who thinks this years competion is easy
 

who thinks this year will be easy.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

where is the faith it is just like past competions into one.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

FIRST games are never easy...anyone that thinks so should have their head examined.

There are still quite a few ways to play the game and there won't be many bots that can do it all effectively. This game shall be interesting....

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I think this year's game may very well be the perfect balance we've been looking for. Aside from the dependency on human players, which I find intriguing, but maybe not the best thing, I think this is the best game we've seen in a long time. Why, you ask? Because it's easy to learn, and hard to master. The basic concepts of the game (relase the small balls, shoot them in the goal, cap the goal with a big ball, hang from the bar) are easy to understand, and visually obvious to spectators. However, to master the strategy required to play the game successfully will be a major challenge. It's this balance that I feel FIRST has been missing since 2000, and I'm glad to see a game that finally meets my expectations in that area.

So... no, it's not easy. Not in the full sense. This year's game is easy to learn, and hard to master. And you know what? That's the best way.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I think the game will be eaiser for vet teams because any team that was around in 2000 will know how to grab a bar, even though this years bar is a bit larger its still the same concept also teams in 2001 who could grab large balls will know the basics of that. the rookie teams will have some truble starting out this year learning things the vet teams know how to do but the game is still a great challenge and it looks like its going to be fun to build to.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

now that we have the game rules and everything.. its easy for vet. teams and hard for the rookies. my opinion is for vet. teams this game is easy since this game relates to the 2000 and 2001 year's game. it will be hard for some rookie teams who didnt have a lot of experience. but i am pretty sure that they wont have much hard time since there are teams out there who are gracious enough to help the rookies out... :D

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I dont think it will be as easy as you think for vet teams for several reasons:
A.There are new members who have to learn how to accomplish these tasks
B.The programming code is different
C.The drill motors changed last year
D.Not every team went at those challenges in that way
E.Many of the members of those teams have graduated, quit, moved...
F.FIRST games are never easy
G.There is still the task of getting to the bar(remember there isnt much room around the goals)

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

The game looks easy enough until you factor in the fact that the playing field is not level. I think that is going to throw alot of people off, maybe literally. I've been thinking that treads may be the best way to go this year. . .

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

More reasons:
The game is different, therefore strategies are, and you might not want to put the same amount of time into doing one task(10 seconds to do a pull-up vs. 15 seconds)
Autonomous mode removes 15 seconds of driving time so the teams might want faster mechanisms
The goals are different hieghts than b4
The stationary goal have different height posts, which could make placing balls more difficult.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

hmm lets do a few equations

FIRST+ basketball= hard

Flimsy arms+130 pounds hanging in the air= hard

40 balls scatter around+guards on side= 20 balls at end of round

GG this isnt a cake walk...

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

Or they could act as a backboard! :D

But anyways, this game has every year since 1999 covered in game aspects.

1999 similarity - Raised Platform
2000 similarity - The Hanging Bar
2001 similarity - The Balls - Both the same sizes(?)
2002 similarity - Rolling goals
2003 similarity - (yes there is one) - The Polycarbonate HDPE surface of the platforms, along with some same supplies.

I'm glad my team has been involved in every one of these years by chance starting in 1999.

To me, it looks like the budget for the game was considerably smaller this year, so they just took previous years games and made a collage of a game this year.

Same but different - That is the key here!

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

It brings up a good point: veteran teams which not only have seen every game but -RETAINED THEIR MEMBERS- will have an advantage.

Allumni of teams who are helping newbies will give the newbies an advantage.

And newbies who are able to glean help from teams willing to give it will have an advantage.

And teams who help newbies have an advnatage at the chairman's award.

So even if we are fighting tooth and nail ingame, it's better to at least collaberate with other teams prior to it.

This year is a present to the older genration of FIRST members. :)

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I agree completely... that no matter what, a FIRST game is never easy. Someone will always out engineer someone else. FIRST will continue to mess with our minds for many years to come, no matter how easy it appears on the outside.

Elgin - glad I just caught your post, was sending out an e-mail regarding the similarities.... my old age is kicking in, and I didn't even realize the similarity from 2003. :o

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

Another similarity from last years competition is the auton mode. We do have new things like the infareds, but we still follow the tape if we want. This competition sure won't be a cake walk. It's meant to be more peaceful unlike last years battle for the ramp, but there will still be battles. I feel that the amount of strategies in this years competition will due us in for some interesting fun.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I think that this years game is very similar to many past year games but mostly 1996 and 2002

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

Elgin...you forgot a few other parts of the 2003 game incorporated this year:
1) The autonomous mode
2) The tape on the floor that the robot may follow

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I'm a major n00b, as this is my first post, and thus I don't know if my opinion counts for anything, but I think the competition is not easy nor impossible. As for the 15 second autonomous part, it'll most likely make the competition more interesting.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I may be wrong, but I see this game as, more than in the recent past, needing "do everything" robots to qualify well. Unless you are really lucky in the alliance draws, you are going to need to get balls to the player station, knock your "tee" ball on auto mode, handle doubler balls, and hang.

I was surprised that the game placed so much emphasis on human player skill, but maybe this is to make up for last year's game having only a few seconds of human player activity.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I dislike the fact that the competition requires so much of the human layers because my team is made up mostly of non-athletic fat geeks.

Damm Damm Damm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

i don't think this competition is going to be easy at all. i think it's going to end up being a determinant of having an alliance that can do 2 things VERY well, rather than ALL things mediocre. it's going to be hard because there are so many possible aspects, but when it gets down to elmination rounds, i think that's going to be the key. finding a team with the best human player, the team that can grab and hold onto the bar no matter the cost, and the fastest/most accurate robot to give balls to the Human Player

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

This year's game will be "easy" in the sense that it is (or should be) familar to anyone who has been around the last 5 years. But like Kit mentioned, there is a lot of stuff to do. I agree that teams will need to be able to do a lot, and do it well, to be 'on top' this year. (sorry, bad pun :p)

Good luck, everyone!

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I think that this years competition would be easy in theory, and what you have to do to get points is fairly simple in words, but building a bot to do it will be a different story. Hanging from the bar a couple years ago was pretty hard, and now the bars at 10'. The only thing im not happy about this year is the dependancy on a human player. i would rather have the bots do everything.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

As far as the veteran advantage of knowing how to handle the big balls and the bar from 2000 and 2001 there are a few things.
1) the bar is twice as high, lot harder
2) the only people on vet teams that will know that are adult team advisors who were involved those years, college students now mentoring teams who were involved in their HS or college team those years, or the HS seniors. The HS juniors sophomores and freshmen werent around. Besides, out of that portion of people (involved in 2000 and 2001), the only ones who will know how to handle the bar or big balls are people who built robots that could handle those elements in the 3 and 4 years ago.

it's not as big of an advantage as you think.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

I think the game is well balanced, rookie teams can easily puch the goals and score the purple balls and knock out the 2x ball. Intermediate teams can go for moving the 2x ball and blocking the step, and the veterans can go for the bar and anything.

Re: who thinks this years competion is easy
 

Well im sure some of those teams still have those bots from those years sitting around the shop somewhere all they gotta do is go and look....and i'm also sure they took pictures of it. Most of the time for a concept all you need is a picture.



in relation to this year though the hanging very different and the big balls, well its almost the same just that its different in that instead of having a fixed height of an 8ft goal, you would want an arm that could handle placing the ball on both the 4ft goal and the 6ft one.