A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

At this past weekends UTC regional, there was an incident with a Tetra falling out of the field and onto a human player ending up with the human player taking a trip to the hospital..

This is a warning to all human players, especially those on the pressure pad closest to the field to watch out for falling tetra's from the corner goal nearest to you and your alliance stations wall.

What happened was, a robot was trying to stack a tetra on the goal nearest to the pressure pads side of the field on the blue side.

A human player from the blue alliance ran to give their robot safely in their human player loading zone a tetra.

While she was doing this, the opposing team's robot was attempting to remedy a misaligned tetra they stacked on the corner goal (It was hanging off in that weird way when they are tilted on the tetra goal but still on the goal yet not scored.)

The human player went to run back to the pressure pad after safely giving their robot a tetra, and the misaligned tetra fell off the tetra goal, because the robot was attempting to grab the tetra and re-stack it, and hit the HP in the shoulder and leg (I believe.) resulting in a hospital trip.

I have video, but I don't want to show it unless I OK it from the team who this happened to first.

The Human player was back in the arena later that day and she actually wanted to see the video of the accident (something I wouldn't do that soon after the incident, so I'll give her credit for that!)

So, to all Human Players, be a fast human player to play competitively, but also be aware of your surroundings at all times!!!!

I'm really not sure if this could have been prevented in this case because it happened so fast, but as I said, Be careful, and be aware of your surroundings at all times.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

I would also like to warn the human players to be aware of each other on the trip to and from the pressure pad. I know that there is a lot of action and you are trying to get back and forth as fast as possible, but I did see 1 human player at the St. Louis regional get hit in the side of the head by the tetra another human player was holding, 1 running back to the pad and the other running to the loading zone. Fortunately he got right back up and seemed more suprised than hurt.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Another big risk is other alliance robots at the other loading stations, we had a bunch of very close calls at GLR.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Another risk, when using two human loader stations, is that the
human player returning from one station might be struck by an
arm from a robot that is coming into the other human player
station. We had a near miss at Sacramento, where the
a second robot (ours) was turning at a high speed near the loading
station in order to line up for it. The swinging arm exceeded the
field boundary and missed a returning human player's head by just a foot.

The referees should probably be calling safety penalties for
robots that swing their arms outside of the field bounderies.
In the near miss that I saw, a 20 pound aluminum arm would have
struck a players head as if were a sledge hammer. Scary!

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Ouch, sounds like it hurt. What exactly happened to her? Did she break anything or get cut or what?

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

This happened in Pittsburgh also during finals rounds. A tetra was being dangled over the driver station - and it capped a drive team member. He caught it as it was being dropped on his head and avoided injury. I think the robot was pushed and the tetra ended up over the wall, but I can't remember the details exactly.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

In Florida when tytus was in the driving station a tetra came over top and hit him in the head

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Thanks for the heads up Elgin. I never even thought a thing like that could happen...but now I know! :)

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

She was 228's HP, but luckily we had a back-up. Nothing was broken, but it was a really bad bruise and a charlie-horse cramp at the same time; and she had to be carried off the field. Just to be on the safe side, they took her to the hospital. She was back in a few hours, on the sidelines cheering us on for the elimination rounds. I saw her in school today, and she'll be on crutches for a few more days. But from what our team captain said, who's also her older brother, you can see the V-shape in the bruise on her leg from the corner of the tetra. But she's in good spirits, and will be fine soon enough. Elgin, I'd like to see the video of that, maybe you can possibly PM me the link to it? I'll talk to her tomorrow to see if she would mind the video being made public.

Also, our team was talking about this, and FIRST really should extend the Lexan wall that protects the drivers to the entire width of the field, and possibly wrap around the corner a few feet, to safe guard the human players from tetras that come off the corner goals. Otherwise, move the pressure pads back a few feet away from the field. To all other human players, just keep your eyes open, and remember that your safety is more important than staying on the pressure pad.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

WEll the fields are brand new this year, from my understand from what Bob Hammond told me ( FIRST director at UCF regional) that the fields are made by a third party and to change the fields would require money and time. So nothing can be done this year but maybe in the future. Just everyone has to pay attention and stay safe. KNowing from standing on the side of the field were the auto loaders were, we almost got hit a few times. so even volunteers and refs and people on the field please always keep your eyes on the field at all times

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

At GLR, the head ref said any robot whoe's arm/tetra crossed the plane of the drivers station plexi window would be disabled for saftey reasons becuase they could fall and hurt a driver.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

I also happened to see the girl get hit. They stopped the match with about 1 sec left and they redid the match. Its good to hear that shes ok. personally i wear a helmet when i was human player. although nothing hit me i think it is a precaution more teams should make after seeing this incident. hopefully i wont be the only human player at nationals who is wearing a helmet like i was at the regional.

-Crash

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

I just wonder what happens in the case where they disable the robot, and it drops the tetra anyways, because that's the way it was designed. Could cause more harm than if left alone to correct itself. I think that was commented on elsewhere.... Guess they take a chance either way on the safety bit... If I remember right, the arm came over the wall because they got pushed by another robot (but not sure, but I don't believe they were disabled). Unfortunate if someone should get disabled in this case when they didn't initiate going over the wall. With such a vertical game, guess those walls shoulda been much higher. Let's hope everyone stays awake and there aren't any serious injuries this season... Dig up some hardhats everyone....

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

yeah i was retrieving one tetra off the autoloader at ucf and it got caught underneath the bar of the loader and i almost pulled the loader into play with the tetra luckily the feild attendant was carefull and stepped back and kept it from coming in the field

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Well...... That probably wouldn't help considering how the robots are designed this year (very tall). I know the same thing happened at the regional I went to. A tetra came very close to hitting the drivers despite the lexan wall. Fortunately, a field attendant just casually grabed the tetra as it was about to fall.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Well, I do have to say this about my sister. In her mind her main objective was to get back on the pad and she did it so good, though hurt, that me nor the drivers didn't realized something was wrong until the head ref jumped into the middle of the field looking her way and ran back out to hit the main stop. That's when I looked over to see her sitting on the pad with two refs next to her that's when I ran over to her. So now she's doing just fine and will be on crutches for a few days but other than that she's just fine.

P.S. Elgin she said you can show the world the video.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Okey Dokey.

http://www.team237.com/videos/hpsafety.wmv

And thanks to Tom & the crew over at Team 195 for the mirror:

http://www.team195.com/video/UTC_hp_safety.wmv


Just a reminder. Be aware of your surroundings HP's.


Glad to hear that she is ok. :)

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Owww.

Hope she's doing better.

So has anyone found out what happens when disabling a robot makes it drop tetras on people?

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

I think we should start one of those reality shows like Real TV where we show all the human player accidents, we could also turn it into some kind of safety promo.... "When Good Tetras Go Bad" or something... I'm a human player for my team, and on the final day of the manchester regionals I got so caught up in the moment and the pressure to get back to the pad ASAP, that I started to trip and fall down (luckily, by some freakish chance I got my balance)... It's sooo scary, but I'm glad that girl that got "attacked" by the tetra is ok..

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Thanks for the heads up Elgin. I'll be sure to pass this on to our human player. Hopefully nothing like this happens again.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

I'm just thinking, if during a match a driver or human player gets hit hard with a tetra (or anything else, for that matter), shouldn't there be some provision to allow them to leave their respective area immediately? Currently, you'd be facing some serious penalties if you left your zone.

Here's how I'd write it...

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Thank you for the INFO, and remember Safety is always FIRST!!!

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

this game is so unsafe for the anyone around the field

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

That is actually what happened. There was about 20 seconds left in the match, and they replayed the match.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Maybe the plexiglass should extend above the drivers station to create a ceiling above them. That way if a tetra is dropped it just lands on the plexi, not a person.

-Kristin

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Actually by the time the head ref was able to get the attention of the computer guys controlling the time there was about two seconds. The side ref watching the human players noticed her down at about 20 to 15 seconds left. It took them a bit to realize she was hurt, tell the head ref and have him stop the match. They even finished the first match but didnt bother scoring because of the accident. I think the descision to restart the match regardless of how much time was left was a good call. There was a lot to distract the blue alliance and what if team Gus wanted to get some more tetras from the human player without realizing she was hurt until they looked over. Or they were going to try and make a defensive play and all of a sudden couldnt move because she was off the pad. It was scary and everyone clapped for her which i thought was very respectful.

-Crash

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

At Pitts. a tetra actually went over the alliance station wall. Luckily, a team coach caught it, but it would've been safer if the walls were a little higher this year.

Caution: Hard Hat Zone!
 

At the scrimmage before the Peachtree Regional, we saw a robot launch a vision tetra over the top of the center goal. Cleared it by several feet before crashing to the floor. The robot had the tetra on a long arm and did a quick rotation. Made me think just how dangerous this year's challenge is. Those tetras are 8 - 10 pounds each.

I hate to say it, but I think the playing field needs to be a hard-hat area. I know no one wants to see this as a requirement, but too many people are too close to the action and there is too much action going on to watch it all. A tetra can easily come from out of the field of view with really bad results.

Bike helmets might be enough, though no one can accept the liability for an injury with one on since they aren't designed for this application. A construction hard hat would be better, though they won't stay on the heads of fast-running human players. They would work fine for drivers, referees, etc.

How about it FIRST? How quickly can you make helmets a requirement, before somebody really gets beaned?

Re: Caution: Hard Hat Zone!
 

I fully support the helmets being a requirement. Injuries can come out of no where. I know this is only a robotics competition but the injury doesnt care where or what you are doing. Sometimes and injury can change people's lives. If you some how tear your achillies tendon you won't be able to walk again. Think about that human players. I wrote a long thing about helmets and the site screwed up and I don't feel like typing it over. Bascially I said that the drivers and operators should wear hard hats and so should the human players if something better isnt available. I recommend for human players to wear full cage helmets whether it be a football helmet or lacrosse helmet. After I saw the human player from Gus get hurt and realizing that I was the only human player at UTC with a helmet I feel that it should be required. I'm not saying that the human players should wear full armor, but to definately be aware of their surroundings and be ready for anything. I don't want to be the only one wearing a helmet at nationals. If I have to I will go around to every team and ask if their human player wears a helmet. Being injured sucks as anyone who plays sports can tell you. I don't want to see anymore injuries especially at nationals. If you happen to get hurt, I will personally try to see if you are ok and do anything to help. Please take the necessary precautions and make sure your drive team is safe when they are up on stage.

-Crash

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

Another, much scarier, scenario than falling tetras is falling robots. The trend this year is for robots that are very tall, and I have seen some that have fallen over. One that stands out particuarily vividly in my mind is when a scissor-jack robot, fully extended to at least 12 feet, toppled over in the center of the field. If it had fallen the other way, it could have fallen out of bounds and hit one of the loaders with considerable force on the head or shulders before hitting the knee-high fence. This is extremely dangerous. In the future (although I hope that the future games are designed better) there should be a complete wall around the field, or even the bubble dome idea.

Re: A Warning to Human Players for safety's sake.
 

We had an incident at the Boilermaker during the finals match. It was the second round with the 1st and 8th place alliance. We were 8th.
Team 71, while trying to cap one of OUR corner goals, ended up overshooting the goal and having the tetra end up behind the lexan. The tetra swung sideways and hit our driver in the side of the head. No penalty was called :(
We have it on video and you can see the ref put up his hands as if to ward off the tetra.
It's harder for the driver to watch what is going on around him/her because they are driving the bot.

Wayne Doenges
Lemmings non sumus