IN District Championship
 

This thread may be a little early, but I'm already excited for IN DCMP! Here is a list of teams going:

45
71
135
234
292
447
461
829
868
1018
1024
1501
1529
1720
1741
1747
2171
2197
3147
3176
3180
3487 (In by 3947 decline)
3559
3936
3940
(3947 declined if I'm not mistaken?)
4103
4580
4982
5403
5484
5944
6012

Let's have some good discussion now without try to take too much away from the awesome INsight account (I'm expecting that post somewhat soon ;)). Will 1024 win all the IN events this year? Who do you think will be ranked #1 at the event? Who will win Chairman's and Engineering Inspiration? Will Indiana be the most competitive district this year? Other topics of discussion?

Eligible for Chairman's: 1747, 868, 1741
Eligible for Engineering Inspiration: 2197, 461, 135
Eligible for Rookie All Star: 6012

Already qualified to worlds: 45 (Legacy Team), 868 (Won a Regional)
Will qualify for worlds: 6012 (only team able to win Rookie All start at IN DCMPS)

Indiana World Champs Spots
3 Winners
1 Chairman's Award
1 Engineering Inspiration Award
1 Rookie All Star Award
Next 2 highest teams by district points (originally was 3 but 1 was taken away when 868 won the regional)
1 Legacy Team (45)
1 Regional Winner (868)
0 Wait List teams (so far. May add some in next few weeks.)

Re: IN District Championship
 

Aluminosity is excited to be attending!
1024 is definitely the favorite after the three district events. Can't wait to see how it all plays out and hope that we can send some really competitive robots to take on Einstein. Good luck to everybody.

Re: IN District Championship
 

As of now only 10 Indiana teams will be sent to worlds, since 868's regional win does not add a spot to Indiana's total.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Winning a regional does not create a new spot at the World Champs, so the current total should be 10.

Re: IN District Championship
 

I should have specified. Technically, there are still 9 spots for the Indiana District but there will be at least 11 teams in attendance because of 45 and 868 already qualified and registered outside of the IN District. Therefore, there will still be 11 IN teams no matter what.

Re: IN District Championship
 

I believe this is wrong. From Section 7.4.4 of the 2016 Admin Manual:

Emphasis mine.

Indiana gets 9 slots to World Champs, not counting Original and Sustaining Team 45. 3 of these 9 slots go to the DCMP Chairman's, Engineering Inspiration, and Rookie All-Star Award Winners, and 3 others go to the Winning Alliance of the DCMP (or 4, if there is a backup robot used). This would leave the remaining 3 slots for the next 3 highest ranked teams in the District. However, 1 of these slots has been taken by Team 868, who won the 2016 Queen City Regional, meaning that there are only 2 slots left for the highest ranked Indiana District teams (or just 1 if a backup robot is on the DCMP winning alliance). No matter what, Indiana will be sending 10 teams to World Champs, including Team 45, but excluding any waitlist slots. (if I interpret that correctly).

Re: IN District Championship
 

I'm rooting for my TechHOUNDS... I hope it's not a highest ranked spot they take up ;)

Re: IN District Championship
 

Wow. Learn something new everyday. Isn't that a dumb way to do it though? I mean if 868 won a regional, I feel like they should receive one of the Regional's 6 spots rather than taking away one of IN DCMPS 9 spots since it wasn't earned at the IN DCMPS. Does anyone else agree with me?

So at Queens City Regional, there were 7 teams that qualified to worlds? 6 through the original 6 spots at the Regional and 1 through the IN DCMPS?

What would happen if 4 IN teams won a Regional this year? That'd be an odd situation...

Re: IN District Championship
 

Unfortunately, it is.

Yes (but some people think otherwise)

No, only 6 teams qualified for World Champs at Queen City: 3 winners, 3 Qualifying Awards (RCA, EI, RAS). But 868 qualifying for World Champs through Queen City takes away a slot from Indiana's allocated team count at World Champs.

EDIT: The RCA winner at Queen City (1939) was actually already qualified for World Champs via EI at Greater Kansas City, so a wildcard was given to 4028, the captain of the finalist alliance. But still, only 6 teams advanced from Queen City.

It certainly would be.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Actually, Wait List teams don't count towards that either if I'm not mistaken. Last year, IN sent 14 teams. 10 original spots at IN DCMP, 45 for being a legacy, and 3 wait list teams.

Re: IN District Championship
 

That's correct, I've updated my original post to reflect that. Thanks.

Re: IN District Championship
 

That still isn't adding up then. If there are suppose to be 9 teams from IN and 6 teams from Queen City, That is 15 total. If 868 took 1 of 9 IN Slots, that means that Queens city only sent 5 teams if 868 was apart of that. I figured the wild card that 4028 got was because 868 won...? Either way, Queens city had to have sent 6 other teams other than 868 or 868 didn't take away an IN spot. Things aren't adding up on spots... mass confusion ;)

Re: IN District Championship
 

I'm betting 135 wins EI. I'm not sure who will win Chairman's, because they're all too good at what they due!

Good luck to all teams competing!!!

Re: IN District Championship
 

The answer is 868 accounted for two spots. One from QCR, one from IN.

One more 'random' team will be pulled from waitlist to counter.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Here's hoping that 868 wins Chairman's or the event :D

Re: IN District Championship
 

There has been discussion of this reverse wildcard outcome in MAR threads since they introduced it in 2014. There has been less grumbling about this in the last two years--mostly in my opinion because championships has grown 50%, making it easier to qualify. Now that we have >25 slots and people can come off the waitlist, people feel like there is a good shot--when it was less than 20, people got nervous. I'm sure it's worse for you guys.

BTW, rooting hard for 1747 to bring home two more banners!

Re: IN District Championship
 

You're right, basically one of Indiana's slots goes poof. 868 took a slot from Queen City by winning, but also took an Indiana slot by being from Indiana. Queen City sends 6 teams, including 868, and Indiana gets to send 9 (+ Team 45), also including 868.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Queen City sent 6 teams, one of which is 868. Because 868 is a part of the IN District System, they also count against the 9 teams they are allocated. Effectively they are taking 2 slots to Worlds, one from Queen City and one from Indiana. Most likely that other slot will be filled be a waitlist team.

The situation is similar to 2522 this year (Member of the PNW District System and won EI at the Hawai'i Regional)

Re: IN District Championship
 

So if a district team wins a qualifying spot at a regional, it creates another wait list spot? I feel like it should either A. not affect the district and that team qualifies through the regional spot. or B. It should add another wild card spot at the regional. This rule makes little sense... haha.

Re: IN District Championship
 

I've never heard that this is true. (Misread, read later post below)

If 868 wins either Chairman's or is on the Winning Alliance at the Indiana DCMP, then that World Champs qualifying slot is passed on to the next highest ranked team. If they win both, then two ranking slots open up.

Re: IN District Championship
 

It makes perfect sense.

Ohio folks are probably pretty salty about this district team - who, from their perspective, won't even let them play in its own state in-season - 'stealing' a CMP position from QCR.
So HQ has put in place a way to discourage district teams from playing in regionals. They just stopped short of completely disallowing it.

Re: IN District Championship
 

600 teams go to CMP. If not from the waitlist, where would you find another team?
---
Back on topic, here are my predictions:

The finals matches will feature 1024-1747-3559 v 868-1501-3487. From there, flip a coin.

135 will get EI, 1747 will earn Chairman's, 6012 will receive RAS, and the ninth qualifying team will be 461.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Yeah. Same applies if 6012 wins the event or the EI winner also wins the event. Also applies if a wait list team wins the event or a qualifying award (like 135 did last year by wait listing and winning Chairman's).

Re: IN District Championship
 

Waitlist. But I've never heard that they would bias it to a specific District System to try to "counter" teams qualifying via outside Regionals.

Edit: Taylor, I believe I interpreted your original post wrong. For some reason I thought you meant they would pick a random Indiana team from the waitlist to counter, but rereading it I think you just meant any team on the waitlist, which I agree with. Sorry for the confusion.

Re: IN District Championship
 

I mean I guess this makes sense. If they allowed 868 to take a regional spot and not take an IN spot, then they'd have to allow, for instance, a Michigan team to be allowed to qualify for an IN DCMP spot and maybe take a worlds spot through IN DCMP. But I still want to know what FIRST would do if 4 IN Teams won a regional. Would they take a Winner spot away or an award spot away? I don't think it's ever been thought about too much.

Re: IN District Championship
 

What about your alumni team? Don't you want them to win too?

Re: IN District Championship
 

So, what I'm hearing now is hoping that 868, 45, 6012, or the EI Winner also wins the event? It would add 3 spots to the "next-in" spot of IN since 868 already took a spot in the "next-in" category, 45 already qualified to worlds outside of IN, and 6012 has to win the Rookie All Star Award. Let's root for this alliance if you want to add more "next-in" spots ;).

Re: IN District Championship
 

If 4 IN Teams won a regional, odds are pretty good that there would be overlap on the winning alliance for IN DCMP.

If Indiana were to have 12 teams qualify outside of districts, I'd guess that the district ranking points wouldn't matter and that only the 3 award winners and 3 tournament winners could get in.

Re: IN District Championship
 

That was what I was talking about when I posted that. IF 6012 or the EI winner also wins the event (double banner), it would add to the "next-in" spots in Indiana. By "next-in", I mean the next highest teams by ranking points. Sorry if that was said unclear.

Re: IN District Championship
 

From the 2013 thread on district teams competing at regionals:

For reference, I believe the previous policy was that the district got to keep the extra spots if the team that qualified in a regional didn't compete in the district championship (and or did, but didn't qualify there).

Re: IN District Championship
 

I would love 45 to win state as well. Us champs bubble teams are taking every opportunity we can get.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Speaking of, couldn't 461 double qualify too? What's going on here? I'm beginning to question where your allegiances lie... :D

Re: IN District Championship
 

What I'm hearing is that an 868, 461, 45 alliance needs to win state and we need to also win EI. Double qualifiers for everyone.

Allegiance wise I've been a fan of 868 since we won Boilermaker with them my freshman year for Breakaway and 45 will always have a spot of favoritism to me.

Re: IN District Championship
 

What about us? We could double qualify. Don't you love us anymore?

Re: IN District Championship
 

This is magnified by the fact that the alliance captain of the winning alliance was 245 from Michigan. In fact, no Ohio teams qualified at all. Three qualifying teams were from Missouri, and one from Pennsylvania.

Re: IN District Championship
 

I actually wrote quite a bit about the teams in Indiana after the end of Perry and what to expect. Granted, it was a tad too long for just a summarized post...

At this point in the season, it's so much more important to capture the tower once it goes down for capture. We saw this happen at Perry when 71-1501-829-6012 nearly managed to take down 1024-1747-45 in the finals off of 71's and 1501's double capture. What's more impressive, however, that 1501 was the only team that scored in the high goal on their alliance.

That being said, I feel that 1501 and 4103 will go 1-2 in alliance selections. There's a few reasons specific to captains for choosing one over the other, but those two are the most proven as far as scoring and scaling go. I don't anything about any of the other teams adding a scaling mechanism.

Scary pair-ups: 1501, 4103, 868, 1024, 1747, 135, and 4982
Solid picks: 461, 234, 1741
The ones left over you better take: 71, 1529, 2197, 3147, 3940, 5403

5484 could possible surprise.

Re: IN District Championship
 

My guess is that 71 may end up ranking first again, since they can facilitate a breach and capture with minimal help from alliance partners (They and 1747 are both great at this, which is why they ranked 1-2 at Perry).

Your list looks pretty accurate otherwise, but I would also add 3176 to the list of teams to look out for. They were the only successful Indiana team (from what I can tell) at defense, when they shut down 1747's high goals in the Walker Warren quarterfinals, and if they can maintain their defensive prowess, they will be high on the pick lists as well.

Re: IN District Championship
 

3176's lack of ball control is stopping me from putting them on my personal list, but I understand the reasoning why otherwise. They'd be a steal if they were left in the second round.

Re: IN District Championship
 

May be too early for some REALLY bold predictions, but here it goes:

1.) 71, 868, 6012
2.) 1501, 1747, 447
3.) 4103, 1741, 2197
4.) 1024, 4982, 3176
5.) 135, 461, 3180
6.) 3940, 292, 2171
7.) 3559, 1529, 45
8.) 234, 1720, 3147


QF 1 begins with the #1 seed setting the record score of the event against the #8 seed. In the second match, the #8 seed absolutely kills it and is able to edge out the #1 seed. In the third match, it seems as if the #1 seed is going to semifinals until 71 drops from the bar and rolls off the batter. #8 advances to semifinals.

QF 2 ends with the #4 seed going 2/2, with the #5 seed almost taking it to a third match. #4 advances to semifinals.

QF 3 begins with #6 upsetting #3 due to 2197 not making it to the batter, but they get it together and the #3 alliance wins their next 2 matches and almost tie the high score. #3 advances to semifinals.

QF 4 sees the #2 seed go 2/2 against the #7 seed, who put out all they had but came just short of getting the third match. #2 advances to semifinals.

In SF 1 the #4 seed shows just how awesome they are at putting up points, breaking the event high score and moving on to finals, and the #8 seed ain't even mad. #4 advances to finals.

SF 2 begins with the #2 seed absolutely wiping the floor with the #4 seed, but 1501's shooter jams and it has to be taken to a third match. This third match is almost as exciting as F 3 at Waterloo. The match begins with 1501 and 1747 both hitting their 20pt autonomous routines, but 447 gets their intake jammed in the low bar. Meanwhile, 4103 and 1741 both hit their 20pt autonomous routines that don't exist and 2197 hits their 10pt routine. The score going in to teleop is 42-50. Teleop sees 447 get unjammed and immediately begin scoring low goal and 2197 go over to play defense. The match goes on and ends with a TIE. #3 advances on auto points.

Finals sees 3176 with a cheesecake climber, but that climber is their undoing in the end. They slide off the batter in both matches leaving the #3 seed 2/2. #3 wins.


NOTE: I mean no offense to any teams in my predictions. It says REALLY bold for a reason :D

Re: IN District Championship
 

71 could end up first but so could so many others. The deal breaker at this competition isn't the ability to capture. I can bet that with the quality of teams at IN DCMP, almost 100% of matches will breach and near 75%+ will capture. Winning is far more important than ever at this event. Now 71's extra 10 points on the climber is helpful, but I'm betting that many good high goal shooters will be able to climb. I could see 1501 ranking really well because of all the high goals they can do in a match and the added climb ability. If 1024, 1747, or any other 4-5+ high goal a match robots have a climber, they should rank really well at this event too. Now a climber isn't a guaranteed win but those extra points help a lot. I'm curious to see if any other teams beside 1501 get a climber and high goal auto for IN DCMP. With that said, not to talk down about 71 because they have a really solid robot, but I'm not sure how much they will win with all the high goal shooters they have to go against at this event... Definitely bold prediction on my part. Will be interesting to see the rankings. IN is such an odd place because of our really successful capture and break rate. I bet that a lot of other places' ranks will be determined by team capture and breach rate and less about winning. But IN I bet will be determined in many ways by W-L-T.

Re: IN District Championship
 

My guesses for alliance selection are
1) 1747-1024-2197
2) 1501-4982-45
3) 868-4103-447
4) 135-4613147
5) 234-71-4580
6) 1741-3940-1018
7) 3947-1720-1529
8) 292-5403-5484

Semi-finals
- 1 and 5 face off and 2 and 3 face off

Finals
- 1 and 2 play and 2 somehow pulls an upset (even though it hurts me to say it)

Re: IN District Championship
 

Also, to add, I figured out that we really have a lot of pretty good high goal shooters
(In order)
1024
1747
1501
4982
868
461
135
4103
234
1741
1720

Re: IN District Championship
 

We feel so left out...

Re: IN District Championship
 

Apologizies, of course you guys are included.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Just thinking about it, I think I've seen every team in that list except 1720 do 5 high goals or more in at least 1 match. Just to think... That's Indiana right there. That's 10 of 49 teams. What other places can say that 20% of their teams have done 5 high goals in a match before? That's pretty impressive.

Re: IN District Championship
 

My order of high goal shooters, had to put the consistent auto high on top:

1501 - Can hit from multiple area of courtyard with turret, even hitting shots while under strong defense
1747 - Ridiculous hard straight shot, no problem from outer works
234 - When dialed in, they are really good at hitting high, was consistent shot in last competition
1024 - Most consistent shot in teleop with the photon cannon aim from outer works, but must wait for boulder to settle, expect them to have either auto and/or ball control issue solved
4982 - Really consistent shot, but must go up by batter to be consistent
868 - Really improved in Queen City, solid robot, but like 4982 seems to need to be middle courtyard for shot
135 - 461 - 1720 - 1741 - 4103 - All hitting good high shots, maybe not as fast or consistent as the ones above, but have had a lot of time to improve. Crazy to say that any of these are "bottom of list" as they are all strong robots with the possibility to lead a winning alliance.

Of course then you need to also include the strong non-high goal scoring, defense specialist, low goal teams of 71, 3559, 5403, 1529, 1018, 3940, 3176, 3936 all equally capable of heading winning alliances.

I feel like there are so many teams that I did not mention.

When you factor in the consistency that in general the IN teams had with handling defenses, the fact that a number of teams had climbing as the one thing planned between their last competition and the IN District Championship, three weeks to engineer solutions (of course only 2 for 868 :rolleyes: ), I cannot wait to see the level of competition and the percentage of breaches and captures.

All I can say is this is going to be an awesome competition to watch.

Re: IN District Championship
 

I would love to see those finals

Re: IN District Championship
 

Indiana is really strong this year no matter how you put it. I can see Indiana getting back on Einstein this year.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Agreed, there's plenty of teams that could get there this year

Re: IN District Championship
 

I wouldn't mind this surprisingly. :yikes:

Re: IN District Championship
 

I predict a three-peat of banners for 1024-1747-45.

Also- way to go Indiana for hella stepping it up this year. High scores and awesome matches have become the norm in Indiana- although a little defense this weekend could shake it up.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Granted there hasn't been that much effective defense played, teams like 1501, 1024, and 4982 have showed that they can still score high while defense is being played.

Plus, I don't see 45 lasting long enough for a nber one seed anymore. They have been an absolute steal both times.

Re: IN District Championship
 

Hey! Can an admin please move this to the District Competitions forum? I forgot to put it in that forum to begin with. Thanks