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-   -   Al's 2016 Inspection Thread (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144647)

Al Skierkiewicz 02-04-2016 07:50

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Everyone,
I want to remind those teams headed to champs that it is possible something passed at your regional event that will not pass at Champs. This often the case. Items you may want to check is bumpers (3/4" plywood, or other substantial wood), everything inside the Frame Perimeter at the start of the match, 120" Frame Perimeter (not even 1/4" over), Robot height, and bumper frame backing and height. If you have a question about something you are worried about, please ask now. You can PM me or ask in public. I don't want any team to be surprised when they get to St. Louis.
Yes it happens more than you know.

GeeTwo 02-04-2016 19:27

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz (Post 1566403)
Everyone,
I want to remind those teams headed to champs that it is possible something passed at your regional event that will not pass at Champs.

The converse may also be true. Our pickup rake last year (Recycle Rush) featured about 30 spring-cushioned 10-32 bolts. It failed inspection based on the "unsafe operation" threshold at Bayou. We mitigated at Bayou with some heat shrink tubing, and designed a new pickup for CMP that we did not like as well. After a few matches, we put the original rake (from which we had removed the mitigating heat shrink) back on and passed a re-inspection where it was the most significant change.

Al Skierkiewicz 04-04-2016 08:48

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
OK,
We have passed through several weeks of competition and above all, electrical issues are the greatest problem for teams. At Midwest over the weekend, around twenty field issues turned out to be electrical issues on robots. So here is some reminders for those who have upcoming events and the Champs.

1. Be sure to crimp the #6 terminals properly and tug test everything. We solder all of them as insurance. (see my post from last night on how to crimp if you do not have a tool)
2. Loose #6 terminals (on the PDP, main breaker or battery) will produce brownout or loss of primary electrical power. If it moves, it is resistive. Even tight connections will loosen in this game. Check your batteries now.
3. Secure the radio power at both ends. If it moves during the game, the radio will drop or reboot. The radio takes 50 seconds to reboot. That is along time to sit there doing nothing for your alliance.
4. Make sure that the fuses on the end of the PDP are firmly pushed all the way in.
5. Make sure there are no 'whiskers' that will short adjacent conductors on any electrical component.
6. Do not run electrical cable near moving parts including parts that move unintentionally. It is not uncommon to wear through the insulation and short the cable when continuously abraded by moving parts.
7. Check all of the above after every match!

Wayne Doenges 04-04-2016 09:31

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
I know some people will scoff at this but FRC Team 1501 hot glues all connectors into the radio. We have NEVER had a connector come out.

At World's I had a team that had 1/2" plywood backing their bumpers, so things can slip by.

I heard a funny story about Al doing his LRI thing. He was talking to a student about a problem with their robot. The student said to Al "I want to talk to someone of higher authority." Who is higher than Al?

Al Skierkiewicz 04-04-2016 09:39

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wayne Doenges (Post 1567251)
I heard a funny story about Al doing his LRI thing. He was talking to a student about a problem with their robot. The student said to Al "I want to talk to someone of higher authority." Who is higher than Al?

True story. I often remove the vest and work under other LRIs to support them incognito. This team had something that was illegal and was challenging the LRI (a Champs division LRI) at the event. He asked me to step in and deliver a decision. The team member did not know who I was and he responded...
"With all due respect, I would like to ask a higher authority for a ruling." The event LRI had to turn away to keep from laughing. I was able to keep it under control and responded, "I am the Chief Robot Inspector and it doesn't get much higher." The team mentor recognized me at that point and they changed out the offending part.

IKE 04-04-2016 09:46

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz (Post 1567237)
OK,
...snip...
2. Loose #6 terminals (on the PDP, main breaker or battery) will produce brownout or loss of primary electrical power. If it moves, it is resistive. Even tight connections will loosen in this game. Check your batteries now.
...snip...
7. Check all of the above after every match!

Having now attended 5 events in 5 weeks, this has been a killer. Please, please, add these to pit check lists.
As an LRI, once everyone has passed, this is an item I try to verify on every single robot. I typically do this in the queue before matches.

My tug is not terribly hard, but teams I have specifically tugged connections have had a failure later on (IE a couple matches later). This means that historically decent connections are coming loose. Though on occasion it has been due to teams disconnecting and reconnecting the breaker)

Starting week 4 this year I take a 7/16 wrench with me. To help tighten lugs on main breaker.
I have been in serious debate on whether or not to bring a small torque wrench and torqueing each of those leads to the spec (or roughly 75-80% of max torque callout). I may end up doing that for MSC/Worlds.

Richard Wallace 04-04-2016 10:03

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by IKE (Post 1567260)
... Starting week 4 this year I take a 7/16 wrench with me. To help tighten lugs on main breaker.
I have been in serious debate on whether or not to bring a small torque wrench and torqueing each of those leads to the spec (or roughly 75-80% of max torque callout). I may end up doing that for MSC/Worlds.

Looking for a small torque wrench now. Main breaker lugs are 1/4-28 and their rated torque is 50 inch-pound. [edit: found Texton 24320 at Meijer.]

Battery terminal wrench sizes vary from team to team -- make sure you know what size wrenches YOUR battery terminals require. Have those, a knife, and some electrical tape handy in the queue in case you need to repair a loose battery terminal connection. Of course it is always good to have a spare battery handy as well.

Al Skierkiewicz 07-04-2016 09:17

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
OK,
Champs is around the corner. Please check the public schedule as pit times and Qualifying start has changed from last year. If you are headed to Champs please remember to have your B&T form accessible at Champs. For inspection you will need to have your CAW available either in printed form or on a laptop as part of the inspection process. It is our intention to have inspections completed by Wednesday night, pit close. We can only do that with your help. When pits open to five team members, please unpack your robots so that your crate can be moved out of the pits. We will be working with teams for the first hour and will begin the inspection process as soon as possible. When ready to start inspection, come to your division inspection station with your bumpers removed from the robot. We will weigh bumpers and robot separately and check your frame perimeter at that time. An inspector will be assigned to you and inspections will be completed in your pit.
To remind everyone...This is the big show. Things that may have been missed or passed at your event inspection will need to be corrected at Champs. This is true of bumpers, motors, and wiring. Be prepared!
I am getting pretty excited, I hope you are. Good luck everyone!

jspatz1 07-04-2016 09:37

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Al, will completed inspection be required for Wednesday practice matches?

Richard Wallace 07-04-2016 09:58

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jspatz1 (Post 1569091)
Al, will completed inspection be required for Wednesday practice matches?

I am not Al.

For all the years I have been inspecting, our goal has been to get teams playing by the rules as soon as they can. I think this is the intent of section 5.5.2, third paragraph:
Quote:

Originally Posted by Manual
5.5.2 Eligibility and Inspection

This section describes the rules governing MATCH participation. A Team has participated in a MATCH if any member of their DRIVE TEAM is in the CASTLE or the SPY BOX, with or without the ROBOT on the FIELD, at the start of the MATCH.

At each event, the Lead ROBOT Inspector (LRI) has final authority on the legality of any COMPONENT, MECHANISM, or ROBOT. Inspectors may re-Inspect ROBOTS to ensure compliance with the rules.

ROBOTS are permitted to participate in scheduled Practice MATCHES prior to passing Inspection. However, the FIRST Technical Advisor (FTA), LRI or Head REFEREE may determine at any time that the ROBOT is unsafe, per Section 3 (3.4.1 Safety Rules), and may prohibit further participation in Practice MATCHES until the condition is corrected and the ROBOT passes Inspection.

If I am assigned to inspect your robot at CMP and, during the inspection, time comes for your team to queue for a practice match, I will stay with the team in queue and continue the inspection -- UNLESS (1) I have seen a potential safety issue that should be brought to the attention of my LRI, or (2) my LRI tells me that the inspection must be completed in the team's pit.

rich2202 07-04-2016 10:20

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
I am not Al either, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night ....

Given the schedule, it looks like each team gets ONE practice match. A primary goal being to make sure that all robots are connecting to the field before Qualification Matches start in the morning.

Like Richard said, you don't have to pass inspection to participate in the Practice Matches (assuming that a field person doesn't disqualify you for safety reasons). But, if you want to be in the filler line for practice matches (if there is one), then you do have to have passed inspection.

If I am inspecting a robot, and they are called to Que, I would send them off, and finish the inspection when they get back. If no other teams are waiting to be inspected, it would make sense to continue the inspection in the que.

Al Skierkiewicz 07-04-2016 11:10

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Please remember that you do not need to be inspected to practice. You do have to have bumpers attached to practice.

orangemoore 07-04-2016 11:22

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz (Post 1569134)
Please remember that you do not need to be inspected to practice. You do have to have bumpers attached to practice.

Do you need the correct bumper color for practice?

If you ran out of time to change them?

Nyxyxylyth 07-04-2016 11:26

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by orangemoore (Post 1569140)
Do you need the correct bumper color for practice?

If you ran out of time to change them?

I saw a practice match with 6 red bumpers at one district. Got a little confusing in the neutral zone!

rich2202 07-04-2016 11:39

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by orangemoore (Post 1569140)
Do you need the correct bumper color for practice?

I lot is forgiven (ignored) for the practice rounds.

Bumpers - check.
Rio/Driver Station correct team number - check.
Anything look hazardous - check.

Al Skierkiewicz 07-04-2016 11:40

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
I don't know how the rule will be enforced during practice. It may be a time when refs are being tested/re-learning and having the wrong color might confuse that process.

Richard Wallace 07-04-2016 11:48

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz (Post 1569153)
I don't know how the rule will be enforced during practice. It may be a time when refs are being tested/re-learning and having the wrong color might confuse that process.

At some districts, practice matches are run without referees.

I doubt that will happen at DCMPs or CMP divisions. Referees want to make sure all matches are scored correctly, and practice is the only way to improve. When teams try their best to practice the same way they will play, that enables volunteers to do the same.

IndySam 07-04-2016 13:18

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Can't say I have ever seen a lot of practice reffing at Champs. Lots of times the field crew or FTA's are running the scoring pads to keep matches moving.

EricH 07-04-2016 20:32

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz (Post 1569153)
I don't know how the rule will be enforced during practice. It may be a time when refs are being tested/re-learning and having the wrong color might confuses that process.

FTFY. Trust me, it really badly confuses the process. Really, Really badly.

And yes, I've seen that firsthand.

DonRotolo 07-04-2016 21:11

Re: Al's 2016 Inspection Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wayne Doenges (Post 1567251)
Who is higher than Al?

Al, Just Say No. :rolleyes:


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