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-   -   Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5 (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144864)

BenGuy 27-02-2016 23:03
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Scores were a lot higher than I personally expected them to be, at least compared to last year. Our first match last year was 2-0 :D

Boltman 27-02-2016 23:19
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenGuy (Post 1548212)
Scores were a lot higher than I personally expected them to be, at least compared to last year. Our first match last year was 2-0 :D
Last year required a certain amount of engineering moving a big tote is rather hard for a kitbot.

This year almost any bot can "score" and not as much engineering is required. However to do well is a challenge, I feel this game is a leveling game in many respects because the outcome can be directly affected by a change in strategy or robot fatigue.

I am excited to see the very high levels of play this year, a challenge for sure but seems to be real fun. I don't see any one type of dominate bot this year. I do believe like last year, perfect alliance selection and absolute teamwork will win it all.

AGPapa 27-02-2016 23:22
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DareDad (Post 1548193)
Of course if you don't try for the breach, you are sure to be out of the top 10.
True, but if it's late in the first day/early in the second day a lot of teams already know (or at least think they know) that they won't be top 10.


Quote:
Originally Posted by anishde (Post 1548199)
It's just not wise to avoid trying to improve your rank. Remember, you earn 5 points for crossing defenses the first two times you cross them. Therefore, it just comes down to common sense that earning 5 points from the batter isn't worth as much as earning 5 points for crossing the 4th defense AND earning one RP, assuming that you have the capabilities to do so.
I'm not claiming that not caring about rank is wise. I'm claiming that it is what teams do. If it's the end of the match I think a lot of teams will try and get easy challenge points instead of risking a more difficult defense (there is a reason this defense wasn't crossed earlier, it's hard to do!).

I've attached an example of co-op points from week 3 last year. The numbers in the 'co-op' column are the average co-op points scored each match at each event. It's pretty clear that, at least in week 3 of 2015, Regional teams cared less about their rank than District Teams.

Knufire 27-02-2016 23:25
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
1 Attachment(s)
Since not everyone knows this tab exists on TBA, I'll just leave this here.

Boltman 27-02-2016 23:37
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Knufire (Post 1548223)
Since not everyone knows this tab exists on TBA, I'll just leave this here.
Where is that tab? I looked and couldn't find it. Thanks.

CalTran 27-02-2016 23:51
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltman (Post 1548230)
Where is that tab? I looked and couldn't find it. Thanks.
Insights tab, right next to Teams.

Drakxii 28-02-2016 00:06
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Anyone have the shot percent numbers? I am curious if shooting was actually hard or did hardly anyone try.

Boltman 28-02-2016 00:26
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalTran (Post 1548244)
Insights tab, right next to Teams.
When I go there it gives me a historical overview (2015-earlier) on the web...2016 is not even listed yet.

Is it possibly just an android app thing?

Anteprefix 28-02-2016 00:29
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltman (Post 1548267)
When I go there it gives me a historical overview (2015-earlier) on the web...2016 is not even listed yet.

Is it possibly just an android app thing?
It was implemented very recently, so I'd imagine so. You should see it if you visit the actual website.

Anthony Galea 28-02-2016 00:31
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltman (Post 1548267)
When I go there it gives me a historical overview (2015-earlier) on the web...2016 is not even listed yet.

Is it possibly just an android app thing?
You have to go to the event page, and there is a subcategory selection bar (Results, Rankings, Awards, Teams, Insights) that you have to go to Insights.

Boltman 28-02-2016 00:38
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3175student17 (Post 1548274)
You have to go to the event page, and there is a subcategory selection bar (Results, Rankings, Awards, Teams, Insights) that you have to go to Insights.
Nevermind I found it ..thanks

Donut 28-02-2016 01:29
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JG1902 (Post 1548163)
The low goal was surprisingly difficult for a lot of teams. Without any propulsion, the ball just kinda slid down the slope whenever teams would try to score there.
This surprised me, I would have thought for sure we would see more low goal capable bots given how important capturing is for the playoffs. There were ~100 more high goals than low goals. Sounds like everyone went high if they were bothering with scoring boulders at all, and since most shooters probably can't be adjusted well for scoring in the low goal those that were ineffective just didn't score. Saw a few matches today where an alliance would breach and then not have much else to do until the end game.

Another takeaway from this event is that every event, and especially the playoff matches, will be a war of attrition. #2 alliance got knocked out in the semis with 1296 having motor issues, and 179's only loss was a match where they got tortuga'd by the moat. Everybody broke in Finals match 2. Dr. Joe already had to hand out his first gift card and it isn't even week 1 yet. Think of what's going to happen once teams actually start playing defense.

pandamonium 28-02-2016 01:44
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Low goal is harder than teams think and more time consuming. It is easier and more realistic to take 3 high goal shots and only make 2 than to put 5 into the low goal.

marshall 28-02-2016 01:45
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
The defenses are brutal on drivetrains and I'm not of the opinion that the wooden team versions provide the same difficulty that the actual ones provide. We managed to crack some versa hubs (https://twitter.com/FRC900/status/703693490752978945). Thanks to 1296 for graciously providing us with some aluminum replacements. Team 900 loves #TeamIFI!

Matches ran WAY behind schedule and I really think the defense selection process will be changed before too long to help the match reset times. This field is quite the process for volunteers too.

I've got more but I need to get some sleep.

msigalov 28-02-2016 02:03
Re: Real vs. Theory, Week 0.5
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltman (Post 1548149)
My takeaways watching the streams... Just my far away observations

1. Low scoring for the most part (30-70), with most points via breaching defenses along the way
2. Lots and lots of dead, stalled stuck bots
3. Lots of penalties
4. Auto points disappointing, best seemed to be 3 crossing (30) very rare
5. Scaling rare and many tried and failed, only a handful of really good ones
6. Hard to crack 100
7. Very hard to Capture the castle (only happened in eliminations)
8. Lots of bots seemed "confused" and lots and lots of misses on goals.
9 Wheeled bots getting stuck on defenses
10. Bad time management at end many missed challenges (5 points)
11. Climbers can crash on bots below, and bad time management as running out of time to climb.
12. Not much defense played until Eliminations.

As a side note impressed by the bots that could score HG while being harassed..I was surprised by that since the defense driver has way better vision and "should" be able to knock a bot off course

In all it was well played considering it was first competition up, we compete next weekend so I'll give some firsthand insight after next week. Glad Palmetto gave us some insights.
Doesn't only one breach in auto count? I thought I read something in the rules about that.


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