Re: very professional
 

The website award criteria is so vague, I don't think it's clear that Delphi doesn't qualify, altho I do remember Brandon saying he's not a student.

I think the goal of the website award is to get more students creating webs, more teams with webs, and more exposure for the FIRST program. And, like the process of creating a chairman's award, the process of building a team web crystallizes what the team is doing, and could be doing, and helps FIRST team members to see what other teams are doing and what is possible.

I know to our surprise a consultant (whose job it is to raise money) for nonprofit groups and politicians heard of FIRST, searched online, and found our web (before our student built web) and traveled an hour to see our facility and team cuz she was impressed by the web and our focus on encouraging girls. She gave me excellent advice on getting our team money.

BTW, the team web is submitted to the website award consideration by being linked from your team that's listed on whatever regional you're going to. So your team's main contact has to make the student web the main web.

ps. Chief Delphi is my favorite FIRST web.

Chief Delphi should be in the running. It's up to the judges to decide individually what does and what does not count.

If they pulled themselves out, then I respect them all the more.

Yes, there are different degrees of dependence on your own ingenuity.
Chief Delphi uses third party software entirely.

www.theforceteam.com was created by a friend of mine in GoLive, with pics he created, and is hosted off the webserver that is sitting on my homework room floor right next to me, using PHP, SSL, mySQL, FTP, and Apache that I set up myself and am hosting off my own DSL connection.

Now, I'm sure there are some people out there who wrote their HTML in Notepad, drew and scanned their pics, and built their own webserver as well.

But the simple fact is that not one person out here has built a computer from scratch, then an operating system, then a text editor, then a programming language viewable by conventional web browsers, and THEN made their own site, hosted off a completely new international system of networks comprising a virtual seperate Internet and convinced everyone else to tap into it as well.
That's an example of the only purely student-designed-and-run website possible.

Obviously, no one has done that.

Where do you draw the line on reliance?

Up for the judges to decide.

I'd say that as long as something is configured by students, they have a right to use it. Mentors can't be the primary builders, nor can a sponsor. But as long as students do most of the work and do not claim to have written the source code to whatever third party programs they are using, they're fine.

--Petey

thanks
 

thanks, i wasnt saying chiefdelphi shouldnt be allowed to submit, but they took themselves out of the running when brandon said . just to clear it up. and check out my team website, completely made by two students me and the other webmaster ina little program called notepad. www.chhsrobotics.com i think its cool give me some feedback though.

thanks,
ben smelley

i agree
 

and i totally agree FIRST needs to draw the line on reliance. obviously noone has done it all from scratch, but they shouldnt have someone make their site for them and expect to win, or even submit it. thanks, and i agree. also btw the judges are the students.

Well.. the fact is a site can be fully built without using Third Party Code. I could easily write a forum or message board in php. But the main reason why I wouldn't, is TIME.

A message board would take me about a week to write a nice one, but why should I when phpBB is right there, and is free.. and requires.. well some/lots of personal modification... it still saves time.

Here's the way it will be
 

I don't wnat to sound like i'm trying to put chief down but i think that the judges will take into consideration that there are alot of teams out there and that they will have to judge chief alot harder than anyone else to make it fair for evryone else.At least i hope they will do that. That way everyone has a chance.

In a way this will be like the chairman's award in the past. it doesn't matter how much better the quality is, it's more of the content. It's not the size that matters it's the quality of work by the students, because after all FIRST was made for the students mainly.

and Chief has my vote but i will always consider the others before i make my final decision.:]

Re: Here's the way it will be
 

Ok, i've been reading every post in this thread, and if everyone else would take the few extra minutes to, you'd realize chief can't have your vote, I'm not really criticizing, cause i like this site just as much but its just a note so you don't confuse the judges.

Team 240's "student built/run" Homepage

As Brandon Martus keeps reminding us, chiefdelphi isn't entering the competition. So that clears up one problem.

But no one understands what in all of patatootie the judges want out of our websites. They didn't clarify. And we can't seem to agree on what's student run, and what isn't.

Very good point. Since this is the first year they've had a website competition, I guess it's only fair to expect a few kinks in the competition. But trust me, this is one major kink? I've read the entire thread, and I've only come up with this one useless solution:

Just enter your website, and hope it qualifies for whatever they were hoping for.

And in FIRST, where it's all about math and science--not guess-and-check--it's a really stupid plan. I know that. But maybe next year the website problem will be sorted out a bit better and we won't have to sit here scratching our nogins. I know my nogins starting to hurt from all the scratching.

mort's official website
mort's unofficial "made-in-notepad-by-a-student" website

sorry
 

i must not have read all of the post since there are lots of them.
anyway i think the rest of my post expresed my point.:ahh:

Um... you are aware that it's student judged. That means that for the regionals that team 201 is attending (my team) I'm going to go here: http://www.usfirst.org/robotics/2003/rgevents.htm

Then, I'll click view team list for whatever the event is. All the teams with a link as the team name, I'm going to visit. Then, I'm going to pick what I think is the best site, and submit a form at the regional for team.

SO... to find out what the 'judges' want, ask the members of CD what they think of your site.

-----
That is the meaning of "Student Judged" ;)

Ooooh... thanks for clearing that up :D I compelety forgot that it was student judged! *arent i stupid*

Has FIRST done anything to check who made the site? If they were students or not? I have seen several sites at regionals that had been done by non-students who were competeing.

I think there should be some level of Gracious Professionalism here, and really if it isn't atleast 75% student built, it shouldn't qualify.