The only way the drivers &c would be able to read these signs would be if they were somewhat large. Large signs being held over the head tend to block the view of other eager spectators. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not too happy when somebody prevents me from seeing the excitement on the field!

Do you guys see anything wrong with the person stacking the boxes, kinda peeks around the wall and see what the other team is doing? I mean, you're kinda relying on yourself and not on teammates in the stands. Just wanted to see your opinions.......

Peeking around the wall (I'm assuming you mean the plexiglass at the players stations) would violate a safety rule I think.

If the wall of tubs doesn't go down, I don't think that extra help from the fans in the audience would result in any unfairness. Basically, it's going to help everyone.

If I can't see my bot and you can't see yours, I'm gonna start praying that someone helps to get that wall down.

This aspect of gracious professionalism is built into the game--and into the scoring.

You want a high-scoring match. Remember the winning alliance gets double the other side's points...

If you know you have won the match, it makes more sense point-wise to push the other alliance's bot to the top than drive your own up there (50 points, instead of 25) or to build up there score to just under your by stacking their tubs, etc.

Any audience help in getting the wall down will be a rising tide that raises all ships.

As far as the tall flag, ya just gotta push one up in the autonomous period.

I really think there is nothing "morally wrong", a rule against, or anything that should stop your team members in the stands from communicating with the field players.

After all, they cheer don't they? That's just communicating to them that 'hey you're doing good!' or 'keep on trying!'

It happens every year, inadvertantly: You're team's driving, it's coming down to the wire and everyone on your team is yelling something like 'one more box', 'get in the endzone' or 'block that robot' and if that catches the eye of a driver or coach, there's nothing wrong with the robot then doing that. So if the team then chose to..say.. have a big green or red poster which indicated to their drivers to either 'go' or 'stop' regardless of the level of visibility of the stage members I see no problem.

And everyone has been able to do it every year, and in every game for most strategies their is an element of non-visibility of something. The only way from stopping the audience from helping would be to put them behind a sound-proof wall. But that's not what the game is about.

But take football for instance...


You don't see fans holding up signs telling the QB he's got an open reciever, or to turn around and run because he's about to be sacked. Fans may scream at the top of their lungs, but we all know just how loud and hectic competitions are. By the time a "spotter" could get the right card out of his stack to hold up, the entire situation might change. Personally, I reccomend having your tallest team member as your human player, he or she could stand behind the drivers and try to offer a little insight as to what they can see on the oppisite side of the field. Plus, in the event that the center boxes don't get knocked down, I'm sure that someone will end up plowing into the boxes by accident anyways.

"But take football for instance...


You don't see fans holding up signs telling the QB he's got an open reciever, or to turn around and run because he's about to be sacked."

Yes, but as Dean pointed out, Fottball, along with all other sports is a spectator sport. The fans are not part of the team, while in FIRST, they are part of the team. I know that in the past I have had members of my team help me out by giving me signals from the stands. It was legal in those years, and if it is legal this year, I see nothing wrong with it.

FIRST has never been about becoming another sport like football. There's no alcohol at competitions and the athletes aren't competing for large sums of money. The objectives of FIRST aren't to crush all the other teams, but instead to work together with kids from across the country. If we want FIRST to become a spectators sport, we should decide if we want to distinguish it from the other sports out there. If the crowd played any additional role it would make spectators really feel like a part of things. I don't know if this idea is feesible or not, but like any idea it needs to be proven to be right or wrong.

How would they do that, get a megaphone? :rolleyes:

That's what the announcer is for, to let everyone know what is going on. Listen to that. I think it against the spirit of FIRST and against gracious professionalism to have a designated 'spotter' in the stands.

- Katie

In the past years nothing has to been done with people helping on the side lines. just last year some teams had flags to show that there are in the scoring area.


every year there are teams that make sure they are next to the field to be able to help their team out.

This rule could be a hard one to enforced. I know in the past it has never been enforced.

Camera
 

THere was a rule about cameras on robots. I remember it said something about having to be approved by FIRST, and that it could not be 900 mgh. I might be wrong here but a digital camera would be to some assistance on the far side of the wall..:D

look at DQ8

muhahaha
jake

Even though you can have a camera if approved by FIRST, as you have been able to in the past, the drivers cannot use it for an aid in driving, it is meant for video taping purposes only, so that you can have some cool shots from the robot's point of view for promotional purposes later on in the year.

this seemed to get lost in the jumble but someone suggested using the human players. from looking at the diagram on the first website it looks like that the human players, if used in tandem, can basically eliminate all blind spots on the field.

team 87 already has everyone beat in designing a pole for sight line. if anyone remembers our "flagpole/johnson/erectile device then you know what i mean. it would just have to be secured in place and then we could use that. 15 feet of pvc piping... if you cant see that you are blind...

any way just my 2cents

Reread the rule because this is not allowed. While it would appear that this would work. This can be found in "The_game.pdf" on page 4.


The autonomous operation period of the game will automatically start when the last human player
leaves the field and all 4 pressure sensitive mats have been activated. The human players must then
join their teams in the driver stations.

This in the first part of this file, but it is missing from the GM# rules. I'm sure that they are required to return to the player's station for safety reasons.

Last year I was told to stop yelling at our drivers from the front row at two different competitions because the ref said i wasnt allowed to help them. Both times the refs said I could get the alliance DQd. I was telling my if they were in the zone or not and what do to to get into to.

However... those were both off-season comps.