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Pressure on Drive Team
How much pressure is an appropriate amount to put on your drive team? I ask this question of students, teachers, and mentors alike. How much pressure do different members of your team place on the drive team itself? Is it enough that at the end of competition they go home and are asleep by 8:30 and don't wake up until 15 hours later? Or is it so little that they hardly mind the outcome of a match as long as they have fun? Is there a "right" amount of pressure to put on a drive team? If a member of the drive team makes a critical mistake, at your first regional, should they be "fired" and replaced? Or should they be given time to relax and become more comfortable with the robot?
Please, don't argue with anyone's posts in this thread. A statement of how your team does things will be fine...there isn't a "right" answer...I am interested in seeing how others do it. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Well from my experience as a coach on the drive team, I'd love it if everyone did everything possible to remove pressure. Our whole operating team is so $@#$@#$@#$@# nervous whenever we go up. the 15 hours of sleep after competition is no exaggeration. Of course, i may be a little biased because im one of the people making decisions on the team, so i sorta put the pressure on myself, but im pretty sure that even without their team bothering them, any drive team has more than enoughs stress.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
I don't think it's too much to ask that your drive team get at least an 8 hour nights rest. I feel the pressure can't be put on the driver but has to be applied to the coach. There the ones who really make it happen.
The best driver is one who can ellegantly operate the machine and is excellent at taking direction. The outcome of a match should really be decided by the coach who is running strategies through his/her head and telling the drivers what to do. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Well
we do feel the pressure but the team member are told to yell at the coach |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
as a driver... i knew that there would be a substantial amount of pressure to perform well at regionals. however, i was also prepared to take this pressure, no matter how much was set upon my shoulders. upon signing up for this position, i knew that pressure would come my way, and i was willing to take it all.
i am fortunate enough to be on a team where my peers are more encouraging rather than being negative after a bad match. they suggest better ways of doing things, as opposed to trashing the way things were done before. being a driver for four years, my mentors know exactly how much pressure I can take from them, and they try to avoid pushing me over this limit. also, i am not only recieving the pressure, but i also tend to pressure my team mates, and especially the rest of the drive team. teamwork is necessary when driving, and i expect the arm operator to do exactly what we're being told to do, and not doing whatever he wants. all in all, pressure from our peers and mentors is needed to perform well. pressure to an extent is good, and it keeps the drivers on their toes. however, once a person pushes the drive team over the edge with this pressure, then things can turn ugly pretty quickly, and this should be avoided (afterall, we are here to have fun arent we? :yikes: ) |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
the drive team puts enough pressure on itself that they really don't need other people doing it for them.
if a coach is applying pressure on a driver, then you really need to find a new coach. This year, the coaches only job should be feeding balls to the human player, and maybe watching the other side of the field to alert the driver to opportunities that may present themselves. all strategy and decision making authority rests within the driver, as he or she is the only one who can truly affect on the spot decisions. trying to have a coach making the decisions and then telling the driver what to do allows for way too much confusion in a match - concentrating all of that strategy within only the driver eliminates that confusion. don't be hard on the drivers, just trust them to do what it is they do. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
15 hours of sleep... are you kidding? I'm lucky if I get 4-5 at a competition, and I havent noticed it affect me adversely yet!
I think that there shouldnt be much pressure on the drive team at all. I believe they do their best when left to do their own thing. Cory |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
after youve been doing FIRST for several years you realize you cant take the competitions too seriously
on our team we designed our bot to perform certain functions, and we see the competition as a chance to see how well we designed and built it so we measure our success based on how well our bot does what we wanted it to - and all we ask from our drive team is to do their best to make the bot perform the way we intended and we also stress that 25 of us spent 6 weeks designing and building this thing - and they only have 2 minutes on the field to make it do its stuff, so if the match doesnt go well they should not feel like they let us down - because they are only a small part of the whole team if our team was perfect our bot would be perfect - it would do everything and do it well - it would be a dream to drive - a child could operate it but we never had a perfect bot - so the driver has a less than perfect machine to work with -why would we expect the drive team to be perfect? If we succeed, we succeed as a team if we fail, we fail as a team but either way, we are a team - we go home together and celebrate our accomplishments, whatever they are and try to learn from our mistakes. |
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As for the coach not being able to make decisions, i dont agree. I think i have been pretty effective at coach but this is because i had experience driving at the last regional. I really dont think anyone should be coach without driving and playing a couple of matches (at least practice rounds). You really need to know what your robot can do, and you cant get that from watching. |
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
i know (from experience) how much pressure the drivers put on themselves. i know the thing that gets me all nervous before a match is if im going to perform well or not. it's in the back of my mind all the time in competition. i can't help but think, that if we lose a match, it's my fault. we (as many other teams ive seen) all have great robots, very capable of winning, so it seems like if it's not a technical problem, it's all driver error. despite all the encouragement i get from the instructors and team mates, i still get REAL nervous. giving drivers any MORE pressure will probably not help them out at all.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Max - we got picked by 211 to be alliance partners at Pittsburgh - when the elim matches were starting our two drivers were in the pitts, half asleep on the floor
not that they were up all night - they were just very relaxed and laid back BTW - are you really an engineer? 17year old engineer? thats amazing :^) |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
A driver feels all the same pressure a star athelete would on a football team before their homecoming game..and this pressure is felt every match.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
This is coming from a four year drive team member and lifelong basketball player....remember experiance varies with everyone.
This is a hairy topic...Its similar to that of sports teams....being on the drive team means that you are accepting a certian level of pressure. Its no different that being on a basketball team or football team or whatever. And if you make an error or lose a match just get back up and try it agian. The amount of pressure really does stem from the drive team and the personalities is the point im trying to make. -Pat |
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
As a fellow driver, I can tell you how it works on our team.
The drivers and the robot are the real "avatars" for teams, as the robot is what several people have labored over for several weeks and the drivers are the ones who best qualify to operate it. The drive team is responsible for getting at least 8 hours of sleep every night, and we spend a lot of our free time concentrating on the game, thinking about possible strategies, and going over future matches in our heads. The team itself gives the drive team fairly free reign - as long as the drivers act responsibly on (and off) the field, no blame is given, and the drivers appreciate that. Mistakes can be made on the field, but as long as they are learned from, it's okay. Pressure imposed on the drive team from external forces (team memebers, mentors) is, in my opinion, unjustified and possibly harmful. A good driver is under pressure already - as an avatar of the team, it is his/her goal to present the team is the best possible manner (once again, on and off the field), and this pressure to perform to one's best in every way is more than enough pressure for any individual. Outside pressure can only distract a committed driver from his goals. For the most part, it's up to other members of the drive team and the team itself to recognize when a drive team member is pressuring himself/herself too much, and try and loosen them up a bit. Sure, matches get lost, bad things happen, you make a terrible mistake that costs your alliance the game - but don't focus so hard on your failures that you are unable to succeed. I'd say these are distilled words of wisdom from our drive coach, Andy. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Well, being a new coach, I think there is a very fine balance of "pressure" or rather teamwork that needs to be applied within the driveteam. I do not feel that a driver or operator should be the ones making all the strategy decisions. In this game especially, there are so many things going on, that there is no way the driver can see what the best move is all the time. That's why you have a coach, operator, and human player as extra sets of eyes.
Now depending on the experience level of the operators, they can make their own decisions at any given moment to the best of their ability. Veteran operators have a hand up in the decision making capability. Rookie operators would probably need more coaching. Rookies may also feel more "pressure" simply because they don't have the experience at operating or strategy choices, and they are always trying to do their best. I do feel that the driver and operator need to have a very good line of calm communication, because they literally have to work together in operating that robot. As far as the coach is concerned, I think one of their main roles is to guide the strategy, while taking as much input from the student operators as possible. I think that some level of strategy should be thought out before you get to the field because that also eliminates confusion on the field. I think if all 4 drive team members have good communication, trust, and teamwork, the confusion factor will be minimized, if not eliminated. As far as one of the original questions, I don't think that so much pressure should be put on the student operators that they get flustered and pressurized on the field, or they may wind up making unnecessary mistakes. Nor should they be "fired" if they make a couple critical mistakes. It's a learning process for everyone in many aspects. Each team needs to figure out what the right balance of seriousness/pressure and fun is for them, because we are to have fun, as well as go far in the competition. This year we had driveteam try-outs. We had several candidates for each position, gave them all chances at our first regional, and by Friday morning, felt comfortable to narrow it down to one person per position based on various aspects of their performance. Regardless, the drive team needs to know how to work calmly under pressure. You may have other team members critiquing your performance each match, but it's typically constructive criticism to help you improve and tell you things you may have missed. There's always times where students/adults will freak out during matches, but in my opinion, as long as it's not 100% of the time (or even 51%), you're probably doing ok. Everything's not always about winning (even though it's great to win!). Mistakes happen, everybody makes them, learn from it and go on. And the amount of sleep... depends on the person, but 7-8hrs should do..... and by the way, I don't think any member of the drive team should feel they need to take full responsibility for losses, mistakes, etc. And nobody else should make you feel that way. If the drive team is being "blamed" for everything that goes wrong, then it would seem there's something wrong with the level of team support. If you put the blame on yourself, buck up and remember that you didn't (and shouldn't) make every single decision that led to any result. Same goes for winning. Chances are, there's a large number of people involved in the team's results, not just the driveteam. I think that's how we do it.... |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Ideally, the drive team has no pressure.
Realistically, there's pressure from everyone. But you know what, after three years, I've learned to simply tune it out. As the lead driver on my team, even with an almost completely untested robot that didn't work nearly up to par (we'll be fixing that tomorrow, don't you worry ;-)), I was under a lot of pressure to make everything work as it should. Well, obviously, things broke, things failed, and I didn't drive as I should have, had everything been in mint condition. So, I went out, and I drove, and I had fun, and you know something, we were regional finalists. No one expected that, and from the moment I stepped on the field in elims, it was all fun. Pressure was gone, if I didn't win, well, we made it to the elims with 1/4 of a robot, we won in the game as far as I was concerned. So, long story short, drive teams, don't pressure them more than you need to. Veteren drivers will be able to do most of the stuff by themselves, and be pretty relaxed. New drivers, the opposite applies. Just remember, FIRST isn't about the robot, just have fun, meet new people, and try to learn something new. Killing yourself with inhumane amounts of pressure just isn't fun for anyone. I'm surprised no one made any pneumatics jokes yet... :-p |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
OK this what we do.
Our Drive Team is not just team members that just drive the robot. The Drive Team are made up of the hardest working people on the team. I mean the ones working on the robot. This year we have 4 members on the Drive Team and those people include the one who operates our CNC machine at school and those basically everything else. this is the driver. He is the driver. then there is Shervin. He is our programmer and he does some machining. He is the operator. After him is the human player, Matt. He does some machining and stuff. Finally there is me. My name is Ali and I do some machining and I am back-up operater and full-time coach. We are the only ones that work on the robot so we know the robot the best and therfore we "play" with it. I might also mention that even though we are a eight year them, Jeff and I are only Juniors and Shervin and Matt and Sophmores. We are the most dedicated and the smartest ones on the team So thats basically what we do. There is more that I can only tell you in person. Oh, I have a question. Why is it that that the Drive Team for other teams are madeup of people who don't work on the robot? Just asking. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
And about the pressure thing we only give pressure to ourselves. We don't take crap from others.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Back in 2001 when I was driver I felt a lot of pressure. Basically in the elimination rounds the score of all 5 teams in our alliance came down to my ability to balance 2 goals on the bridge in about 10 seconds. Drive a little too far back, the bridge tips the other direction, and we lose the regional. Luckily I never felt the pressure during the match, but I would be incredibly nervous before the match. Driving in front of everyone at the national finals on einstein didn't help much either, but luckily I didn't have to balance goals in those matches.
Now that this is my 4th year driving, I barely get nervous at all. Just whatever happens, happens. If we lose, that's fine with me. If we win, great. In the end I don't think it affects my driving ability at all whether I'm nervous or not because I'm never nervous when I'm actually driving, only before the match. During the match I tune everything out except for the field, the other driver, and my coach. And I'm always exhausted after a regional. We've gotten good at building robots that need to be repaired constantly, so I'm usually busy in the pits. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
I think that the drive team has a lot of pressure put on them
The pressure comes from everywhere. From themselves, to show that theyre worthy enough to be part of the drive team and to win the match. From other teammates, to win the match. From other teams. Even if the team is supportive and encouraging, there will always be that peer pressure put on the drive team. And it is extremely easy to sit in the stands and criticise the matches. But, then its like what Ken said earlier, we fail as a team and we succeed as a team. I don't think everything should get blamed on the drive team. I know that I have told my team a few times that no matter what happens, the driver is not to be blamed if something goes horribly wrong. Its the whole teams fault. But then again when you choose your drive team, you pick the people who will not freeze under pressure and know how to deal with it if they screw up. |
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being the person or people who put the most work into building and designing the robot has nothing to do with your driving abilities do the engineers from Ford or GM drive the race cars they build on the track? No - of course not on our team we have always let anyone who wants to be a driver have practice time, either with previous robots, our practice robot, and with our current robot - then at some point we have a contest in one form or another, and SEE who can actually drive the machine the best. Putting the most time and effort into the build phase of the project does not magiacally endow you with driving skills - in fact, people who have been busy practicing driving while you were busy building would most likely be better drivers. We also had HP pratice this year, usually people had to leave build work they were doing to go get shooting practice - and they were the best shooters. A team is where everyone has one thing they do best and performs that function - not where one or two people try to do everything themselves. Quote:
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
its all about having fun! I am on the drive team and we get a max of 4 hours of sleep a night during competitions.
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I was so completely focused on my robot as SBPLI during one match, that I hadn't even noticed our alliance parnter, 311, had been tipped outside of the field, and that all of 311 was screaming at me to get the one last ball for them to shoot. After we won the match, I looked back up, and saw their robot sprawled along the rail, and asked when that happened. I just got a funny look from everyone. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
actually thats good. The coach should be the one keeping an eye on the whole field, and telling the drivers what to do next (go get those balls, cap that goal, go around the left and get on the platform)
when you are driving you need to stay focused on what YOUR bot is doing, not what everyone elses bot is doing the coach is the captain of the team -he shouts out orders and everyone else says "yes sir!" :c) |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
I believe that the drive team should have as little pressure as possible during the days of the matches. Infact I take it upon my self as captain to find out ways to relieve the pressure for each of the members. Whether it be getting their mind off the game or making sure they know exactly what has to be done in the game, I want them to be as relaxed as possible before and during a match. Sometimes you just have to trust the drivers you picked and let them do their thing with no interruptions.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
I've been coaching for a number of years and I find that each year I have to change my approach to match the characteristics of the students on and off the field. My general process doesn't change. Once our drivers are selected they work as a team along with the students off the field to set up all the matches and get the robot working. I try to alleviate the pressure from my drive team, placed by other members of the team and natural environment of the competition, and make it a fun loving atmosphere where the students have confidence in executing their plan so they can attempt to enjoy the fastest 2 minutes of their life. It is a team effort and my goal is to involve the greatest number of people who will be productive towards the team. Removing pressure from the entire team is a tricky thing to do, especially when other team leaders continue to place pressure onto the team. All anyone can do is to take the competition one match at a time, and attempt to relax though all of the emotions that develop through the course of the event.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
There is a lot of pressure to do well. But it depends more on what you define as being successful and who is defining it.
First, we have a lot of sponsor, a supportive community and high school. They would define success in most cases as winning. They get more recognition for this. I know they define other things as success but this is the main one. They would like you to bring a trophy home and preferably the champion one. This can put pressure on drive teams but is more distant in their minds. Second, is expectation and past experience. They all say how being a second-year team is the hardest. I agree. Last year, with no expectations, we were able to win 5 awards (4 at LSR, and 1 at Nats). This year the pressure from last years performance is tremendous. I think a lot of people would be dissapointed if we don't have a similiar showing this year and I it is likely that we won't. This pressure is close and very detrimental to the team in general. Forgetting past experiences and looking to how you can succeed this year can help in relieving stress. Third, the drive team can put a great stress on themselves. This is where choosing the correct drive team can be better than having the best robot. The drive team needs to be able to work together through this high stress situation. They need great teamwork, communication, and cool heads. Our main driver last year was extremely level-headed and was able to do well by not being under pressure. But like other have said this is like any sports team. You perform as well as you can under the pressure and then left go of whatever has happened. I always use one of my former doubles tennis partners for this example. He would play great and make great shot until he lost his cool. After that he would hold onto whatever mistake he made or whatever made him angry while he made worse upon worse shots. We went 0-16 that year. Keep your cool under pressure and let go of whatever mistake you have made and you will perform at your ability. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Excellent question. Let me frame my answer by saying I ws an athletic coach for ten years and for the past four years I have helped shape and manage Team 103's scouting and strategy operations which are designed to support the efforts of the field coach, human player, and drive team.
Pressure: It exists no matter how a team approaches things. A drive team is in front of thousands of people representing their school, community, and sponsors. TV cameras are often rolling. You can never remove it and you ceretainly don't want them to feel overwhelmed on one side or "beaten down" on the other. A balanced approach seems best, but each driver has his/her own personality and that too is a consideration. In order to alleviate that pressure, more than 20 of our team members have some role in scouting/strategy in order to ensure we have an extremely well prepared and informed drive team so their focus can stay just on "the next match". Mistakes: This depends on how you define "mistake". Drivers making mistakes because of inexperience or human error is what I call a true mistake and can easily be understood and forgiven. Drivers need unique thinking, athletic, and interpersonal abilities to be successful and should be chosen carefully. Many of these mistakes over a prolonged period of time MAY indicate a need for a change. Then there is a whole other category that may look the same to an observer, but in reality is not a mistake. This would be a driver who makes decisions on their own and ignores or discounts communication from field coaches and partners. Each person has a job to do out there and, in order to be consistently successful, complete trust and respect is paramount. A driver who displays this type of behavior may need to be replaced (for the good of the team) a lot more quickly. Thankfully, in my four years, we have never had the need to replace a driver because of our careful selection process and diligent efforts to support the drive team with the best information possible. This is not to say we haven't made mistakes that we have learned from. We sure have! In the end, it's an important job that needs to be taken seriously, yet it needs to be enjoyed because so few FIRST participants get to experience the thrill of the player's station. |
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I know as the driver of our team for three yers that the drive team alone puts alot of pressure on themselves that they don't need anymore pressure from the other members on the team. I mean sure tell us what we might have done wrong during a match but dont ridicule us for it. But as for pressure on ourselves in know that everytime we go up for a match my stomach is doing flips the whole time we are waiting for our match to start. As for sleep the leaders of our team don't make us get a certain amount of sleep each night during competitions, as long as we are able to get up at work at out best the next day.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Having done just about every job imaginable in my 10 years of FIRST, I must say that being a member of the drive team is by far the most difficult job. You can equate drive crew to the Quarterback in football. The drive crew is the center of the team, they get the most glory when successful, but also get the most flack when something goes wrong. After coaching on a couple of different teams for a few years, I have learned to never insult or question any decisions the drive crew takes. Being up in the stands watching a match is completely different than being down on the field. Your vantage point is much different, the field is harder to see, and frankly its quite crowded back there...not easy to think straight.
In short...go easy on your drive crew. Keep in mind that every match is a huge emotional roller coaster for all of them. If you just keep them looking forward, and you focus on your strategy for the next round...you might just be successful more often than not. After all...we are here to have fun...right? Good Luck, Andy Grady |
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Sleep is the only thing our advisors really care about for the drive team. Not that we abide by their wishes. I remember in Chesapeake I was in bed at 11:30. Then our alumni coach came knocking on the door with my jacket. Not to mention the Chilli that found its way into our room (dont ask). This mistake by the alumni room members caused us drivers to get even AHEM... The wars went on till past 1AM :D (Known as Hotel Room Wars)
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Luckily I am a memeber of the drive team on a pretty good team. I have never had any of my teamates come up to me and criticze any decision made by someone while up on the stage. They know that we hold tryouts for a reason, so the best people for the job are up on the stage when it counts. Personally the person who puts the most pressure on the dirve team is the drive team itself because they seem to always feel humble and how they arn't the best so they will often question their decision however, the team is always their to support them becuase they know they did there best and that all that they can ask for. Besides if a drive team is up their concerned about what others on their team is thinking of what is going on than the drive team si unable to truly focus on the game to the amount that is needed on the stage 110%
P.S. Besides if a drive memeber on my team slept for 15 hours after a competiton as soon as he got home he wouldn't get up till 1 or 2 the next after noon and the buses will have already left at 6:00 |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Drive team is a job under pressure, in fact that's one of our team's requirements to be on drive team, you have to deal with pressure, we test this on thursday and friday (usually mostly thursday) same with human player, anyone can try, we will narrow it down at our facility, and then put you under pressure and see how it goes.
One thing about our team, is that this year, we started having committees and drive team was one of them. Suddenly, our mentor of the committee says that kids on build cannot be on drive. The mentor, who knows little about actually driving (he actually DID say this, and admits he just wants to be the person there when we drive) thinks that this is a most excellent idea. I personally, being the coach, got to do both, because i don't actually DRIVE the robot, and i get to split my time (even though they often are NOT during the same time) I disagreed with our adult, and explained my reasoning to him, yet he did not seem to understand my points and simply warded off my opinion. Now, 3/4 of our drive team knows next to nothing about the robot, although we are teaching them, and this scares me. Drive should know a LOT about their robot and how it works, how else can they make simple repairs without freaking out needing engineers? (not that there is anything wrong with needing engineers, but we don't have any onstage) Also, a bunch of the adults on our team puts pressure on the drive team to do well, and strategy and things like that. My drivers have some experience, but are constantly worried about pleasing everyone the entire time (i'm trying to stop that). We got to such a point between kids and adults telling us what to do (mostly the same thing, like when we did one thing wrong in a match, it was like EVERYONE needed to tell us 3xs) where we had to make everyone go through our drive team adult mentor so that all 30 people in the stands were not telling us the same thing. People often also put pressure indirectly on the drive team, making jokes that they take way to seriously (i'm trying to stop them from thinking too much, but they do) I try to explain to my team to come to ME when things go wrong, but sometimes they just don't listen. Pressure is mounted on drive team. The only thing many drivers need to know is to listen to the coach, they will tell them what they need to do. (btw--126, you guys have AWESOME strategy, you made us get as far as we did @ UTC, you guys ROCK) |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
as everyone as already established, a certain amount of pressure on the drive team is inevitable, but how the drivers deal with it is what separates the caliber of robot performances on the field. the most imprtant thing is to put as little pressure on yourself as possible and to have the complete support of an amazing team. no matter if our alliance wins or loses, there is ALWAYS room for improvement, and often times it is upto the drivers to figure out their mistakes and take action to correct them. after every match our drive team, coach, and other mentors who observed the match from the stands, watch the match on tape so we can all give constructive criticism to better our performance in the next match.
the robot and the drivers are only a small piece to any team's success. all the strategists, scouters, and the best coach in the world (in my opinion) come together to give us direction and hopefully sucess on the field. |
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Also, now that I think of it, there are good ways to select a solid drive crew for the field. As teams may or may not have figured out, it takes more than just drive skill to do well out on the field. You have to have a very stable mentality and almost a type of hungry agression in you to succeed. Back when I was with team 42, I used to run certain tests to train the drive team. Instead of basing our decision on one simple test, I told all the students that we would select drivers based on how they reacted in a series of tests over the weeks, that way the pressure was always on. These tests included game intelegence and strategy quizzes, drive accuracy, knowledge of controls, and of course my favorite...Perfection. Yes...that is Perfection, the old game with the odd shapes and the board that would pop up if you didn't get all the parts in time. I would have all the students on the team gather around a table. One student would sit at the perfection board as everyone around him/her cheered and yelled. As the time dwindled down, and the crowd got louder, you could really tell exactly how someone would react under pressure. I highly recommend this technique for teams who do driver training. Remember, its those closing seconds which can be the most key in a match. If you chose a driver who is liable to freeze up, it may be the difference between 1st place and 2nd place. Good Luck, Andy Grady |
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I agree with Ken, this has nothing to do with your driving abilities, BUT... We have a very small school (about 250 students) and consequently a very small team. By the time we get down to "crunch time" a week before ship day, there are about 10 people in the basement doing work. I dunno, maybe that's a lot, but that's really our core team. Everyone else either only comes every once in awhile or works on the Photoshop or Animation teams. A lot of people see driving as the "fun" part, the part where you get to see all your efforts come together. So we reserve the right for the seniors on the build team. It's maybe not the best solution, but as I said, we have a pretty small number of people to work with. And we feel it's fair that those who worked the hardest get to make it all work. We're pretty supportive of our drive team and we don't really take matches too seriously. I mean, we want to win, but I think we're one of the more laid-back teams. If we win we're completely ecstatic, but if we lose we don't worry about it too much. In the last of our matches at SBPLI our driver and operator made a really...I'll say "silly" mistake that pretty much cost us the match. We were all good-natured about it, and afterwards I greeted them with "what was THAT about?!" in a joking way. But once we saw that they were really upset about it, we stopped joking and made our (albeit feeble) attempts to cheer them up. And if we had a match after that, we would have given them some chocolate and sent them back out on the field with encouraging words. :) We wouldn't "kick them off" the drive team for one mistake, or even multiple mistakes. It's definitely not the best way to run things, but that's our philosophy and we're sticking to it! =) |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Excellent question.
Well i find the pressure over whelmining, but that is just not from my team that is from myself ripping me apart. Our team is split up into sub teams, such as drivetrain, arm, scouting,etc etc. While we are not competeing its the time for those teams to shine. Then you have the driveteam, To be one of the drivers on your team is a honor. When you are in a driving position it shows that you have been given the respect from the team and the backing of the team to go up and compete. NO matter how much work someone does it all comes down to you. For those two minutes you are the deciding factor on how the team reacts and how were you are placed. When you are in the driving role you are looked up to, not only by your own team but by every other team. I remeber when i was a freshman i looked up to our driver and always thought i want to be him someday. Last year i got my chance and i didnt think it would be a big deal, then i got up there. Its a totally different world up there, for those two minutes you are the MAN or WOMAN. When i get up there i put alot of pressure on myself i want to succeed for the team, for all the hardwork they have done. For the sponsors giving us all that money, i want to have a winning result and then just for myself i am a very competitive person and i like to win. When we have a good match i am over joyed and it seems like nothign can bother me. When we lose i tear myself apart, i replay the match in my head over and over to see what we did wrong and what we could of done different. when we win i feel like i have highlighted all the hardwork the team has done When we lose i feel like i have let down the team I guess all i am tryign to say is when i get up there i feel like i have a responsiblity to bring a win to the team cause they have put the trust of the robot and its performance to the driver, cause no matter how good yoru robot is it all come's down to the skill of the driver |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Well I can tell you that being on a drive team is probably the most demanding, but most rewarding of all the jobs that a team must do to run. While there is always the heavy hold on you from the team to do good and try to win all of your matches, i really dont feel nervous until we hit the finals. When we lose, i fix what i did wrong or what happened to the robot and when we win, the burden of winning is lifted slightly from my shoulders and i am relaxed. As Andy stated
The drive crew is the center of the team, they get the most glory when successful, but also get the most flack when something goes wrong. After coaching on a couple of different teams for a few years, I have learned to never insult or question any decisions the drive crew takes. Being up in the stands watching a match is completely different than being down on the field. Your vantage point is much different, the field is harder to see, and frankly its quite crowded back there...not easy to think straight. And I believe every single word he said is the truth. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
as for the driver and I, I dont think theres to too much pressure during the compition becuase we know if we do our job right we will accomplish what what need to accomplish. it helps having a robot you know will perform 100% every time you go out there.
As for bed time since we are from MA and we go to the FL regional we got down there 5 days before the regional to go to disney and have a good time. curfew was 11:30 those nights. Wendsday night i'd say we where in bed by 10-10:30ish for practice. Then Thursday curfew for the whole team was 9 so every one got to bed early. Then Friday nights curfew was 2am because we did well and won the Judges Award. Our mentor did not say ne thing to us he kinda figured that we would make the right choice and be in bed by a reasonable time. We where in bed by 11:30 witch was not bad. No need for 15hrs of sleep just 6 or 7 will do good. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
here's my 2c's
I feel that pressure is nessesary in a sense to give driver (like me) that this is a task not to take lightly. Just as any role of the team, you make the pieces of the puzzle work. It's what you do with your robot, Not how you use it. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
On our team, being a driver is more or less an earned position. We have tryouts (when the robot is capable) and that usually puts us in the right direction. I've been more than fortunate to have been a driver or operator for all four years now!
It's funny, but I feel absolutely no pressure when I go into the booth anymore. It's almost like riding a bike- the confidence that I've achieved is all because I'm familiar with the stance I'm in and the manuevers I'm going to make. I usually worry more about the robot working correctly, or a program put in the correct way for a given place. I usually do a little dance before each round- watch for me (the guy with long hair for 341) and you'll notice it. With our team, we have our coaches and whatnot in the booth as well, and they are always told to do the strategy, but it always ends up being the drivers who both do all the stategizing (play by play during the match) and when we mess up, we're the ones who face the consequences of guilt and worry about repetition of the same problem. So yeah- that's the story. I LOVE being an operator, I'll tell you that though! One more thing- all us drivers seem to agree it's a difficult task. Let's all try to realize that when either one of our robots doesn't perform well during a match, it's not what we intended! |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
In our case, we're trying to put as little pressure as possible on the drivers. We're writing out tactical scenarios pages long that the drivers must follow precisely. If the driver panics, the mentor will be right there to simply tell him to execute stage 3 for example.
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
I just want to state a few opinions.....as a driver and a programmer....
1. Driving seems to me...to be an innate ability. Everyone can do it....some better than others. Everyone should be able to do it, else the programming team is not doing their job. 2. A programmer should be a driver, for at least a few practice rounds, so he/she can make the robot easy to drive. If this is not possible, at least have the drivers interact with the programmer so he/she can make tweaks to the controls according to their wishes. 3. Drivers feel less pressure when they feel confident about their robot and about their control over the robot. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
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Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Here is my view on the whole who is on drive team thing:
Driving the robot is a reward. In all honesty, many of us put 6 weeks of our life into that robot. If you examined it, you would find traces of our sweat and blood (literally!) on the robot. Some of us even begin feeling attached to it.The way we chose our drive team is our most dedicated members who are able to attend all trips. Yes, everyone does some work, but more willing and interested members are quickly seperated from others. It is kind of like a reward for those who put in the most time and effort into it. Honestly, EVERYONE wants to drive the robot, so we try to be as fair about it as possible. Remember, winning is always a good feeling (and in this sense, you would make everyone try out to find the best drivers), but knowing that you put all of your free time and energy into a machine, and getting the chance to actually use it is better. One of the comments many mentors made to us was that we were lucky that we get to see our own finished product and use it. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
Its fun to see the finish product and
get the chance to drive it in competition Im just glad i beat all the rookies and got to drive again this year :D |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
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Sorry...but i absolutely disagree with you. Driving a Ford or GM race car is an actual sport, a physical activity that requires strength and fitness. Driving a robot requires that you can move your arms and fingers. Furthermore, if builders put the control of the robot into the hands of drivers who haven't even touched the thing, and if the drivers break it, resentment can build up much more easily. If a driver feels no real attachment to the robot, then they should not be driving. Drivers need to have some part in the actual construction of the robot. They need to be immersed in the inner workings of the robot. They need to know how to turn it on and off, how to select programs, how to tether...in some cases. And what does this have to do with chairman's award? |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
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Also, what I think Ken was saying is that by excluding people who haven't worked on the robot from even trying out for the drive team, you're not showing gracious professionalism. That could be what he was trying to say about the chairman's award. In order to win, it seems like your team needs to embody the idea of gracious professionalism. I think that everybody deserves a chance. Just because someone didn't build the robot doesn't mean that they don't have an attachment to it. Also, if you're worried about someone breaking something on the robot, use an old or practice robot for tryouts. I believe that teams need to have a sense of unity, and by restricting a drive team to only those who build the robot divides the team. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
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if you got people on a team going out and saying "we are the smartest ones on the team" or worse yet, that there are things about your team you are not free to talk about in public, that you can only mention in person... these are clear indications that there is stress and conflict on the team - team members are talking about each other behind their backs. there is no 'me' in team, unless you spell it backwards and leave out half the members. |
Re: Pressure on Drive Team
good point...even though im the regular driver, others have driven in competition. one was as relaxed as could be, while the other was having a nervous fit. i just know my position though. and from my exp, drivers just dont need much pressure to get the job done. it's in the contract they signed (without knowing it) upon accepting the job.
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