Cost of attending wap party
 

Posted today.

Teams not using the package at the FIRST endorsed hotels can purchase a option to attend the party.

Cost $90.00 for this option. I really hope that this was for the entire team as $90 each person is a value that no past team party has even come close to, even at Disney.

pasta and salad $90.00 WOW inflation.

Re: Cost of attending wap party
 

Hold your breath, count to ten, and think about this for a minute.

FIRST did one thing right - they have responded to the team's requests, and put this option together and made it available (remember, WE ASKED to have FIRST make something like this available as an option to teams).

FIRST did one thing wrong - they did a horrible job of explaining the cost (i.e. they didn't bother to explain it at all).

Yes, it is $90 per person. But everyone has to realize that $90 covers a heck of a lot more than just pasta and salad. Putting on an event like the wrap party is NOT an inexpensive endeavor. The cost per person has to cover food and drink. But it also has to cover rental of the facility, entertainment costs, facility staff overtime and related personnel costs, emergency medical response support, clean-up and janitorial services, adminsitrative costs, equipment rentals, lighting and support equipment (particularly if it is an outdoor event), and security costs. Particularly in this day and age, security considerations are very real and VERY expensive - that item alone can easily make up over half the cost we are being charged.

Is this cost to attend the event at high end of the spectrum? That is possible, but given the costs I have seen for other very large events I am not so sure that is necessarily the case. Remember - this is a party for 15,000 people which is a whole different scale than many of us are used to. Saying "I can host a gathering of 150 at the local VFW hall for $30 a head, so why can't FIRST do the same?" really isn't applicable.

Is it completely unreasonable? I don't think so.

Is it worth $90 per person for your team to attend the party? That is up to each team to decide.

Could FIRST have done a better job in explaining why the cost is the way it is? You betcha.

-dave

Re: Cost of attending wap party
 

If the cost was less than $90, there'd be no incentive to use the THS-provided hotels. ;)

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

Mike,
I believe that Dave is right about the extensive services required to pull off an event as large as this wrap party. The wrap parties at Disney sort of hid the services, as they were already in place. Those type of businesses are already capable of dealing with a crowd larger than the wrap party every day. We often only see the stuff that we want to see - remember, to others the wrap party is much, much more than what you described.
I agree that FIRST could have been clearer as to what you get for the $90/person. Does this implies that the teams using THS have $90 of the package price/person going towards the wrap party? I know that if I were heading a team on a shoestring budget I would be tempted to go "offsite", but now with the $90/person wrap party it might swing my planning make to using THS (if going to wrap party was a team agreed MUST do event) Just my thoughts for what they are worth

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

I am hearing from many teams that they are on a very tight budget. Teams that are trying to figure out how to get to Atlanta now that they are going. The cost of the THS packages in some respects are reasonable ( compared to Epcot and on par as compared to Houston ). At the regional level the prices and services are quite good.

Each team will have to choose, and Yes teams did ask for the information to plan fundraising. What still needs to be clarified is what the event will actually be like. This will lead to an informed decision, however timing is tough at this point for teams.

There is tremendous overhead at any event of this scale to be sure, especially if the event is not part of an already structure ( Six Flags or Epcot ) that is set up for the most part as their normal public operation.

Some tough decision will need to be made by teams.

Re: Cost of attending wap party
 

I don't know Dave; I'm comparing this to attending some other similar size event like maybe a rock concert. We have all day affairs here, with 6-8 top name bands for entertainment, the facility probably holds about 15,000 and I GUARANTEE they have all the overhead you mentioned - rental of the facility, entertainment costs, facility staff overtime and related personnel costs, emergency medical response support, clean-up and janitorial services, adminsitrative costs, equipment rentals, lighting and support equipment (particularly if it is an outdoor event), and security costs. And I've never seen the price over $50 - usually more like $25. (Lynyrd Skynyrd will be here for $15 next month) We weren't eating steak and lobster at the wrap parties - it was lemonade, taco's, etc. You can go to 6 flags ALL DAY for less than $30, and I know you won't eat $60 worth of food.

$90 times 15,000 is $1.35 MILLION! Get serious - they can do better. It's nice to have a private party, but if it prices out most of the teams then it's not private - it's exclusive. Time to try something else.

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

It's not just about the cost of the party as you can see from the flyer on the FIRST site. They are also including event support and administration fees into this $90. The Championship event as a whole is very expensive to put together. Some of this cost is covered by the team registration fee, some by sponsors, and some is passed on to teams through the packages to cover basic administration fees. I have been involved in the development of the team packages this year and this is really the best we could do. Understand that FIRST is trying to give us the best event possible as well as a low cost to teams. It's not easy to find a happy middle.

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

Well.....

Here, give my attachment a look. It's the financials from the FIRST Annual Report, made into a working Excel spreadsheet. The first tab is your raw numbers, with all the working calculations, and the 2nd tab is the same stuff thrown into percentages of their sum, with a 3rd column added to denote changes from the last year.

What's the largest change in operating expenses? The Championship Event!!! Up 14% from 2002. If I remember correctly, 2002 was the last time that Nationals was held in Epcot. Switching over to something that is less-cost inclusive than Disney is (aka, Houston), means there's going to be added cost. If you play with the numbers a little, and take out the expense of the championship, FIRST would be pulling a profit of $2,104,567, a 54% increase from last year as opposed to a loss of $65,070, a 6% decrease.

Side note: It will be interesting to see where FIRST goes with Nationals placing....I'd love to look in on the cost analysis of settling Nationals in one city as opposed to this city-jumping thing they're doing now.

Plus, the money coming in is worth less than it has been. Though they have more revenue, they have even more expenses (because of the championship), and their cash-on-hand is also lower. As it was said in the annual report thread, Dean didn't give money directly to FIRST and there was no auction (FIRST had an auction?). Thus, to compensate for future costs, the next step should be to increase the money coming in, and reduce the costs dealing with the Championship.

Also, you're sending your $90 to THS, not to FIRST....thus, I wouldn't be surprised if THS was adding a premium onto the actual costs for "the trouble of putting it all together", because that is how they make their money.

So to conclude, I'm not saying that the $90 is cheap, or expensive...but I hope I shed some light on what's going on with FIRST financially (from what I could dig up). I know that I feel better once I see the breakdown of it all.

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

I don't seem to be taken seriously on another thread since I spelled Wrap incorrectly so I will post this here. Does anyone have a good/detailed description of the Wrap event. I look at the description of the Centennial Park and I'm left wondering what activities are planned. $90 seems expensive for a event where networking is the primary activity.

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

If networking is the primary activity... then $90 is well worth it! (Trust me on this one, networking is one of the best investments you can make.)

Although I do not know the specifics, I've heard a few things about the Wrap Party from FIRST personel. I'd be disappointed if I couldn't go... it sounds like a good time.

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

Just remember this... teams attending Nats have already shelled out at minimum $9,000.00 to FIRST, so to me $90.00 per person is a bit extreme

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

How can you say this? FIRST breaks even every year, they're not looking to make a profit. With this day and age, $25 goes to security, $45 goes to an insurance company, and $20 goes to the actual event cost.

Re: Cost of attending wrap party
 

I think you guys have done a great job explaining where that $90 come from. We all understand FIRST is a non-profit organization, and we all know money is hard to come by.

Looking at the stand point of the teams, 90 dollars per person is quite expensive if the team already paid the entry fee to the Championship Event. A lot of students cannot afford an addition 90 dollars to spend, having been one of the high school students myself (my parents could barely afford the ticket and hotel cost).

If my team isn't getting the hotel package, and ask if I will pay another 90 dollars to go to the party, I probably would've said no, no matter how much I understand where the money goes to. I probably would've gone out with some other team members and go get food some where else.

Remember, the Chief Delphi Forum community is a small part of FIRST. There are a lot of FIRST students who doesn't know as much people as we do, and usually only hang out with people in their own team, or friends on other local teams. I remember before 2001, I was just another student on the Gunn robotics team, and I only hang out with GRT people. I got just as much inspiration and fun as any other people. I suspect that's the case for a lot of other high school students.

In my experience, the Championship Event is too big to meet all of people, and too short of a time to actually meet many of them. It had also been really expensive for me to travel to the event. Personally I've had a much more enjoyable time hanging out with people at regionals and off season competition. They were much smaller and personal when it come to meeting people and enjoying the competition experience. To me, the Championship Event is just a big show to see as much robotics happening at the same time as possible.

A lot of things I can do in the Championship event I can also do at regionals and off season, such as networking, meeting people and hanging out with them, and talk to FIRST staff, etc.

But that's just my experience. When you decide whether or not this event really worth the time and money, you shouldn't need other people to tell you if it is worth it or not. If you never attended it, I highly recommend spending the money to do so for the first time. Afterward, you have that experience to tell you whether additional money is worth spending for a 2nd, 3rd, 4th championship event and so on.