Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

please keep unrelated topics out of this thread...thanks

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

ok well the people from FIRST finally got back to the Q and A question we posted about having 50RPM on the Taigene Van Door Motor and the answer was.....

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

But then the question was deleted off the system.. I don't get it.. :sigh:

Oh well, at least we got an answer.

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

Here's our model number. 50 rpm both directions @12.4v.

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

We all know that last year's van doors are basically the same, and have normal unscrewy rpms, the ones that everyone expected. My question is, are they legal to use on this years bot? And.. what if they are supposed to be the same part number? The motors would be identical then.

As for all the motor variaties... FIRST maybe wanted it to be that way. To give us a bunch of different motors. But... that doesnt sound very fair, does it? I might be going a bit to far.. but I think FIRST should replace all the wierd motors that we have with the normal ones like last years, at no expense to teams. I personally don't mind too much because we aren't screwed by this. We can still redesign and make out mechanisms... but what about teams that have made everything and can't make new parts? But hey.. just my opinion.

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

So far, in the absence of a ruling to the contrary, if an old-style Tiagene van door motor were shipped to any team this year, I'd tend to consider that motor fair game for all.

It's quite safe to assume that they don't want to do this. Like the F-Ps, they seem to have accidentally obtained a mixed lot, without correct specifications.

A point for the team forums, when they arrive, later in the year: let's make sure that any kit motor or significant component is accompanied by a model number and corresponding specification document, and that these are checked in advance for accuracy.

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

Has anyone found a resolution to this problem yet? I posted this just now:
Since it seems like all the other questions asked by other teams on this issue were deleted, I figured I would try again.

As the question states, we are seeing the same thing mentioned in this thread. Our van door motor has a different serial number than the specification document on the FIRST 2005 motor spec:
http://www2.usfirst.org/2005comp/Specs/Taigene_PSD.pdf

We have checked all of our wiring, and even run straight from 12.8V, and the motor will only spin a maximum of 52RPM!!! We had planned and designed around the specification of 76RPM, but now our lift is way too slow!!

We got frustrated and went to try last year's motor (bought from the FIRST garage sale). When we plugged that motor in it sparked like crazy. So we opened it up. The motor we bought had a cracked magnet!! So we went to switch the casing with the new motor so we could test the old motor, and decided to open them up. What we found disturbed us:
http://www.penfieldrobotics.com/test/doormotors.jpg
The one on the right is this years motor, the one on the left is last year's motor. While it is possible they made a drastic change in the gearing as seen to account for the motor, the gearing in the boxes seems to match our 52rpm/76rpm issue. And it just seems funny that the motor was labeled "bad" when we got it.

Does anyone know if last year's motor is legal?? It would seem so since that is what the specification document references.

HELP!!

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

We tested our motor speeds and got 80 rpm's for both this years and last years motors.
As to using last years, how could they tell if you do? They look the exact same. ;)

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

well first of all gracious professionalism will tell you not to do that but there are also differences in the appearance of last years motor vs this years

last year had a completely round casing around the motor windings , and output shaft with a flat then a space and then treads, as well as a waffle pattern on the back of the gear casing


this year has a more square casing, a different flat/thread pattern on the shaft, a flat back on the gear case, and a different hole pattern

any inspector with any experience should be able to tell the difference almost instantaneously

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

I do not have the part number for our Vandoor motor, but a quick time based off a charged battery gave ~80 RPM in one direction, about 5-10 rpm slower in the other. This was a really quick and dirty count over 15 seconds, so take it with a grain of salt. Still, it sounds like we have a 'fast' motor.

-Andy A.

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

Yes, but last year's motor is the serial number that FIRST Spec'd in their own documentation (and the KOP checklist does NOT give a serial number) so it would seem as if last year's motor is legal to use. Question is, did any of the teams actually get the S/N 16638628 Motor??

Additionally if <R20> is read, the part "[Last year's motors] may be used as direct one-to-one SPARE PARTS for those provided if the provided part fails or is damaged." I would say the 52RPM is a failed part (hence the "bad" sticker, perhaps?!?!). It does continue to say though "They may only be used if they are identical to the part being replaced," and continues to suggest that only the Fischer price motors fall in this category.

From what I have been told of this van door motor, it was intended to be a factory replacement for last year's motor. However, it does not perform that way. My gut feeling is that if other teams have a motor from the kit that spins almost 80RPM we are at a huge disadvantage sitting with a motor that only spins 52RPM.

I hope to hear from FIRST, other than that we can swap at competition. If we have to swap at competition, we run the risk of throwing portions of our automode off, due to the inablity to test them, and we have to go custom machine our shaft again.

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

I wish I had seen this sooner. We, too, have a Taigene 16644829 (although it's a Rev01) van door motor. We haven't tested it for speed, but am I to assume that this is a 50-52RPM motor instead of the specified 74RPM? And that's at 12.4V? Does anyone have any specs on this particular motor? We're trying to use it in conjunction with a Nippon Denso Window Motor to lift our arm, so it's important that we know how to match them for speed and torque. But then, if we lose this motor, what will we have to replace it with? A 50RPM or 74RPM? Thanks.

Re: Van Door Motor Problem
 

yea.. has this been asked to FIRST Q&A ?

i think this might make things very unfair/biased as some teams will have diffent motor specs././ and the purpose this year was that all teams have exact same motors, and none that are not supplied in KoP.. . . so.. . yea.. idk our speed now that our motors is shiped off.. but i am currently trying to find a second one for our second robot (practice) and its being a really big beyotch.. . if u have any info where email me short1@gmail.com