FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

The University Interscholastic League (UIL) has selected FIRST as one of two robotics partners to pilot a robotics program during the 2015-2016 school year. This is exciting news for students across Texas.

We now have the opportunity to bring FIRST robotics to millions of students across the state of Texas and celebrate robotics the same way we celebrate sports, music and other competitive extra-curricular activities.

You can watch a video of the announcement from FIRST in Texas Chair Ray Almgren.

A few important things to note:

• UIL has elected to pilot FIRST Tech Challenge and FIRST Robotics Competition, along with BEST Robotics.
• FIRST & BEST will operate independently of each other.
• The UIL pilot does not in ANY way change or impact the regular FIRST season. All Texas teams will be able to participate in FIRST programs and competitions the same way they have in the past.
• The robotics pilot for FIRST will include one state championship event on July 28th-30th, 2016 at the Austin Convention Center in Austin, TX. It will occur in conjunction with the Texas Robot Roundup; Criteria for participation in the UIL championship component of the event will be announced in the spring of 2016.

For more information and a detailed FAQ, please visit the UIL Robotics website.

Look for an opportunity to learn more in your area this spring:

• 3/9-3/12: FIRST Alamo Regional: Henry B. Gonzales Convention Center, San Antonio
• 3/23-3/26: FIRST Dallas Regional: Irving Convention Center
• 3/31-4/3: FIRST Hub City Regional: United Markets Arena, Lubbock
• 4/6-4/9: FIRST Lone Star Regional: George R. Brown Convention Center, Houston

For more information from FIRST in Texas, you can visit the FIRST in Texas UIL page or contact FIRST in Texas.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

This is awesome news, Jess! Welcome to the club! I know MN's partnership with the Minnesota State High School League (equivalent to the UIL, I think) has done a lot for our program over the past 4 years, and I look forward to seeing how this helps you guys grow!

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

This great news still sad we won't be able to play with the other teams since half our students are from a non-UIL school.

Jess is this going to interfer with Roundup?

Edit:
Oh, I think I see what they are doing. This is sort of weird. So it's going to be part of Roundup as like a side award?

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Announcement indicates that it in no way changes a thing about how FIRST or BEST operate in Texas. It mostly adds the UIL designation to the "sport for the mind" and another compelling reason for schools in Texas to do robotics.

Also note that the FIRST partnership will include both FTC and FRC!

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Hi Allen,

I updated my post to reflect the information you cited. All the details are still being ironed out, but non-UIL teams will be able to participate at TRR as they always have. UIL will recognize UIL eligible teams in some yet to be determined way. Stay tuned for more details this spring!

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Is this kinda a prelude to districts for Texas because it seems like it the reason I bring it up is because there was talk about Texas moving to districts sometime in the future

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

The partnership with UIL is separate from the district model. However, we are still working on implementing the district model in Texas in the near future.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

There are two things I quite don't understand.

1) What does UIL bring to table ?

edit: After watching Ray's video the answer seems to be a) it partly solves a funding issues for schools

2) Why doesn't UIL acknowledge the existing system instead of creating a parallel system ???

edit: and b) it creates a state championship because Texas isn't a District yet.

am I missing any other key points ?

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Hi Ed,

1) The UIL is a huge thing in Texas. It "legitimizes" extra-curricular school activities. It's not just a funding thing. School administrators are more inclined to provide a variety of types of support for existing teams and to start new teams because it is now a UIL activity.

2) It is not creating a separate system. It is joining on with one that already exists. No changes are made to FIRST as it exists; the UIL simply recognizes it as an official activity and joins in to provide further recognition of eligible schools. (As I noted above: The UIL pilot does not in ANY way change or impact the regular FIRST season. All Texas teams will be able to participate in FIRST programs and competitions the same way they have in the past.) You can compare what's happening with Texas with what already occurred in Minnesota, Arizona, and Connecticut; I welcome folks from those areas to chime in with how it has impacted their state, schools, teams, etc.

Also, consider reading more about the UIL here: http://www.uiltexas.org/about

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

I attended our AIA (Arizona Interscholastic Association) State Championship last year and it was great. You can view the guide to the event from last year here: http://aiaonline.org/files/14680/aia...de-2014-15.pdf .

We did not have to pay entry fee, the event was at a great venue, and the top 30 teams in the state were invited to compete. I believe the scoring system is similar to districts, and it is included in the guide above. It was a lot more low key than official regionals (visitors weren't technically aloud in the pit and spirit from teams was pretty lacking), but still a great opportunity to include a new community in FIRST.

On whether non UIL students will be able to compete: I'm not saying that Texas will turn out just like Arizona, but the team I mentor is a public charter school that previously had no affiliation with the AIA, and we had no issues whatsoever, so hopefully this will not be a problem for you.

edit: sorry, I didn't realize they had already posted the information barring non UIL teams

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

From the FAQs on the UIL page, it says "Participation in the UIL Robotics State Championships is open to teams composed of students from UIL member schools."

How does this affect teams with students both in a UIL member school but also has students from outside the school (i.e homeschool and the like)? Will they be able to participate with the team in future UIL robotics activities?

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

10-4 on item(1)

My concern about (2) is the the 'state championship'. Right now Texas is multiple regionals without a state champ. Under UIL you will have a state champ, but not inside the sanctioned FIRST system. Going to a Texas district can resolve this if the systems are converged. Without the convergence,when Texas goes district then you have two champs, one FIRST sanctioned, one not, which would be confusing as say two (dare I say it) two world championships. eh ? Hopefully when Texas goes district it would have only one state champion and it would be sanctioned by FIRST.

A reason I'm pressing on this is because of this chart.
http://kellrobotics.org/files/model/...ry_for_web.pdf

We use this chart to describe a lot of points about Informal Learning. Using FIRST as an example, then FIRST is a sanctioning body similar to the NCAA, and the districts are similar to the NCAA divisions.


Another question that someone will ask is "how does this differ from at CTSO in conveying legitimacy?". I know some supers look to the CTSO endorsements.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

The issue is that UIL is still a separate organization and not affiliated with all Texas High Schools (private and charter schools are rarely UIL schools).

After looking at this throughout the day I'm actually very pleased with the route UIL has chosen to go. To sum up my view of it, they have chosen to not actually "do" anything. They won't be hosting any of their own events or excluding any of the non-UIL teams from participating in events (a large fare for a lot of teams). They also won't be forcing joint teams to split up, most UIL activities has to be sponsored by a single school where we have a lot of FRC teams that are from a combination of schools. Giving their approval to Robotics is a good step forward and will allow the competitions to be legitimized in the eyes of some people who don't really understand our sport yet.

I'm not worried if UIL continues to crown a champion even after we move to districts. They can use the district point system and which ever UIL qualifying team earns the most points during the season can be the "UIL Robotics FRC Division Champion", that is perfectly fine with me. (This would mean we could have 3 Texas FRC State Champions, that win the District Championship, and a 4th separate UIL State Champion.)

If they start excluding teams form events I'll have a problem with it but as it stands I'm pretty happy. Just hoping they realize that they shouldn't pick just two robotics competitions and open it up to all of them VEX, BotBall, MATE, etc. Different events/competitions are better suited for different schools/teachers/students and as long as we are inspiring STEM I don't see the need for anyone to choose sides.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Texas is following pretty much the same path as Minnesota and Arizona - a separate "offseason" state championship with invites based on rankings. Connecticut is a little different - being smaller, everyone gets in. The ranking system Minnesota and Arizona use is a slightly modified district ranking system - modified to account for most teams attending just one event, and to help encourage more participation in the Chairman's award (which, by the way, has done great things for us!). I'm the one who ran the official numbers for both MN and Arizona last year, and have already talked with Texas at champs last year about bringing them in as well. It's a nice automated system I created, fully tested and verified, which is a whole lot better than the manual calculations we did a few years ago.

As for the potential for two championships down the road... I would trust that the planning committee and UIL are thinking about it in the back of their minds - I know we are in MN. No idea yet exactly how things will shake out, but I do know that the State trophies here are a big thing for teams - in many cases bigger than regional or champs awards. The state trophies are exactly the same as the ones other sports get, which helps teams to increase recognition and understanding within their school. After all, it's just one more sport at that point, not some goofy robotics thing that has awards you don't recognize or know what they mean. I know, it's a little odd thinking about it that way, but you have to shift your view to that of an outsider passing the trophy case in the hall that knows nothing of FIRST. To them, our trophies don't mean much.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Connecticut isn't quite there yet. Sure, we've had a State Championship event for 3 years now, and I've even heard them declare FIRST Robotics to be a sport at those events. However, it's my understanding that the sports governing bodies within the state have not done so (unless very recently).

Within our school system we are considered a club, more like the marching band than a sports team.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Do Minnesota or Arizona have state champs that non-eligible teams (not just non-UIL teams in Texas' case, but teams that just didn't qualify too) can compete in? I think that logistically is what could cause the most headaches, or at least questions.

From the FAQ TRR will not exclude any teams from joining - nor would I want them to. However, if the UIL "state champs" is determined by performance at TRR, does that mean that there will be consideration to the schedule? If a team that is trying to win the state champs has multiple matches paired with various pre-rookies (or other teams that don't qualify for the state champs, or on the flip side maybe some really awesome bots/teams that aren't UIL eligible) then that seems kind of weird to me.

Also, if teams that want to be eligible for the UIL state champs need to bag their robot to compete in late July (a minimum of about 2 months after their last event) - I also see that as a negative.

I see a lot of benefits to being in the UIL pilot program for sure, and maybe there was pressure to join now since BEST is joining and we didn't want to get left behind - but it sure does seem like it would work a lot smoother to crown UIL state champs based on the highest ranked eligible team based on district points - which hopefully is right around the corner.

I guess worst case scenario is we have one or two more seasons where a UIL state champs is kind of kludgey, and then hopefully something that makes a little more sense. Or perhaps something will come out in the spring and it'll just be robot performance at regionals, and then some completely other criteria at TRR.

<s>or maybe Texas changes to districts between now and Feb 23rd</s>

Looking forward to more information as it comes out - especially because I've always been under the impression that UIL doesn't allow district wide teams. Even with all the questions I think it raises, I'm glad that I can start telling the school district that FIRST is now in a UIL pilot program - it could be a huge help for us.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

All FRC teams in MN are eligible for the State Championship and to win the trophies. The Championship is an invite-only event, based on performance during the season. Every team is ranked according to the points they earn in a modified district point structure, and the top 30 are invited. If any of them decline, we continue down the list to ensure a full field of 30 at the event. It's worked out pretty well for us... I believe there's only 1 team that's been at all 4 state championships since we started, which means participation is getting spread around a bit!

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

I totally second this for Arizona. We've only had one Championship, last year, but it's been fantastic. It's nice to get to see teams post-championship and it serves as a good send off for senior members of a good start for drive teams with new members. We had a lot of pretty important people who were not able to make the other two regionals, but we're able to make this event.

Wirg the new AIA partnership a lot of Arizona teams are now able to hand out varsity letters for robotics. I was wondering if Minnesota also does this, and if Texas was planning on doing so.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Yes, many teams in MN offer lettering. I don't, unfortunately, have any numbers to know how many, but I would guess we'll over half. MSHSL ran a competition a few years back to design a standardized lettering patch for robotics: http://mnfirst.org/content/mshsl-lettering-patch

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Texas already has 4 off-season events between June-Oct and we are probably adding a 5th this summer so having extra events isn't really an issue for us. We also have off-season events in Arkansas and Louisiana that teams can go to as well.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

I don't know how your events are run (obviously), but in MN there's just a different feel for the State Championship versus our other 3 off season events. The other events are minimally staffed, run by teams out of their school gyms. The State Championship has a full event staff (upwards of 100 people) of experienced volunteers, run the same as a real event. There's load-in, inspection, quals, playoffs, awards, and it's set up at the U, where we hold the 10,000 Lakes Regional. It's run at the end of the school year, so it's the final event for the season, while the other off seasons are really run at the beginning of the school year, providing an intro into the next season. At least for us, the event really stands out as something special.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

UIL has already said that won't be what is happening in Texas. I understand how MN works but that is very different from what Texas is doing.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

This sounds like a great event, that a team would be really proud to be invited to.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

The first FIRST event that I was involved in was run in a gym in Texas. That gym based competition regularly has in it teams 57, 118, 148, 457, 624, 2158, 2468, 2587, 3847, and a bunch of other world class teams. the level of help that those teams give (including robots for pre-rookie teams to use) is incredible. Don't underrate the power of those "small" off season competitions. They were also extremely well run and the direct and intense attention given to the "new kids" is amazing.

Having another event in Texas (or anywhere else) is always welcome. I do hope to see more an more of them. I am just not sure it has to be all that much larger.

From all I have heard and seen Texas is moving to a district system. I will make up my mind on whether or not it is a good thing when I see how it turns out.

In terms of UIL... More support to FIRST is a good thing. The way that they are approaching this seems like a good path. The level of inclusion does not seem so great though. Nothing like excluding the teams that are based on Girl Scout Troops (Go Lady Cans!), Boy Scout Troops, Explorer groups (Screaming Chickens!), home schoolers (My own daughters), most secular private schools, K-12 online public school students, religious private schools (Go Iron Fangs!) and any other non-Texas Education Agency (TEA) or Texas Private School Accreditation Commission (TEPSAC) accredited group.

There is a very large section of the FRC population that will not be recognized by UIL.

At this point I think it is good for FIRST to have UIL support. I just hope that UIL will at some point be a bit more open to diverse groups.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

This conversation has been going on for a while here in Texas.

University Interscholastic League was the first organization of its kind. It started as an organization to govern the Debate league in Texas. It is the governing body for school activities including athletic, academic and music contest for primarily public schools in the state of Texas. It is a membership association of schools. A few private schools have joined the ranks in primarily athletic contests.

Last October, UIL held the executive council meeting and there were 9-10 different speakers who addressed the council including BEST, VEX, FIRST, Texas Computer Educators Association and several mentors from teams. Many spoke on the impact their program had on students as well as schools. I believe they were very shocked to have that many speakers there for Robotics/STEM.

UIL declares a champion in all high school sanctioned activities in the state. In fact, sports have multiple champions due to school size classifications.

They have made it very clear that non UIL schools will not be eligible to compete for the UIL state championship. Many of the concerns raised from several people was the fact that districts are coming and will we declare a champion in addition to the district champions. I do not believe that UIL will be more open in the future in this area due to their current policies.

UIL will not effect FIRST competitions and qualifications for Champs.

UIL sanctioning of robotics is a good thing I believe. As Jess says, it legitimizes extra curricular activities in the state. Schools that do not have robotics at this point will and have received official notification and information from UIL. This does provides validity in support from a state agency. At this point, it does not mean more finances but it may provide more evidence and pressure of government and legislatures. Obviously Michigan is proof of a state getting on board with financing from the state.

It will be interesting to see if the event stays in conjunction with TRR in the future.

Re: FIRST in Texas Partners with UIL (University Interscholastic League)
 

Two questions.
1) How will teams that span multiple campuses be included in this, as it is on a school by school basis?

2) Have any details been released on selection process for states?