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-   -   Two Boulder Auto (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=141180)

GaryVoshol 10-01-2016 16:42
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by christheman200 (Post 1520382)
You could also have one bot kick all the mid-line balls over to the low bar for another bot to fire. If any two teams can pull this off they'd ensure a win.
Huh? You're giving all the BOULDERS to your opponents? I'm not sure how that results in a win.

Remember this rule
Quote:
G13
During AUTO, ROBOTS may not enter the volume above the MIDLINE.
How are you planning to kick the BOULDER toward your teammates without going over the MIDLINE?

Justin Montois 10-01-2016 16:42
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rich2202 (Post 1519327)
What's the over/under on the number of bots on Einstein that will do it?
3.5

I'll take the over.

Jaxom 10-01-2016 16:51
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHolyHades1 (Post 1519141)
Unless the stars align perfectly, I doubt this would be possible in the given time even with a very fast chassis.
I'm not trying to pick on you, but I wish I had a nickle for every comment I've seen on CD saying [X capability] was impossible, but was demonstrated by one or more teams during the season or at Champs. I'm pretty sure the fund would be bigger than my 401K. :yikes:

ICE_Bear 10-01-2016 20:57
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSOSDev (Post 1518952)
I don't think you can carry anymore than one ball at any given time due to rule G38 in section 3.4.9.

3.4.9 BOULDER Rules
G38 ROBOTS may not control more than one (1) BOULDER at any time.
Violation: FOUL per extra BOULDER

Moving or positioning a BOULDER to gain advantage is considered
“control.”
Examples include, but are not limited to:
A. “carrying” (holding BOULDERS inside a ROBOT)
My team had a huge debate today about moving the boulders. You can't carry the boulders? And if you can, when is it considered controlling. And what's considered a "gained advantage?" We are also wondering that if you can't position the boulder, then how do you make any goals at all?

BBaltrusch 10-01-2016 21:03
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
G33 Boulders can only be introduced to the field during teleop.
G34 No more than 6 boulders may be in the castle at *any* time. Must immediately introduce excess boulders.

If an alliance does get 4 boulders in auto, the rules say the opposing alliance gets a foul. I don't see this as a violation of G11 as the intent is to score points, not cause a foul on the opponents.

FrankJ 10-01-2016 21:06
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE_Bear (Post 1520575)
My team had a huge debate today about moving the boulders. You can't carry the boulders? And if you can, when is it considered controlling. And what's considered a "gained advantage?" We are also wondering that if you can't position the boulder, then how do you make any goals at all?

You can control one bolder at a time. so if you are not carrying a boulder, you can push others around. If you are carrying a boulder you cannot intentionally herd other boulders. Somewhat a judgment call if you are herding or bulldozing. The Referee's judgment, not yours, :]

dmorewood 10-01-2016 21:09
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by christheman200 (Post 1520382)
You could also have one bot kick all the mid-line balls over to the low bar for another bot to fire. If any two teams can pull this off they'd ensure a win.
This is a foul

BBaltrusch 10-01-2016 21:14
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmorewood (Post 1520595)
This is a foul
As long as you don't enter the midline volume and the boulders just get close to but not cross the defenses, it's legal. You're saving your fast shooter travel time, they'd still have to cross the defenses themselves though.

wildwaffle 10-01-2016 21:16
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Although this idea is creative, it is not likely that many teams will succeed(much less try). If somebody does do it though, get it on camera. I want to see that.

kitare102 10-01-2016 21:19
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
I'm not a reliable source of manual info, but I remember seeing that the judging for reaching a defense is to the discretion of the field judge (proper name escaping me atm), and that they are instructed to rule against the team if there is any question of whether you've crossed the defense line or not. I'd assume it's the same for crossing the midline, meaning I'd be hesitant to even get within two inches of it, seeing as you might get ruled against anyways. Seems like too much of a risk to put in the hands of limited sensor fidelity and possible ostables unaccounted for.

evanperryg 10-01-2016 21:46
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHolyHades1 (Post 1519141)
Ignoring the technicality of possibly not being able to grab the ball from the middle, is it even possible to do that much field movement in the given amount of time? Let's say you start essentially touching one of the defenses. Cross the defense in a second or two (minimum for the fastest, which is the low bar). Align and shoot in a few seconds. Work your way back across the obstacle. Find and obtain another ball. Again go across the obstacle, and shoot again.

Unless the stars align perfectly, I doubt this would be possible in the given time even with a very fast chassis.
I wouldn't eliminate the possibility, we've seen some pretty crazy autos before, and I wouldn't be surprised to see someone show up with something insane by champs. It'll be especially hard with the terrain, but that doesn't mean it's impossible.

Lil' Lavery 10-01-2016 22:09
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
I'd be inclined to say most two boulder autonomous modes come from the spy bot.

MikLast 10-01-2016 22:15
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitare102 (Post 1520615)
field judge (proper name escaping me atm)
A ref or Head ref if the ref isint sure.

AlexanderTheOK 10-01-2016 22:21
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Considering the size of the balls, your margin of error would be several inches. Considering the fact that FRC teams dont have access to any global localization on the field, I can't see any modern sensors allowing that level of precision.

Caleb Sykes 10-01-2016 22:54
Re: Two Boulder Auto
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexanderTheOK (Post 1520677)
Considering the size of the balls, your margin of error would be several inches. Considering the fact that FRC teams dont have access to any global localization on the field, I can't see any modern sensors allowing that level of precision.
This. Any team that consistently can pick a ball up from the center will also be consistently at risk of violating G13. There will certainly be teams that do it, but I don't think that enough people are giving this rule the respect it deserves.


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