Human Player Stuff
 

So what do you guys think of the human player time? - im starting to think that it will be more crucial than many people think.
(but i can stack all 8 of em so...)

good luck to all and see you @ VCU

Im so afraid that my UNCOORDINATED team mates will knock something over, or trip haha.

2 minor penalties. ouch.

Yeah... I don't want to do that job if someone asks me. Tripping and costing your alliance the match is not appealing.

Yeah, I have a bad feeling that our human player will trip and fall casuing the boxes to fly. :D ;)

I dunno about tripping yet cause weve been practicing on hard floors - but several of our team members have the tendancy to go THRU the walls we have taped out on the floor when returning to their "pads" (we dont have the money to build the entire field so we taped the edges out on the floor).

its also fun to watch what people will do when something falls and they only have less than 10 seconds to get back - hehe

It's all good Steve, you forgot that you have ME on your team. And we all know how coordianted I am! :D

I think that the human player period won't be that much of a difficulty, as long as the person knows that they have to do witht he bins ahead of time.

we are doomed, i feel it.

I was just attacked with a pointy stick, and as a result I am subsequently unable to look up what happens if a human player trips. Does anybody want to fill me in?

This, unfortunately, is entirely untrue for me. We were out human-player practicing and I had a hard time getting my bins to the proper position and getting out in time at first. After about two or three trial runs of a certain bin placement, it became relatively easy...but at the competitions we won't have an hour of practice, and people will be screaming, and music will be blasting, and the game is on the line, and the stack looms, and the clock ticks so quickly...*faints.*

If the human player trips, that is bad. It is worse if they knock bins onto their sides. Over 10 seconds is two minor penalties, and no autonomous. Knocked over bins is two minor penalties. Human player over fifteen, DQed for match. So if you trip, you have to try to set all bins back upright. Or you get 4 minor penalties. And with 4 minor penalties, you are DQed.

One trip would be very likely to DQ you for the whole match.

Watch your step...

Im really not sure - but my best guess would be that the normal rules would apply as if you just didnt get out in time. I would ask in the official FIRST forums for that one or in the Rules section here.

Second -
With enough practice the other human players for my team and I seem to have a good idea of what to do - we ran through all our plays today and most of them we ran once under 10 sec and moved on. I dont think that in competition it will be that much harder, even with the environment.

didn't it get changed to 15 sec?

That is only for the practice rounds. In the competition, it will be 10.

...And 10 is quite difficult, considering how they are placed at the start. It'd take at least 1 second to just get out of the gate with all four bins, and probably around 9 seconds to stack eight well. Not that anyone would want to stack eight. I'd be happy if we were allowed to start off the match carrying the bins (I mean, come on, we're allowed to start robots at any orientation in the start zone, so why not people?), or if we got just a tad more time (not gonna happen), say 11 seconds.

didnt we pratice it actually holding the bins before the 10 seconds started? or at least changing the order, or stacking different heights..

gotta watch that the bins are right side up too :rolleyes:

Yes we did but I got that clarified. Beware anyone who did practice with their human players starting of with bins in hand.

I fully understand that 10 sec is a very short period of time - and our team has been starting with the boxes in a posistion around the actual starting posistion. the solution for not having enough time - sprinting. i just brace the boxes on my body (since im tall) and run. then on the way back - run even faster. but i can see this as a problem if your team is full of, how shall i say this, not so athletic people.

for some reason i think FIRST is gonna have a safety issue with this.. they dont want us running in the pits, not to mention if we were carrying boxes..

But we're wearing safety glasses. That makes us invincible... :)

I suppose I'll have to sprint like that too. CaptMatt15 must be really tall to brace all four bins against himself without his legs getting in the way. I was practicing starting off with four bins in hand. When the countdown to start was at 1 second, I'd lean them forward to about 60 degrees and run as fast as possible behind (under/after) them when time started. It allows me to worry about running and not about what I'm carying, much like how a soccer player kicks the ball way out in front of him when really moving. Of course, this is only advantageous when travellling long distances because it takes a while to stop.

ok - a little clarification - the top box of the 4 ends up touching my head just a little or not at all - the other 3 are pretty much against my body. and im 6'4" so that helps.

yes, i have also noticed that leaning the boxes a little while running helps to keep em from falling over - ive been leaning them forward just a tad as i pick em up off the ground - keeps that top one from blowing over your head.

lol


He sure beats you john : P


was wondering if other teams have at least considered a substitute human player, or at least an alternate person in case something happens to the original human player.. ech.. just something to do while waiting for competitions to start

yeah - good point
my team has me and then 2 other people that have been practicing.

its never bad to have a back up plan

are you sure?
 

Hi Jeff,

Are you sure about this? I could be wrong, but I don't think the HP gets 2 minor penalities for being over 10 seconds - I think that penalty is just losing the autonomous period.
I think failing to place all 8 containers "legally" is 2 minor penalties, but I think the only way a HP can get their team DQ'd for a match is if they go over 15 seconds.
Hopefully someone can clarify and correct me if I'm wrong.

JM

Ive asked a question about the whole tripping scenario to the FIRST guys at the official questions forum - http://jive.ilearning.com/thread.jsp...rt=0&trange=15

the answer was pretty much was if you cant do it in 10 sec - the human player should just place them right inside the feild and get out to avoid tripping or anything. If the human player falls and or trips - the normal rules are still in effect.

our human player will not be stacking the boxes.

be interseting to see what your human player does then?? maybe places them in front of other robots?

Anyways...you have to be athletic to do this...luckily our teams human player will probably be me so we're okay...(I was a track and cross country runner and can do the shuttle run in under eight seconds....but being able to stack all eight....nearly impossible by yourself. We've tried it. You need to have a human player on the other alliance that is as fast as you and in order to make it a safe stack, you have to be able to place in a low traffic zone, otherwise you're screwed (sensors, dead reckoning). So if you can stack all eight boxes, great....our team is curently thinking of a better strategy...maybe.

TRIPPING!!!!
 

Cant wait till i see a lot of people tripping with the boxes....................:p ................

does anyone know taht durnig the human player time, if the people donig it ahve to stand on the pad for the entire match or just during autonimous mode?

They run back to the driver station after the human player period is over... FIRST did this most likely to prevent bins hitting the human players. Also, the human player can act as a secondary coach or another driver :)

We might be placing one in front of the opposing robot, but definetly not stacking.