Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

I would like to see something with multiple shaped balls and objects (like the bowling pins, footballs, tennis balls, and roadcones.) Each one has different point values and certain ones have to be done by the robot and certain ones by the human player... It would all be on a revolving field. The drivers stations stay in the same spot but the field revolves. Maybe it makes 4 rotations and the balls possibly would be color coded or something and there are different goals etc... It would make the game intresting I think.. how about a huge road cone that you have to cap the goals with and you have to capture it from your opponent. I read some of the posts and really liked them so incorparated them into mine. Any of these ideas sound really cool.

Nate

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

I would love to see various terrains (maybe a pit of packing pop-peanuts or something like that)... that would emulate real terrain much better. :)

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

corn cernals

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

Every year there has been some kind of fixed area that teams could score points at the emd of the match by being on, above, near, etc. I like this idea. What I do not like about this is that the place that gives the points is the same all the time. Last year with the ramp, this year with the bar. Teams could then just go sit on the bar for the whole match and get an auotmatic 50 points. What If there were a few "Bonus" areas on the field, and the Computer would randomly select a spot that robots had to be in at the end of the match for the bonus points. But, the spot would be selected and shown on the big screen DURING The macth. I think that would be a good way to show how things that you design (mars rover, anyone?) may have to overcome different tasks, but may have to do them on the fly without that much time to prepare for it.

Thats my 2 cents

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

I agree with the ideas:
1. multiple level playing field
2. 2 vs 2 robots
3. scoring zones
4. multiple shaped objects varying in size (ie. soft balls and 30" balls )

I would add an element of the game that would be a lever type assembly that has a bucket attached to it so that when enough small objects were in it it would lift a barrier that covers a larger goal for the larger size objects. The bucket could be removable thus introducing a defensive side to the game. It would also add another task of picking the bucket up and placing it back on the lever arm.

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

for the scoring objects, i would suggest using cylinders.

i also have a unique idea for scoring. instead of assigning each scoring object (hopefully cylinder) a certain point value, why not make the score the square of the number? 1 cylider would get 1 point, 2 would get 4, 3 would get 9, 9 would get 81, etc. this would make the games a whole lot more exciting and hectic :yikes:

for the way objects are scored, i think the best way is to have a scoring zone on the field which is slightly lowered from the rest of the field

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

I thought this was where they were going when they introduced the EDUBOT( now Robovation ). I pictured a raised platform in the middle of the field Around the rest of the field would be balls, pucks, doughnuts, whatever. Points would be awarded for teams getting these objects onto the raised platform. For bonus points, they could deliver a mini-bot to the platform that moves the pieces into a receptical for double point value. For added fun these smaller robots would be autonomous! Maybe for more human involvement the platform would be enclosed and the way to get the elements to the mini-bots is through openings the human players shoot at.

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

New and different alliance station.

Modification to the kit...include a camera + transmitter.

Four sided, enclosed alliance station in the center of the field...entirely opaque. Ie, the driving squads for all four teams cannot see the playing field.

Each team station is on one side of the alliance station. Each team station has a television receiver which talks to its robot. (note: different frequencies would have to be assigned to the robot camera).

Teams have to drive their robots based on a robot's eye view of events.

The human player (if any) would not necessarily need to be inside the alliance station.

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

Playing field artifact...

Have balls which appear the same (same diameter, surface texture, color) but which have different mass (type 1 has 2x mass of type 2).

Type 1 balls which are placed in scoring container 1 count +2 points.
Type 1 balls which are placed in scoring container 2 count -1 points.

Type 2 balls which are placed in scoring container 2 count +2 points.
Type 2 balls which are placed in scoring container 1 count -1 points.

Robots can score balls or human players can score balls. In either event, the robot or human must differentiate ball type by weight.

Extra bonus...
If the scoring container can direct balls into a positive or negative hopper based on weight (like a change machine), then a real-time score could be maintained.

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

One thing that I would try to do is make it easier on the teams competing in the finals. This year requiring them to specify what order the alliances would go out, or last year what side they would start from, was stressfull and made it unmanagable as far as getting a good strategy together. Our team wasn't really prepared for the rapid fire matches. You really need a seasoned team management effort in place to handle final matches. At that point your already dealing with any quick repairs, battery changeouts, quick strategy sessions, opponent evaluations etc. For your typical team, this is overwhelming. Especially after already having dealt with 2 1/2 days of straight competition.
So basically when it comes to making rules for the finals, I'd ask that you go easy on us. I like the time out thing, maybe add a couple short ones. It would be nice to maximize in-between final match times as much as possible. I know it cuts into the days schedule. Which is why I think considering how many more teams there are now, you really need to figure out how to fit more matches in per day. This would buy more time for the finals, and help to fit more teams into all of the regionals.
Which means a simplified field setup, scoring and quicker seeding match turnarounds (announcements). If you shaved 30 seconds off every match you buy an hour extra for finals.
Also I suggest you make printouts of the seeding results available to everyone towards the end of seeding on Saturday. This would help us in the alliance selection process. It gets hectic at that point, and that would be a nice little tool to help us all a little better. Some teams don't have the resources to organize a very concerted scouting effort.

Thanks!

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

How does this sound:

The field dimensions would be similar to this year's. There is are two bars running the entire width of the field that are 20" off the ground. These bars are located on opposite sides of the field 6 feet from the centerline of the field.
At the field centerline is a single bar raised 8' off the ground, similar to this past years, but not on a platform.
You get points for hanging from the 8' high bar, but to get there, your robot would have to be able to fit under or go over the 20" bar. Quite a challenge. Maybe some really smart team can figure out a way to hang from the other side of the 20" bar, who knows?

Perhaps the scoring objects are larger than 20", so you have to do something funny to get them to the other side of the field.

A simple robot that is less than 20" tall can get to the opponets side of the field and play some defense, or can stay on their own side and score some points.

One more idea:
If you want to use scoring balls, put four scoring towers similar to the stationary goals this year. The towers are only wide enough so that balls stack in them - 30" wide goal for a 24" diameter ball. Your team only gets points if your's is the ball on top. A stack of 5 red balls each worth 5 points gets capped by a blue ball - all those balls in that goal become blue property - 30 points. Last second, red throws one in - changes back - 35 points red

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

A platform on casters to play king of the hill on: it would be crazy to have shoving matches on a platform that is being pushed all over the field.

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

Few ideas....

- Moveable platform that robots can get onto - because it would be interesting

- Temporary line of sight disruptions for the drive team, but with human players able to see what is going on. Teams would need to set up a "non-verbal" communication system to see what was going on.

- Field elements that need to be activated by robots. Examples... Pull on a ring, push a button, etc...

- Hula hoops or other such ring type of thing. Maybe collect them, maybe put them on a hook that can be raised or lowered by your partner. (I really like that idea now that I think about it....)

Ideas
 

I'd like to see obstacles/barriers strategically placed on the field that cause a robot to become disabled for a period of time if they cross/touch them. The most attractive scoring zones could be guarded/blockaded by these to make it more challenging to get to those scoring zones.
Perhaps the alliance partner of the disabled robot could shorten the duration of the disable by doing some task that re-enables their teammate.

I would also like to see a contest that requires the robots to shoot projectiles at targets and/or at their opponents for points. I know safety is a concern but maybe you could get Nerf to sponsor a contest and use foam projectiles.
You could even force teams to put goals or receptacles of some type on their robots. If my opponent's projectile ends up in my robot's goal, then I am penalized with a points deduction. If my alliance partner's projectile ends up in my robot's goal, then there is a bonus/multiplier.

Re: [Official 2005 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks
 

This seems like the best place for this suggestion...

Release the robot building rules in the pre-season and set up the Q&A system for feedback.

This will allow the FIRST community to flag all of the picky little inconsistencies in the rules before we get to build phase.

It will let us look up suppliers, et al. and get an idea of what parts are legal.

Since most veteran teams right now have big stock racks of FIRST parts, this change would help the newer teams.

Rather than placing restrictions (e.g. you can only buy this from supplier x), set up a Q&A specifically for legal parts. Only those parts are legal.

So, if a team asks, "Is the BEI yaw rate sensor legal," FIRST isn't bound by the "only available from digikey" rule. It can say yes or no and that becomes gospel.

This also allows teams to browse the Q&A and determine what parts are legal. So, if you didn't know what a "fizzbuster" is or where to get one or whether you could use it, you could browse the Q&A as the competition progresses and get the benefits of other teams' experiences.