WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I'm sure that we've all seen the oddshot/heard it live by now, but what is CD's response to will.i.am's comment?

From my previous visits to CMP, whenever Will came up, the general vibe that I got was that he used to be a big supporter but lost his interest and kept coming to CMP as a favor to Dean, but this year, he seemed as hyped as the rest of us, and I think that we got to see what will was really feeling at that moment, not necessarily what FIRST asked him to focus on/talk about.

Most of the sponsors, speakers and guests say similar things about promoting STEM and their companies from a pre-written speech and that's cool, but seeing will off-script and listening to how he was feeling in the heat of the moment really made me believe that FIRST has made a difference in culture, and yesterday, Will really showed it to us.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Literally legendary.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Best quote 2k16. Others may disagree, but I think it really shows his passion.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

It was not an appropriate comment for the people in the audience.

But an amazing comment about FIRST and the culture we have created.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I'm waiting for the t-shirt/button.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Not having been there, can someone enlighten me? If it's not something you can post, I'd still love to hear it via PM.

Edit: Got it. Thank you everyone.

Anyone remember when a former US president was at Champs? Maybe we should get back to that type of VIP instead of these "music" clowns.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I think it definitely was a display of passion and will go down as an unforgettable moment in FIRST, but I'm also skeptical as to if it was truly off the cuff. The general reaction of Dean Kamen, the commentators, and others seemed artificial to some degree. While I doubt everyone or even most people would know about it if – and that's a skeptical "if" – it was planned at all. He seemed to say it in a way and draw reactions from Dean and the administrator that suggest he may have playfully joked about swearing live or something earlier, and that their reactions were a product of that. Like a publicity stunt for FIRST more or less.

Don't get me wrong, I think that Will is undoubtedly invested in FIRST and whether or not the incident was planned or not, he is doing great work for the future. I wish he would have explained and gone in depth more about spreading FIRST in the ghetto and his experiences like that, but I can appreciate the notion that he was just overcome with excitement for FIRST. Also, I'm not trying to start a conspiracy or anything – I don't expect other people to jump on board or completely agree with me on this – it's just how I genuinely feel and think about it.

Either way, this should make for some good discussion.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

For that reason, I really wish I could read lips and guess what Dean said to him after in that clip...

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

One of the main goals of FIRST is inspiration. WILL.I.AM is an influential figure in the popular culture sphere who can help bring awareness to the program more than any other figures.

Although not a totally appropriate thing to say, it really does share the sentiment most of us have about the program. This could potentially attract people who haven't heard of FIRST into our community, which is always a good thing.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I personally think it was an excellent way for a non stem related person to explain his passion. If he had given a speech like everyone else, the audience would have been oh yay, another person talking about how great everything is ho hum (lets not lie, most of use do get bored by all the speeches). But by someone outside (a well known person) saying something like this, truly shows how far first has come, and how motivating and amazing it is.

Plus, this will be a good recruiting tool for new members (of course it won't be used in official presentations), but You can bet that I'm going to go to friends tomorrow and say, "Hey, you know will.I.Am is right? Well look at what he said about first.

Yes yes, I know it was inappropriate language that the 4 year olds in the stands shouldn't have heard. But I'm not worrying too much about it. In this world, if someone really tells me that they haven't heard this language in any movie or out in the general street anywhere, I really won't believe them.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Paging Andy Grady.

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First of all Will.I.AM is really not a "music clown" as you put it, he actually is a respected person unlike some other music personnel.

And also you have to understand, FIRST isn't really trying to promote itself to 30 and above year olds. It's trying to capture the attention of High Schoolers and below. A respected celebrity such as Will.I.AM will have much more impact than the president. (No offense Mr. President if you happen to have a secret account on Chief Delphi :D :D )

On a side note, I can only imagine how much more complicated everything would become if the president had to visit champs today, especially with all the security details required, and how all the open saws and hammers and shanks would be treated......

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

This is a pretty arrogant statement.

The clown you speak of actually is enrolled in Comp Sci (or was it Comp Engineering) classes.

Also, I'm pretty sure his music hasn't killed innocent people, unlike the the actions of the particular president you're referring to.

A kid can't relate to Bush senior, but they can sure as hell relate to a guy who is passionate enough about what he's saying to go off script.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Hmmmmm, Ummmmm, short and concise. I've be addicted for 15 years. Tried to quit but failed.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Let's not fire any shots here :P

Exactly, as a kid I can affirm this :)

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

You might take a look at the makeup (and age groups) of some of the teams that are a part of the FIRST programs. International teams that are making tremendous inroads in their cultures, at no small cost. Girl Scouts, Boy Scouts, and private schools with religious affiliations, to name a few. FIRST is much bigger than the current U.S. popular culture trends. Way bigger. Just look at the impact of our 2016 Championship WFA.

Food for thought.
Jane

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Legendary. As will.i.am said... "I'm just gonna say it the way I feel it"
He's saying what some of us are thinking. He's saying what many of our students are thinking.

I have a lot of complicated thoughts about "explicit language", what the appropriate or inappropriate use is, and how a coherent team policy can be crafted around them since the use of language is so heavily context-based and culturally-driven.

I've had mixed results when they slip out of my mouth. Sometimes, particularly when it shows emotion, it humanizes me to the people relying on me (students at 841, engineers and construction workers at work) & I earn respect. Other times, because it sounds like I'm not a Real White-Collar Engineer, I lose respect. Sometimes, both in the same audience. Double edged sword. Handle with care.

On 841, I'm working on building an explicitly framed "Code Switch" facet into the program, based on ideas from "For White Folks Who Teach in the Hood... and the Rest of Y'all Too" by Christopher Emdin, to emphasize awareness of use of language. My students are #$%^ing inspiring to me, but they don't always know how to use the right words to *sound* inspiring to people who only speak Engineering English.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Very true, and I totally understand that, I think it's amazing. I can't wait for a future where every school in the world will have access to some sort of FIRST resource. But we also have to think about the present moment. It is facts that the United States is much more involved in FIRST than all the other Nation's combined. With a popular social figure like this you will be reaching many more people.

Now don't get me wrong, I would love it if the President took the time to come to the FIRST championship (on other thought did he make a video this year, I know he made videos the last 2 years saying good luck). There is no rule preventing both a figure like Will.I.AM and the president to come to the championships.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I know I've posted about this in another thread already, but I kind of have a lot to say on this subject in general and on this instance in particular. I'll try to be brief.

I use cuss words as teaching tools. I play NWA songs to start discussions about racism and other related issues. I started every day of Freshman Orientation by showing a different Epic Rap Battles of History episode, using their crudeness as a hook for learning about great artists, philosophers and scientists. And yes, when I think it has an appropriate educational purpose, I will cuss in my students' presence. I do this consciously, seeing as I rarely cuss at all for any other reason.

The culture has shifted, people. Fifteen years ago my teaching mentor (God bless him) told me never to allow chewing gum, and talked about his "virgin ears" not wanting to hear curse words, but he also told me to always shake boys' hands and squeeze them hard enough to cause pain, just so they they would know I'm the boss. Fortunately I haven't taken any of that advice to heart or action, and if any teachers still take that outdated approach then I'm shocked.

Every single one of my students, and a half dozen parents who attended champs with us, wants what Will.i.am said on a t-shirt. At dinner Thursday night (before he ever said what he said), around the "adult" table, one of our topics of discussion was this very issue, and every one of those parents said the f word without a blink, including a lay minister, a married couple who are practicing Presbyterians, and a Lutheran pastor whose name many people would recognize from her books and radio and television appearances.

The culture has shifted, people. You can act shocked and complain, and likely lose the attention of the students you want to reach through FRC and other activities, or you can shift with it, and make FRC relatable and relevant to a bunch of good kids with foul mouths.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Finally, someone came out and said EXACTLY what I've been thinking about for the past 2 years.
Kudos to you man.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I'm sorry, but I didn't even see what he said. What did he even say?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Look at the link below.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I feel like the reaction to swear words by adult figures and authorities is often misplaced. we shouldn't fear children learning these words - I knew words like $@#$@#$@#$@# (it blurts it out if I try to type it on this :v) and hell when I was, like, 11 or so, and have experienced no ill effects from knowing them. They aren't "evil" and they aren't going to corrupt anyone. it's more a matter of teaching us that they are rude and inappropriate to use in professional settings, instead of pretending that they have some sort of... I don't know... corrupting effect on our youth or something.


I'm not sure if that ended up making much sense. at any rate, I really appreciated WILL.I.AM's comment - even if it was a somewhat rehearsed idea (and he was definitely thinking about doing it for about half of that speech :P ), it was an expression of pure emotion, and:

it helped him to connect with the students, doing stuff that the "authorities" might have issues with, or whatever it is that makes teenagers like about rebels :v .

yeah, so my point is that people over-value swear words, I think. I don't think they should be a normal part of the language, but to fear them is folly

I too want what he said on a t-shirt :P

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

So much this, you nailed it.

Anyone dwelling on the words are missing the message. Get over it and be pumped that Will.I.Am took time out of his schedule to come hang out with a bunch of robotics students and actually cares about this program.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

[quote=The other Gabe;1581313]I too want what he said on a t-shirt :P
is making one up and selling them. Message him for more info.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

^ couldn't have said it better myself

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

This.
The people that FRC is meant to be for are a bunch of high school students across the world. We can all pretend like they don't know foul language and all manner of things, but I bet if you really thought back to when you were in high school, you were doing similarly terrible things and saying things when your parents weren't listening!

At one of the regionals I attended this year, there were a bunch of unwashed windows near the entrance to the arena. I walked past these windows to the volunteer entrance and noticed that the kids had applied many illustrations of $@#$@#$@#$@#$@# to the windows, while this is generally frowned upon, it's still relatively harmless and pretty funny. :)

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I could not agree more. I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that long speeches given by former presidents are more relatable to teenagers than these "music" clowns.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NelBNtNm8l0

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

As a student, when we have Dean or another important figure come out and give long-winded speeches about how STEM is great, that's cool and all, but it's not something I'll remember. In fact, after hearing the same spiel year after year, it just puts me to sleep, and listening to opening/closing ceremonies gets pretty insufferable.

But this quote, concise and memorable, will be the single "speech" that I will remember after I graduate.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Exactly, as a fellow student, I completely agree. This isn't us being arrogant, it simply isn't within the interests of the common teenage mind. I personally will remember something out of the ordinary and super interesting (like 330 flipping themselves... twice, 118's grappling hook, and Will.I.Am's comment) much more than I will remember exactly what Dean said at the closing ceremonies in 2015 (I actually don't remember much....).

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Let's be honest here. Almost everyone cusses sometimes. The kids certainly do, many adults do in the heat of FRC competitions. Even the FLL kids do. While it isn't very professional, and probably isn't something to show off to prospective sponsors and whatnot, letting out one F-bomb on Einstein is not the end of the world, and in the full context, I don't even think it was that inappropriate.

To truly understand why the quote was so powerful and, frankly, inspiring, you have to get the context, not just of Einstein but of Will I Am and FRC. Einstein is an incredibly scripted, drawn out event with lots of ceremony, speeches, and traditions. It is powerful, but gets old, and it's a lot of going through the motions. Will.i.am's involvement in FRC was initially regarded with a large amount of hostility and backlash. He began by saying the 2011 game was "dope", which older mentors interpreted as a drug reference, and controversial changes to the Championship format aligned with his attempt at helping via a star-studded concert at the event, leading people to believe he was responsible for these unwelcome changes (fields in the pits etc). But over time, his commitment to FIRST and his consistency have been slowly winning people over, that he's not just doing this for publicity or selfish reasons, but because he is genuinely inspired.

And finally, after his sixth consecutive year of supporting the FIRST championship, he goes off script to express his amazement and inspiration of the robotics program going on around him. He says it in a way that is exactly how one passionate high schooler might explain their amazement to a friend of theirs, in a real and true way that you can be absolutely sure was not approved or encouraged by anyone at FIRST. And the power of his statement, if not just a shock reaction, was reflected in the thunderous reaction in the Dome, louder than almost anything heard the entire day. Crass, unprofessional, and crude as it was, it was an incredibly powerful moment.

Now, this isn't to say this should be a regular thing; it probably shouldn't be our forward facing catch phrase, we shouldn't be singing it to sponsors, making team chants about it, etc. It can't become a huge meme like water games or corndogs that every 14 year old parrots to their grandmother (and I'm sure it will get out of hand, unfortunately). I really understand the points people like Andy Grady have been making about the speech and I don't disagree with them. But I genuinely appreciated such a refreshingly honest moment from this man, and I'm glad he was able to convey his awe and inspiration sincerely.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

He says, "This is Representative Randy Hultgren. His is the chairman of the STEM committee."

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I'm afraid it's a bit too late for that :\ :D

And yes.... 100 percent yes... nothing else to say

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

This is particularly important.

Just minutes before Will took the mic to deliver the line in question, he was speaking candidly about his own motivations for supporting FIRST; it was something he never had growing up in the "ghetto". His words, not mine. And let's also not forget the other point he brought up; the juxtaposition he so eloquently stated. The FRC World Championship is held just blocks away from neighborhoods being boarded up and abandoned. He spoke of the empty buildings surrounding the dome breaking his heart.

Those who were at the championship or watching it live from home saw first hand the very raw emotional connection that Will now has to this program. He recognizes intrinsically that FIRST is a program that is creating educational and career opportunities in areas like St. Louis where students otherwise have none. Will "gets" the point of this program the way so many others do not. I'd venture to argue his motivation as a spokesperson is closer to the core purpose of this program than are the motivations of some program participants. I will never alienate a person from this organization, who has done so much for this organization, simply because they are so inspired by it that they can only describe it in expletives.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Wow. You nailed it. There's a greater meaning behind cuss words, and this meaning is what gives them an impact that can't be written off purely as repugnant vulgarity. These words humanize us. They represent the intimacy between the cusser and those around them, as weird as that sounds. Most importantly, will.I.am's words humanize FIRST, and they humanize FRC. We all love the façade of being this perfect community of gracious professionalism and whatnot, but we're all people. We all make mistakes (not that what he said was a mistake, actually quite the contrary), we all have emotions and we all let those emotions affect our actions. We're FIRSTers, but we are also people. We're all people who've cussed once in a while (some more than others) and it's part of what makes us human.

Will.I.am showed that he is enthusiastic about FIRST on a deeply personal level, so much so that he was comfortable speaking in front of 40,000 people in a manner that one would only speak around those closest to them. My perception of his relationship with FIRST before his speech was that it was largely for marketing, a mutually beneficial agreement between will.I.am and FIRST for PR's sake. However, I now see him as a dedicated member of the FIRST community, one who's deep-seeded love for FIRST matches the love for FIRST within me.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

The language is inconsequential to me. As an engineer I've heard people up and down the chain of command swear, and my own language is less than perfect. If will.I.am was speaking from the heart (and I think he was) then he should be able to say whatever the @#$% he wants. FIRST would be making a grave mistake if they were dumb enough to actually punish him in some way, like not have him participate next year.

I've heard some folks comment about GP and how this reflects on that. GP simply says we should treat each other with respect and kindness even as we compete. It's about building each other up instead of breaking each other down. It does not say how that respect and kindness should be displayed.

The most important part? will.i.am is right!

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

This is extremely important.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Thank you CD. I was going to post, but these latest comments did the work for me.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I wasn't there, but saw the video that someone posted here.
My opinion, no harm done, this is real life, and Will wasn't putting anyone down but merely showing how excited he is for the program.

I assume the room is full of mostly adults and high school students, and unless they've been living under a rock, have heard this type of language before in the world and in pop culture.

If nothing else, it's getting FIRST more exposure in a positive way.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Can you elaborate on your point here? I'm not getting what you're implying or what thought this should provoke.

What was your actual opinion on the statement?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Sure, I will be happy to, Akash.
I'm going to have a cup of coffee (or two) and put some words together in my head. I'll be back later on and will edit this post to add them.

Thank you,
Jane

Edit: I will keep this brief but, I will be happy to add more, if requested.

will.i.am was on a global stage with a microphone. Not just any global stage, a FIRST Championship global stage. That stage reaches through to young people of all ages, sponsors, world leadership, and cultures. Many many cultures. As is FIRST's nature, it continues to reach out to more cultures, communities, nations, sponsors, and leaders. It is moving toward being world centric.

will.i.am's outburst was sincere and passionate. My thinking centers around how his choice of words will impact students/teams/communities - based on cultural differences, globally. If it is just a simple outburst with no impact, that is one thing. If it becomes a hashtag and a tee shirt statement, that shows further reach.

--
This has nothing to do with my initial comment but, I find it very funny that the tee shirts will be sponsored by a pot shop. Just a few years ago, there was passionate discussion on these boards about soliciting sponsorship from beer companies. Wonder if we will have pot discussions.

Jane

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Getting my own coffee now, and eagerly awaiting Jane's response. Thank you, Akash, for bumping this dialog.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

In the word's of Scott Mescudi:
"I gotta terminate the hate spread the positive
Without it being wack and cheesy to the little kids"

Living in Boston, I draw analogies between Will's comments and the comments of David Ortiz after the marathon bombings. Now these are very different situations, but at the end of the day, it's about expressing how passionate you are.

Continuing with the analogy though, I think it is important that people reflect on what he was conveying, rather than the words that were used. When you focus on the words (and especially if you edit them) I feel the message is often lost.

In my opinion, Will was right, FIRST is dope, and I wish more people knew about it.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I’ve been a mentor for 12 consecutive years and remained silent on Delphi, that stops today. Not many things make me angry, this did.

If William, Kamen, Flowers or FIRST won’t say it, I will.

It was WRONG and inappropriate.

Understanding the majority in attendance were kids raised on idealizing celebrities the shock factor was rewarded with a roar of applause. The crowds response in addition to all the positive supportive post greatly sadden me about we have become. If I have to explain why then our world is in worse shape than I thought. Was it a mistake that he wish he could take back? Maybe, if so he should say so. William boast about being from the hood, many are that are good decent role models. After Saturday I don’t recognize his accomplishment. Go ahead vulgarity supporters and rip me up if you'd like, I can take.

FIRST is supposed to change the culture, It appears the culture is changing FIRST.

Mr. Jeff Sparky 384

My comments do not reflect the opinion of my team.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

K. Why were you silent on CD for 12 years?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I'm curious why this made you so angry? Are you under the impression the kids don't use the same words when adults aren't around? Did you not do the same at their age?

You're right. It was inappropriate. There isn't really any debate to that.

But, if THIS is what makes you think the world is in terrible shape, I'd implore you to look at bigger problems than this. If the worst thing that happened to any of these kids this weekend was hearing a celeb cuss, it's a pretty successful weekend. Keep in mind most years come with stories of team vans being broken into with things stolen. Last year, there was a murder just down the street from the event. With all of THESE things going on, why would a single remark be what upsets you this much?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

You really don't recognize his accomplishments because he used profanity in a moment of candor?

You must have a very short list of heroes.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

If, as others have suggested, you focus on will.i.am's message and not his choice of words, I would say you are dead wrong. A prominent figure from pop culture took time off from his busy schedule to come to a robotics championship and show an incredibly passionate and unscripted display of support for FIRST and what FIRST is doing in the world. If that's not a change in culture, I don't know what is.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

You're welcome to your opinion on his choice of words, but in this regard, you're being straight up childish and completely irrational.

Discuss.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Quoted from the FIRST Mentoring Guide. (If you've never read it, do so.)

"It is important for every adult to remember that there are responsibilities that come with the adult/student relationship. Young people look up to people they trust and respect and will look to mentors as their role models, and they will closely watch the adults’ actions and see their behavior as appropriate.

An adult may think that he or she is showing camaraderie and will fit in with a group of students by using the same offensive language the students use among their peers, and the reaction of the students may make the adult feel like he or she is part of the group. But what the adult is really “saying” is that inappropriate language is ok."

The FIRST organization's choice of spokespersons reflects on the organization. We tell our students that when they are at events, wearing our team's T-shirts, they are representatives of our team, and their behavior and language should reflect the team's values.

Was I surprised that Will said what he did? No. I've listened to his music. (And quite like some of it.) Anyone who had also done so shouldn't have been surprised. Musicians and performers use language like that in their music and on stage all the time. I consider it to be pandering to the audience in an attempt to elicit a specific type of emotional response. As media savvy as Will is, I believe it was a preplanned comment, at least on his part. I certainly saw it coming as soon as he started his previous sentence.

I was more interested to observe the reactions of the FIRST officials around him. I found those reactions disappointing. I certainly now believe that the passage quoted in the mentor handbook to be hypocritical at best.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Jeff,

FIRST has to do both. We change the culture through our robotics competition, but we must also be apart of that culture. To think that we are going to mold high school students into being something different than what they are is a tough sell. Students use vulgar language. That is a fact. To think that any of the students that were in attendance (yes even FLL kids) have never heard that kind of language is foolish. Furthermore, to think that those students had never heard that language from an influential figure (family member, mentor, rapper, you name it) is just the same. These words can be used to great effect. They relay a passion that no other words could. So many times we hear speeches from figureheads of large corporations or prominent figures that can't come close to the passion that Will.I.Am showed in that phrase. There is a time and place for vulgar language. It shouldn't be used in every sentence. But, when used as a tool to portray that level of emotion without the need to hear it live, nothing comes close.

Yes it was unprofessional, but who are we kidding, we work with high school students. If we act like we are in an official meeting every time we are with them, you will only see a small glimpse into what kind of people they will become.

I have a challenge for you. Come up with a phrase akin to what he did. Make it concise and passionate. But, it must only be in text form. I believe that you will have a difficult time doing that. To have something so short echo all of our sentiments of this program is a very impressive thing.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Yep. I do enjoy that mentor handbook though. It's been a great resource for me and our team. It does need revision and should include more than it does now.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I understand why Jeff has remained silent for 12 years.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

What would you have done?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I thought I would be in a big minority on this one, but I'm pleasantly surprised by the reaction here. I was going to type a long response, but MrNoble nailed it for me. I'm not naive enough to think that students don't talk like that when adults aren't around. I have a good enough memory to remember when I was that age.

I've long thought that Americans are very uptight about a lot of things that don't even raise eyebrows in a lot of other parts of the world. I figured that Will's comment would create a firestorm of hate. I'm glad it's being taken (for the most part) as someone showing their passion.

What is interesting to me, is that when Will was giving his speech leading up to the famous quote, I was thinking to myself "Will is starting to sound a lot like the other people that speak. I'm starting to think that he may be losing some street cred and the students will view him as a typical adult telling them why what they're doing is important and tune out." Then in one fell swoop that got washed away.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Found this on TeeSpring today: [LINK APPEARS TO BE DOWN NOW]

I was thinking about doing this as a way to open the shirt idea to more people than one person could handle in an order (since the company does all the heavy lifting here), but I guess someone already beat me to it... lol.

EDIT: Since the shirt appears to be taken down, maybe due to Branding (idk), I made my own version, which is a little cleaner but still gets the point across

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I keep seeing people say it was unprofessional, but I work in finance I haven't gone a day at work without hearing my co-workers and superiors curse out of frustration or when they're excited.

What about what Will said was unprofessional? How do you define professionalism?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

As an artist, Will.I.Am uses language as his medium to express emotions. So when he said that - I laughed, shook my head and just smiled. He nailed it.

No I do not condone the language used, but I understand the intensity of the emotions at that moment.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

If you feel like mere words like this are offending, then I feel sorry for you

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I'm mixed about the whole thing. While I think it was something that it was a very entertaining comment, and I am not personally averse to foul language, it sends a huge mixed message. Part of gracious professionalism (at least in the PNW) involves polite language. We've had some issues with students getting a bit too excited and using a foul word occasionally too loud, and had people directly tell mentors about it. This has come from judges too, apparently.

Overall, I don't think it will be too much to worry about. I don't think this one remark will have a dramatic impact, and I don't think it will be a sustained effort on Will's part.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Yes, you certainly are respected.

I don't see where anyone has "ripped Jeff apart" here but simply offer up other ideas or opinions, I see no brutality here.

This appears to be a discussion, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. And of course someone's opinion may prompt another opinion.

I don't agree with Mr. Jeff, but understand where he's coming from, and that he didn't like Will's language.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I was there and I found the profanity unfortunate but had conflicting emotions about it. The reason I find it unfortunate is it distracts from what we should celebrating, the whole sentiment of what will.i.am said: being in FIRST is awesome.

Please recognize there were people in the audience from many, many cultures. Some of them do find the language offensive. Of course, there were others that find the expression truly speaks to them. Not talking about the people who enjoyed the shock value of it but those who identify with the culture. That's why I am conflicted about it.

I'm certainly not naive enough to believe that teens do not often use profanity in private. It sometimes crops up in our workshop in the heat of the moment although we discourage it. But there were also many age groups of a large variety of backgrounds in the audience, some of which would find profanity disrepectful.

Like others have said, it felt premeditated and a bit like pandering to me. I can't see into will.i.am's head so I couldn't tell you if my feeling is correct. I guess it's the GP part that bothers me. It's wrong if it was premeditated and done simply for shock value. If it was done in the heat of the moment, I can forgive that and still find it unfortunate for those who felt disrespected. If it was done to connect to students who find it part of their culture, that's where it gets complicated.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

If given a choice between an advocate that uses colorful language and an advocate that suggests we strap bombs to our robots and send them to Iraq (or whatever similar nonsense came out of Yeager's mouth in 2003), I'll take will.i.am every time.

Different strokes for different folks and all that.

What other memorable quotes or moments have emerged from past years' closing ceremonies? This will be forgotten in the annals of the past or it may become the first meaningfully impactful comment in ages.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

FIRST is changing culture. Imagining that the same wouldn't happen in reverse is ludicrous. Language changes between generations, and that includes what is and isn't offensive. The seven dirty words you couldn't say back in 1972 when George Carlin talked about them are now all spoken on TV. Other words have become more offensive (notably sexually charged slurs). Language is a function of the times, especially when language is used by a professional artist like will.i.am whose job revolves around communicating with his voice.

People swear. Artists swear. FIRST chose to involve will.i.am because he's a passionate speaker and a culturally relevant icon who can connect with the students in a way that Dean Kamen never could. He's a black man, a gifted artist, who came from poverty and is now one of the most recognizable musicians in the world. And he is saying, in a way that no other role model in FIRST could, that he is inspired by what he's seeing. If that's not cultural transformation then I don't know what is.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

As much credit as Carlin gets it was really WBAI that put that to the test and those same words are still not allowed on broadcast airwaves. Cable has absolutely no restrictions and online media is very loosely governed.

Not that your point isn't valid and that language evolves over time though but the FCC are sticklers for rules. Ham operators can lose their license for saying those words too.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Language is organic. It is always evolving.

It's not like these euphemisms for excretory functions or intercourse are referring to those specific acts.
"Curse" words like these are exclamation points. Often used to give weight to ideas that lack substance.

Will.i.am didn't take the Lord's name in vain. That would have given me pause.

Otherwise, I can't think of five other words that explain why I "waste" so much of my time on FIRST.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I think this is going too far.

I heard the remark, and I laughed so loud and so hard it probably could be called a cheer. I was sitting next to two 17 year-olds, and they were more subdued than I was, probably because they weren't sure how I would react. In that moment, from that source and in that context, I thought it made a real statement that people could relate to. But all of the great points that have already been brought up, about the context and the passion, are absent on a t-shirt. It's just a shirt with vulgarity, and I can't believe that FIRST wants their name or their logo associated with it in that context (or lack of).

Funny that nobody has directly quoted it here. There's a reason for that. We could probably walk to Mars if we lined up all of the red dots that have accumulated on CD for using those words.

We're not just trying to bring in teenagers or adults who want to be cool like teenagers, we're trying to bring in sponsors and mentors as well. Would we wear that shirt to a sponsor presentation to ask for mentors or financial support? When we picked up our team t-shirts this year, oddly enough, one of the employees approached us about coming to support us and mentoring in the graphic arts group next year. I doubt that would have been the reaction if we were having these shirts printed.

Now get off my lawn!

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Nah, CD just *bleeps* them out.

For example:

"This $@#$@#$@#$@# is motha$@#$@#$@#$@#in' dope"

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

That shirt likely does not adhere to the FIRST branding guidelines.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Correct. FIRST will not put that quote on its splash page and neither will your team. You won't use it at your company sponsor events, and you won't use it when talking to your school board. You won't get more families to join your team by using it and you won't garner the respect of reasonable adults who understand what the term gracious means. You aren't going to hand out any buttons with that phrase and you won't impress any judges.

Read and understand the Youth Protection Mission and accept that you are working with MINORS. If you're a mentor, you get to be the adult. I'm tired of reading these posts that make some of us look like giggling teenagers who just got away with being naughty. I agree with the minority here that W was out of line and that FIRST needs to respond to provide closure to this. Now, assume your roles, grow through this somehow, and get back to the real mission of helping kids.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

It's all contextual. I work in academic research. Among coworkers at 'my level' that sort of remark wouldn't be out of place. In front of a P.I. it might well get you a raised eyebrow.

If you said it in a presentation, roughly what Will.I.Am did, it'd depend a lot on the setting and why you said it. I've heard and seen plenty of 'inappropriate' comments and slides in very formal settings that got chuckles and things moved along. I've also seen the same cause a lot of awkwardness.

Context always matters. I guess the line is; is it inappropriate because of a naughty word, or because it comes at the expense of a person or group?

Add me to the 'It was an acceptable amount of inappropriateness given the speaker and context.' camp.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

In terms of inspiring young high school students to respect and have enthusiasm for STEM, seeing a pop music artist express his own enthusiasm using vocabulary they are familiar with is a very powerful experience.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Each of us need to use our own language to express the full depth of feeling in what we say. will.i.am found his way to let us see how deeply he feels about FIRST.
When I say "The experience of attending a FIRST Championship was ultimately and sincerely fulfilling and full of wonder and excitement.", people who know me understand how carefully I choose words and that this expresses the same observation that will.i.am was making, as if I were translating his words to my language.
Neither criticize nor emulate his words. Merely be a professional and graciously find your own.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Approximately 35.314159% of this thread is typical ChiefDelphi overreaction.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Language is cultural.

will.i.am was sharing his culture.

For some of us, his culture is one we share only with close friends. For others, it blends with our work environment (as a teacher at an alternative high school, this is actually the case for me.)

For many people, his culture is completely foreign. It doesn't make these people outdated. It doesn't make them sticks-in-the-mud. It just means they don't appreciate it. That's okay too.

If what he said is something that will impact your team in a positive way, then use it.

If what he said is something that would put a negative light on your team, then don't use it.

It's the age-old debate of trying to prove that your way of [building a robot, organizing a team, drive coaching, finding finances, etc.] is better than others'. It's not.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Mother$@#$@#$@#$@#ing SigFigs!

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

A better tshirt design, hypothetically, would just be a plain black tee with a simple "#TSIMFD" on the front and "#lastchamps" on the back. All hypothetically though.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Yep, FIRST should just ban Will.I.Am from all events going forward because he said a few bad words. That'll teach all of the kids not to use potty words :rolleyes:

Also - please get off your high horse. It's insulting to think that people who are a little rough around the edges in FIRST don't want to help kids.

Every mentor has their own style and every team is different. I relate to my students on a personal level because I was one of them only 10 years ago. Sometimes that means saying things that aren't 100% politically correct. They know as crass as I can be sometimes that I'm doing it because I care about them and care about my team.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Exactly. As a student, I would be more motivated to spend time and working as a team, if everyone, including the mentor was close together on a personal level. If a mentor required that everyone was absolutely strict, and required that everything be done 100 percent correctly, people (especially teenagers) simply won't feel that they are part of a "family" and wont dedicate as much time into it.

And also, even I (a teenager) think that the teespring shirt is a bit too much. At least "bleet" the words out, so its not so rash. Remember, the people who buy this shirt will be wearing it around people who will have no idea the context or the purpose of the words.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Mentors and students have all kinds of relationships that work well. I've already told you all about my general approach as a teacher and mentor. Maybe I wouldn't fit in on your team, or maybe I'd get fired as a teacher at your school; if not for playing music with naughty words, perhaps it would be for wearing t-shirts and blue jeans to work. I don't know. I'm kind of really glad I work were I do, at a diverse city school that has a very particular meaning in mind when they use the term "professional". I'm glad I don't work somewhere else, or coach some other team. And I will say that it does work for many teams and many students to be coached by someone who isn't their buddy, who keeps things strict and tight. It just wouldn't work for me. So don't rag too hard on folks who have a different style.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

*Insert Will Smith's "Parents Just Don't Understand"*

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

First the paper airplane barrage and now Will.I.AM has a potty mouth!?

Did anyone have fun this year my: goodness the carnage :p

We need potty mouth inspectors handing out tickets for the FIRST swear jar!
The FIRST swear jar should be on a AndyMark chassis and be summoned by the potty mouth inspector:
pay up or it will shake you to take your pocket change :)

(The FIRST swear jar robot is a viable commercial product to replace meter maids.)

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Honestly, I don't think he did anything wrong. I mean he was passionate and said what be wanted. It's not like highschool kids are so innocent and naive not to know those kind of words. Maybe if it were more common, we would be okay with it?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I don't think most people are arguing about the highschoolers hearing it (although some people are). From what I can tell, it's more-or-less the young kids, parents, and sponsors.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Care to expand on this opinion?

So... you had no issue with the vulgarity in his music, including when he performed in front of large audiences. But then he's vulgar in front of a large audience, and you disapprove of it? :confused:

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

A few things.

I don't know if anyone has brought up the fact that there were plenty of smaller kids in the audience... and I don't know if it changes anyone's opinion.

Personally, if you take out the kids, I think the majority of teens and parents share and don't mind will.i.am's blunt opinion.

Also, as much as this inspires and markets FRC quite well, did it really show what FRC is about? I don't think it fits in with Woodie's definition of Gracious Professionalism...

Please note that I'm not actually for or against Will's comment.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

That is what bothers me. Many high schoolers may use that language in everyday conversation, and if the crowd was just high schoolers and adults, I probably wouldn't care too much. I think that what wil.i.am said does resonate well with that audience (since that is also his target audience as an entertainer) - more powerfully so than a more PC version of his statement. IMO, when a statement is scripted, or said using language very clearly not typical of the person speaking, it's harder to believe sincerity.

But when a 4th grader goes home and asks "Mommy, what does that mean?", I can imagine that might raise some parents' eyebrows and a bring up questions about the type of program their child is involved in that has them picking up that language. I don't think that younger kids quite understand how big of a deal it is that a major entertainer just dropped an f-bomb on a world stage in front of a lot of impressionable students and sponsors, so the shock value of the language (which is what makes the statement powerful to older students and adults) is lost on them.

I don't think that his language choice aligns well with FIRST's image of a program that develops young, confident professionals. Yes, inspiration and recognition of science and technology is why we're here, but the behavior of students who participate in the program reflects on the program itself (just like schools are for teaching, but every time you go on a field trip, you're told "don't forget, you're representing our school"). That's part of what sponsors see when they're looking at what their investment in this program is helping build. Swearing may be prevalent in many professional workplaces (mine included), but is still viewed as unprofessional in many contexts - interviews, presentations, when working with customers, etc, and that's what gives it a bad rap overall. I'm not sure how to communicate how I feel about this other than saying "it just doesn't look good on FIRST".

It's great that wil.i.am has been supportive of this program, and I appreciate his support even more so after the stories about his enthusiasm that Dean told during his speech. I appreciate his frankness and his sincerity, but I don't think it was appropriate for the audience.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I have thought about this, and my response is that, if someone tells me that a child hasn't been exposed to much fowler language at school or in a general movie, than they have a really really protected childhood.

And in my opinion, i don't think this has anything to do with gracious professionalism. Gracious professionalism is showing passion and helping each other out (broken into the simplest terms). By doing this, Will.I.Am showed his passion for first.
But gracious professionalism and this just aren't related.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

While I'm not commenting on the rest of your post, I can say that when I was in 4th grade (hell even 3rd grade) (7 years ago), i knew much fowler language than this. Times are simply changing.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I don't think I knew what a swear word was until at least middle school, which, granted, was over a decade ago (man do I feel old right now). I have friends my age who, from the stories they and their parents have told me, were swearing in kindergarten. All depends on your upbringing :)

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Not everyone can say the same nor do people want to be able to say the same.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I didn't exactly ask to know this language at that time (or now for that matter), it just happens un-wantedly.
P.S I definitely didn't learn this from my parents....

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Sorry for quoting you guys in particular but, it's confession time...

I learned to swear (including the F-word) when I was probably about six years old (from the neighbor kid). I had a very vulgar mouth after that, but of course not while adults were around. And yet I turned into a highly responsible adult. I have multiple degrees, own businesses, was an airline pilot, mentor kids, etc. - all despite being exposed to swear words when I was a young kid. I seriously think people get way too uptight about this stuff.

And in another thread there was talk of me being an "old man". BTW, that was back in the early 80's, so I would argue that times haven't changed all that much.

Sorry if you all have lower opinions of me now.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

100 percent agree.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Language aside, I still fail to see why anyone would be inspired or feel validated by a rapper / entertainment celebrity at a robotics and engineering competition.
As a kid, I never cared what a musician said about my involvement in robotics, I would have much rather gotten validation from a real engineering celebrity like Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos or Charlie Bolden.

Would the audience still react the same way if Kim Kardashian walked in and said she loves robots?

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Kim Kardashian dosen't have the same sort of social impact that Will.I.Am does

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

Actually go look up Will.I.Am before downplaying all that he has done. Calling him just a "rapper/entertainment celebrity" is down right insulting towards him.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

I agree, but I also still think there's a time and place for when it's not appropriate. I feel that I was raised fairly conservatively compared to some of my peers and it's hard to shake that sometimes - guess my comment was more of a minority/personal opinion than I had thought.

Re: WILL.I.AM's comment on Einstein
 

The dude was known to swear a lot so I was more surprised it didn't happen sooner.