Re: New Competition Rules
 

Yeah. I think they expected you to get the hint after the first few times they cut your duct tape instead of stubbornly continuing to break the rules. How many seats did you save and on average, how many were filled during the competition?

I'm pretty sure the seat saving rule is to give every team a chance at some good seats and also to cut down on the dead space in the seats during rounds. Nothing like looking into the stands and seeing massive gaping holes in the sea of humanity protected by someone's duct tape....

Also about the banners. There IS a problem hanging them in the arena and on pit walls. Those areas are obviously much more official looking than if the banner is in your pit or being held up in the stands. Sponsors pay a lot of money to fund a regional, and they might be slightly annoyed by teams covering up their banners or elbowing in on their ad space.

And all the machining stuff.... first off, it was "welding/soldering." To me, this clearly indicates heavy duty structural soldering, so electrical stuff is probably ok. To whoever said that mobile machine shops should be legal if the team takes liability. The team can only take liablity for it's own members. If a chuck key flies across the pits, FIRST pays the bill. This same logic goes for grinding. Sparks fly far, and if a nearby team is mixing up some fiberglass or something similarly flammable, you've got an instant conflagration. I know all this stuff seems terribly unlikely, but that's what a lot of safety stuff is about, preventing unlikely but potentially tragic accidents.

I've said it in another thread. FIRST has good reasons for making these rules and plotting how to circumvent them is counterproductive. Especially cause FIRST could have "seat posses." Or worse, repeated blatant disregard for rules could just get the whole competition paused until people start listening.

Re: New Competition Rules
 

Thats a fantastic attitude... :rolleyes:

Cory

And you wonder why the rule is there?

Re: New Competition Rules
 

Personally, I think the water rule is stupid, but really...how are they going to be able to enforce this one? Still, if worse comes to worse, just take the cheap way out: buy one water bottle and refill it continuously during the three days. They didn't say that we could only drink bottled water that's prefilled, did they? :)

As far as the seat saving goes...I'm assuming that this is referring to teams who would use methods like the duct tape or placing those gigantic signs over their seats. I don't think there's any way they can declare leaving a backpack or a coat in a chair "seat saving" and not anger everyone at the competitions. So there's always that method. Besides...if need be, we can work together to make sure that teams still sit together. I'm sure that 818 - and most other teams - wouldn't mind shifting a few seats over to give another team a chance to be together to watch their matches.

Re: New Competition Rules
 

generally we were saving 10-14 seats with 3-7 members sitting there if we were working in the pits and 14 there if we were competing. our issue was with the gigantic teams saving all the seats, and we couldn't sit together, so when they'd break up our spot, we'd have to mix in with all the other teams to find space...

Re: New Competition Rules
 

I believe it was Woodie who encouraged everyone at UTC NE Regional last year to form the tunnel during the awards ceremony. And I enjoyed it, both as an award recipient and as someone congratulating other teams as they traveled to the stage to pick up their award... But if it created a safety hazard (perhaps they felt it blocked aisles that need to remain open in case of emergency) then of course, we shouldn't do it.

As far as food, our team usually purchases a simple lunch for everyone on the team on Friday and brings it in. If required to purchase our food at the venues, then the food must be moderately priced; the booths adequately staffed so that the lines move quickly and everyone has the opportunity to get and eat their food within the allotted lunch break. And of course, provide ingredients lists so that people with dietary restrictions and/or food allergies can make choices that are appropriate if we cannot bring our own food choices into the building.

(BTW, RAGE #173 is offering to host a mini-social on either Wed or Thurs night of the UTC NE Regional - maybe we can get together with other teams to do an inexpensive dinner to help strained budgets - see thread .And I think the morning tailgating idea is a great way to stir enthusiasm at the same time as providing breakfast for team members.. Let's hope there's warmer temps and no 8 inches of snow like at last year's UTC Regional, though!

Re: New Competition Rules
 

If you don't want to lose your seat have team members stick nearby. If spectators or other teams want to sit in the middle of your team, well that's fine. They just better not complain if their surrounded by a pack of enthusiastic crazies who cheer all day long.
We have a 25 x 20 banner and we just put it up far in the stands at Cleveland where no one was going to sit anyways (unless they really wanted a great birds eye veiw of the pit action instead of watching the competition.
The food thing is no different thatn if you go to a sporting event or a movie. No outside food. Yes they overcharge. It's called capritive audiance and often the food is terrible. The vendors could care less. This is not a FIRST issue it's a site issue and it will be that way no matter where you go. There is nothig FIRST can do about it. ARA even lords over my job. We cannot sell our own candy and goodies there. They have a contract and it must be honored.
The noisemaker deal stinks but I know we X-Cats can be just as loud with pur own voices (we only use the clappers ocasionally and there is not enough to go around and they fall apart after a while). We'll survive.

Re: New Competition Rules
 

For what its worth...

http://www.dumblaws.com/explanations...n.php?LawID=41

Law: It is unlawful to refuse a person a glass of water.
Country: USA
State: Arizona


Explanation: In the summer-time, with temperatures reaching topping 120 degrees, often people will need water, but may not have the
money to pay for it (mainly applies to homeless).
Hence, the law. It is very much in effect today, with
businesses being reported (and heavily fined) who
refuse to supply water to those who ask for it.
Convenience stores are the primary businesses who uphold
this law.

Re: New Competition Rules
 

Where does it say you can't bring in water? It says not to give water to other teams. In fact, in the stuff to bring, it says water bottles


Noisemakers were already disallowed in the pits, and many people disobeyed the rules. It also says no obnoxious noisemakers. Personally, I think that God gave you your best noisemakers, your hands and your voice.


all were already illegal


not exactly a new rule, just an clarification of the no outside food rule


no, just don't hang your banners and abandon them. Keep them with your team, or at your pit.


Neither are new rules. As for saving seats, FIRST was clear that PEOPLE may save seats, but ITEMS may not. They also ask that you be gracious and if the arena is full, don't save seats at all.


I don't have a problem with this, do you?

Re: New Competition Rules
 

4) I understand why this rule was put in place (its been said before about the mess left), but that doesnt mean i like it. I loved how last year at the Canadian Regional the Kingsville Kukes (team 773) gave out little cucumbers to all the teams (their mascot is a cucumber).

6) I like this one. I think it means there is less of a mess for FIRST to clean up afterwards and it is also a safety issue.

7) I like this for the normal competition, but I think that when it comes to the awards ceremony, saving seats should be allowed because if your team wins an award, you will want to run down together ... and look like a team

8) my only question with this is, what if you bought the shirt outside of the arena the morning of ?? would that still be breaking the rule, because the competition may be the only time you see the team, and mailing can be a hassle ??

obviously, i hope that everyone follows the rules in the spirit of gracious professionalism

Re: New Competition Rules
 

Re: New Competition Rules
 

I doubt that FIRSt has much control over that. It's not their building to begin with and there are already vendors there, with pre-existant contracts. This really is not somethign that FIRSt is trying to do for the vendors, it's something they have to do in order to have the competition... ;)

Regarding the water bottle thing...there is only an extent with which they can uphold that rule. Like the person who mentioned the law in arizona regarding water, it is unlawful for them to make you purchase water, especially because you might not have the money to purchase one. They really legally cannot enforce that rule. Worst case scenario, you spend two dollars on a bottle opf water and refill it usign the bathroom faucets...but I realyl don't see any reason why you can't bring your own bottle of water and refill it in the same manner or from a water fountain...it's not like they're gonna be able to tell the difference between aquafina from the supermarket back home and from the aquafina there at the regional...They really legally cannot uphold that rule though as aforementioned.

Re: New Competition Rules
 

Now maybe I'm the crazy one, but it has already been mentioned twice that YOU ARE ALLOWED TO BRING YOUR OWN WATER! You just can't pass it out as a promotion.

As for saving seats, I'm not going to competition to sit around. Of coarse I'll be in the seats for awards, scouting, etc. but it shouldn't be a major issue and its definitly NOT going to be my highest priority. I'm with my team everyday for six weeks. I'm not concerned with the entire team sitting around together, I would rather our team be out doing something productive during most of the competition.

And the noisemakers? If you leave the competition with your voice, somethings wrong. ;)

Re: New Competition Rules
 

Yeah, I think whoever made this thread should have read the rules a bit more before complaining. Especially on the water bottle point. I thought the rules were pretty clear there. And the banners, too.

Re: New Competition Rules
 

I can see why many people have their opinions on this topic. Each side really has a point. However,
I did find those noisemaking devised incredibly annoying, even worse than losing! (Then again we did have one of the coolest carts in 2001 or so)

The candy and banner rules are just stupid

Im disapointed about the machining, thats the best part.
Saving seats is fine, i mean, theres a whole stadium left!

And im sure people being asked for funds from 100+ teams get pretty annoyed.

But, i think the focus should really be on the teams and on the robot, afterall its teamwork and building/learning stuff that this competition is based on. The rule guys shouldnt have to go nuts coming up with all these new rules.

Re: New Competition Rules
 

Amen to that!! And for those of you who chose one of the first 2 options on the poll, why are you in FIRST? Show some spirit! And if you chose the last, you were probably too busy (like most of my team) building.

and as for darn...i was planning on doing the machining in the stands too...