What.. animation disqualified!!!
 

dunno why, but my team's animation got disqualified, probally due to like 0.0000000000002 sec freaken longer than what it supposed to be. Anyone else got disqualified.. tell me 'cause it'll make me feel better:confused: :confused: :confused:

I know a lot of animation were dq'd because they did not hold a still frame for 10 sec, some did 2 frames, which is against the rules.

You may have used some music in it that was copyrighted... but they should have called your team up telling you why, and if it was fixable.

Frankly there probably wasnt any time for resubmitance. However- I know that In the North East Conf- There was one animation played on a seperate tape "because it was a late submission" Was how it was explained to us. I didnt say anything because Autodesk messed up so many other things that I didnt want a team to have to suffer. If you were DQ'd for the Stillframe issue, music Issues, or length issues- then so be it. These were all in the rules. Did you submit a filled out entry form and submit story boards? These are all called for in the rules as well.

BTW- last year i recieved the review of scoring from the judges (you know the comments you can request from autodesk- I dont know how they will handle this this year) One Judge marked that the story boards were not submitted, but I know for a fact that they were. And none of the other 6 or 8 or however many judges seemed to have that comment- so who knows what they did with them.

I'd contact that autodesk email address firstentries@autodesk.com (I think) And ask them point blank, "What was the problem?"


PS: when you do a 30 sec commercial for TV- You can't be .0000000000000002 sec over! its always better to be slightly under. But I doubt that was the cause of any DQ.

I heard something about sound being disabled at the UCF regional competition for animations. That must have sucked.

Nah, sound was at UCF regional...I was there and judged. That's when I got first news of my own DQ. No one would tell me why until one week later at the midwest regional (the one I DIDN'T submit to...) where I found that my animaiton was DQ'd for both an unreadable disk and copyrighted music.

Now the question lingers...how do you DQ an unreadable disk for illegal audio....

Maybe they looked at it, heard the copyrighted audio, and then broke the disk...... or not

Hmm...and the theories begin....

lol

Copyrighted material used without permission has been a big thing in the past with animation submissions, and is likely the reason for your DQing. That's really unfortunate...

I remember last year our animation video was 35 seconds, but had precisely 30 seconds of actual animation, so I doubt there would be any problem with a slight deviation from the allowed time.

Well did you use copyrighted music- or not? Its pretty clear in the rules that you must have the rights to use the music.

I also wondered how an unreadable disk can be disqualified for its content? Either it was unreadable or it wasn't.

...Hmm...indeed..that was the point I was trying to get at...

Yeah, I though of it as soon as I read the original post then I read your's and included the word "also" as a recognition of your post- however I see that is could be read as an aditional thought in addition to another thought of my own. So Yes I saw your point.

I am wondering if the DQ'd animation did habe copyrighted music or something. Any comments from the creator? I think this is a common problem that people have. With free internet downloads of illegal software and music- it may be hard to know what you can use and what you cant. Especially if your aren't a lawer.

hmmm.... music copyright.. that might be my animation problem...gotta check with the final cut people... how can they find out if the music is not used by permission anyway?

Also, where did u guys get the rules from: 10 sec for stillframe, copyright for music, etc....how come the one i read didn't say anything about this? could someone give me the link to the animation rule they got from please

as far as the "unreadable disc" you did send two right? One with credits, one without? One was probably unreadable.

There was a team update that had much information on it, but also the Awards>>Visualization Award Section, i beieve had all of that stuff!

And as far as the music copyright stuff, you pretty much have to ask the artist. We talked to a local band and they let us use some of their tracks. So in our credits it says "Song A" "Song B" & "Song C" used with exclusive permission from Artist Q.

It doesnt matter if anyone finds out- It's about honestey and integrity. Autodesk will be producing a DVD that goes to each team and linking to the winners on their website. Chances are someone will see it.

As far as the rules- What rules did you read- Go to www.usfirst.org go to Robotics Comp then Documents- then look for the Awards.pdf and go to page 17. Then dont stop reading till you finnish the entire section (page 24 I think) If you dont see anything on not using copyrighted music and the still frame at the beginning then read it again! If you still dont see it- ask anyone with common sence - how much trouble you can get in if you use copyrighted music in a published video/animation without permission.

Click Here for the awards documents. I believe that the 10 seconds was released in a team update, not in the original rules because i cannot find the place where it says that you need to hold it for 10 seconds (well i might have just skipped over it, I'm tired).

Also Stevek, remember if you only use 10% of the song it is legal to not obtain permission (however it is courteous to do it anyways), so this might confuse people weather they should obtain permission or not.

Also did you send in a storyboard of your work???

I know what you are talking about- but I dont know the exact timing that is legal- I actually thought it was an exact length and not a percentage- Somthing like 10 sec. And most of us dont edit out songs to that degree. But as you say- It's still a good practice to get permision anyway- Unless it's public domain and listed as such. I used a company called MusicLoops.com or somthing like that- 3 years ago and as long as it was for noncommercial use it was fine. The past two years I got music from a friend that is a sound designer- he has a couple of disks of free stuff and some things from friends that he has permission to use any way he wants. I can see about making MP3s of these and making them available for next year. STAY TUNED!!!

yeah.. i sent the story board...

$@#$@#$@#$@# it, should had someone to check the team update... anyways, when it comes to next year, is my team gonna still be considered as a rookie?

can someone show me the team update about the 10 sec stillframe thing

Just to clear up the copyright stuff, the rule is as follows:

For educational purposes only, you may freely use 10%, but no more than 30 seconds, of copyrighted music. Note that FIRST may or may not qualify as an educational use, especially given that it will be posted on Autodesk's website. Also note that you are not allowed to modify the music/lyrics in any way, shape, or form, so you can't do things like add reverb, etc.

Go googling (I love that word!) and you can probably find some more details.

--Rob

I've already posted this once, but again - it doesnt matter wheter it is legal by law or not to use 10% of a copyrighted piece without permission - it is illegal to do so by the rules - read the consent and release form!

If you use a copyrighted piece - you have to have a permission from the copyright holder, no matter whether it is legal by law to use it without permission.

Because of my teams negligence to look up the rules until almost the due date we weren't able to finish. But that's alright, this year me and a few other students took a free class at Tri-County Tech. College for 3Ds Max and CAD. So look out for next year. Although I have seen many amazing animations out there. Still, look out for us. ;)

-Later

Can you still take music files and cut them at specific points though? Although it doesn't really matter now, we don't have an animation. This is just for future references.

Easy answer:

Q: Can you use a piece of copyrighted music, in accordance with fair-use policies (10%, no greater than 30 sec) in a FIRST submitted animation?

A: Yes

Q: If you do so, will it be disqualified?

A: Yes.


You CAN put it in. They WILL disqualify you if you do.

Fair-use or not, it's still a copyrighted piece. As Dave Lavery bluntly put it: You're screwed.

What if the soundtrack you want to use is from a computer game? I'm guessing you probably can't use it either.

I'm sure programs like MTV Music Generator (Lets you make your own soundtracks from scratch) are ok to use though.

music making progams are ok. Those beats are free-use and stringing them together would be your own material. Taking a sample from a computer game would still be copyrighted by the overseeing company (Blizzard, Rockstar, etc.).

The way to do it if using copy written music is to request permission, and include in the credits and probably in your submission envelope the express, written consent say in pretty plain English you can use...

To see the complete rules go to www.usfirst.org then click FIRST Robotics Competition > Documents and Updates > 2003 Competition Documents>2003 Award Information

our team was DQ for same reason as Jims. a few days before the deadline ur mentor said he would burn the disks and send in the entry with storyboard and all that stuff. when we arrived at st/ louis the disks were blank and corrupts so we were DQ we dont no exactly what happened but it stunk

This whole thing where you need permission......... is this a new rule lthis year? or did I just get away with it last year? All I did was site my source, not get permission.

I used approximately 15 seconds of the song "Tank!" in the credits of the animation, and didn't get any greif about it. Guess it's not a well known song, even though it's awesome :rolleyes:

There has always been a rule on - not using Copyrighted music. This should actually apply to eveything in the animation- if you used backgroubd imagery- that could posibly be a copyrighted photo.

The rule doesnt say that you need to get permision- I says that you have to sign an Archive Release form (page 23 of the awards.pdf) and that form says that you must own or have the rights to use all the content in you animation and that you give full and unrevolkable rights to Autodesk to use your animation anyway they see fit.

And all entries were required to include this form. Thus you must have rights/permisions to use all materials in the animation. This form has been part of atleast the past 4-years of AVA competition. Beyond that I dont know.

The rules state you need permission.

Then wouldn't the answer be no to the first question if they second question is true.

The point he was making is that there is nothing stopping you from putting the music in the animation- but there is also nothing stopping them from DQing you. So feel free to do what ever you want, just dont expect to win and dont complain if a lawer calls you up to sue you.

Next year if you guys don't want to create your own music there are plenty of sites on the internet that have uncopyrighted music. Thats what we used in our animation last year. They can't say anything and all you have to do is sort through the songs to see which one you like.

Be warned though some of them shouldnt be considered music.