battery 9.5 V your are basically killing your battery( actually 10.8V that is 1.8V per cell).
Lead-Acid battery will quickly built lead sulfide layers on plates ( no matter what is battery technology and what manufacturer claims)
you are basically screwing up battery and now it will have much high internal resistance so the you will start seeing voltage drop when you try to take out good amount of current.

Hence why batteries in FRC have such a low lifetime... :P Interesting tidbit.
We don't use batteries from 2011 or earlier. And we're probably going to start phasing out the 2012 batteries too. They start being unable to hold a significant charge.

Chris is me 15-12-2015 15:16

Re: SD540 Motor Controller
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pnitin (Post 1512566)
If you are letting down your battery 9.5 V your are basically killing your battery( actually 10.8V that is 1.8V per cell).
Lead-Acid battery will quickly built lead sulfide layers on plates ( no matter what is battery technology and what manufacturer claims)
you are basically screwing up battery and now it will have much high internal resistance so the you will start seeing voltage drop when you try to take out good amount of current.

Momentary drops to 9.5vs are not at all uncommon in FRC matches, depending on the number of motors on the machine, weight, traction, etc. It might not be great for batteries but I'd rather be able to drive for the rest of the match and potentially shorten a battery's life than not be able to drive to save a couple of bucks later on. Basically, I don't want the products I use to try and protect me from myself.


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