pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

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i understand the part about the water but what is that banana doing there :p

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You gotta be kidding me... it's been only 2 days since the 2006 game clue has been posted and now 2007 game clue with a picture? I am assuming that Dave loves this time of the year when he gets to mess around with our head.

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I figured that we may as well get this out of the way now. Everyone has been clamoring for so long for a water-based game (I am still trying for the jello-based game, but that is another discussion for another time...), that we had to just give in and give the teams what they were demanding. However, everyone involved with the game design process realized that the infrastructure modifications that would be needed were fairly substantial, and probably not the sort of thing that could be done on short notice. Therefore, we have modified our system to release this hint a full year in advance so that both teams and competition facilities can begin to consider how to contend with this twist on the game concept. So now you have something to do other than burning out all those brain cells trying to decipher the 2006 Official Game Hint!

-dave

p.s. you will find out what the banana is for in April.

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

Can we get a date on that, Dave? We could probably get Brandon to put it on the countdowns. :)

By the way, why does the short blue robot always get picked on? It got a 2X ball to the head in FIRST Frenzy's animation (not to mention the jumping up and down trying to hang), whacked in the head by a big hand as it tried to climb the ramp in Stack Attack, was jerked around by its human player in Triple Play (and was the only one lacking an arm), and now this!

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

You did not just go there, Dave.
You know how these kids are about thier liquid obsession.
Now were gonna have to hear about it for a whole year! :rolleyes:

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

One fish
Two fish
Red fish
Blue fish

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Wo wo, is this serious, or is dave screwin with us again. Is next years game reallllly gonna be underwater!?

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

Well, duh, I mean when was the last time Dave had fun screwing with our heads?

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Hahaha, good call.

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Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

I foresee a lot of water destroyed robots. Maybe it's just my pessimistic self talking, but I just have a hunch.

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

Dave wouldn't need to create an actual water field to get that effect he's looking for.

Having flexible refective surfaces, similar to fun house mirrors, intergrated into the field and/or field objects would give the same effect of the distorted lines from the light waves underwater.

We know he likes to screw with our heads and doing the reflective surface idea I mentioned above would be a great way to screw with the robots during the autonomuos period, especially the CMU cam, and make the game more interesting. I wouldn't put it out of his league on doing it sometime in the future also.

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My [fervent hope] guess is that it will be April Fools.

--Petey

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I'm impressed and incredibly amused that you found so many of Dave's evildoings, though granted, they aren't that hard to search out.

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I wouldn't be surprised if this is an intro for a game animation where it look like a water game, but then the water drains off and the real game is revealed. I really do not think fish will be in the same arena as our robots.

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Along the same vein, what is Dave's recent obsession with Clown Fish about? And what did he do with its eye? Hmmm... very disturbing.

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I think the banana's just there for a joke. Remember how Dave's game animations always have a splash screen at the end about "Havabanana Productions" (or something to that effect)?

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am I the only one who originally thought that was a pipe fish, not a banana?

and that's either on REALLY messed up clown fish, or it's an angler

EDIT: why do we have to wait until Nat's to find out what the banana's for?

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April 1st, right?

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

Bananas are traditionally part of a gag by having someone/something slipping on them.

Maybe instead of water, it will be ice in 2007, agreeing with the whole curling game post a while back.

Either that, or Las Guerrillas is the next target to ask some hard hittin' questions to.

edit:Wow. How well do objects reflect in MAX? Is that 4 color ball shapes I see reflected in the upper left hand corner area of the robot's back?

Namely, blue, red, green, yellow?

I'm guessing this is just a joke about a water game from the great Dave, but based on the field from the 2006 game.

Do I see the return of 4 colored game objects, namely spherical shapes??

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Why would he say we would find out in April (implying this year) when it is a 2007 game hint. I think there is more to this picture :rolleyes:

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i dont think that it is a clownfish, due to the rather large pointy looking fin on the top of its head.

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Wow, great observation! I really do think that thats a legitamate reflection! You could definently get a reflection like that in MAX. Hmmm, maybe, maybe...

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First off all, you set how reflective objects are in MAX. Second, Dave doesn't use 3DS Max, he uses Lightwave. :D Thirdly, it might be my monitor but I don't see no reflection. Although I do have theories about that line.

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Only one problem - this little tidbit <edit> Ian beat me to it </edit>

-dave

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

On the subject of the tidbit, can anyone shed some insight on how the game shifts around in the design phase and winds up becoming the stuff we play just a few months later?

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If you look carefully in the middle of the robot's topside, there appears to be four hula hoops. Maybe just reflection. However, it also follows the red, green, blue, yellow, color scheme. Seems pretty telling... Or it might just be Dave beimg clever again.:rolleyes:

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

I see three blue, red, green

I attached a small portion I photoshoped and played with the contrast a little to see the colors

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If you zoom in closely on the rest of the top of the robot, you can faintly see the red and blue orbs on the second ripple down also, although much smaller.

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I thought of something (my apologies to Gwen Stefani) in that he could be just trying to tell us that a water game is bananas,
B-A-N-A-N-A-S. Let me here you say a water game is bananas, B-A-N-A-N-A-S. The water game is bananas, B-A-N-A-N-A-S. :p

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

Exactly what I was talking about. Thanks. You can see Yellow and possibly Orange as well. And guess what? That's 5 colors.

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I was thinking along the same lines, but took it a bit deeper.

Gwen was the lead singer of No Doubt for a while.

Maybe Dave is trying to say that there is no doubt that there will be water in 2007 :ahh:

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Looks like someone has attended a MATE ROV competition. But an underwater competition could add another element. The ability for a robot to move in any axis (x,y,z)!

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I was looking at this picture and those colored dots on the back of the robot, if you zoom in on them a few times and they kind of look like people. the red dot is the body/shirt, the light colored circle is the head which looks like it has to black dots as eyes. Awhile back there was that picture of the curling robots on a FIRST Field (I think Dave posted it but I can seem to find where it is to be sure) anyway I have it on my computer, and I looked at the top edge of the picture and you can see the first row of the audience and the reflection people on the robots back look just like the audience in the curling picture.

Maybe I've been reading the 2006 Hint Discussion thread to long and its making me see things.... :ahh:

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It was actually an external link that has since been broken.

If it's not somewhere else in the galleries, I will upload it there later.

edit: I couldn't find it in CD-Media, so I uploaded it.

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/pi...le&picid=12245

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Maybe our robots will have to be run by water? I have no clue its a long strech but i mean would they really be that mean to make us make our robots water resistant/ cause i can see a lot of robots failing at first attempt.

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And this year's animation hit it with way more then 2 balls...

I kind of feel sorry for the little bot...

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maybe the robot is looking though glass. Like looking at a fish tank for something. That is why the picture is distorted.
:confused:
shaun

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this is a good idea. im thinking the banana has to do with us having to maybe "climb" on top of something pick it up and bring it across a line before being tagged? kinda like capture the flag? cause the water distorts the picture and the blue line going down the center with the fish on the other side maybe symbolizing the other team? and why does the robot look sad? this can mean so many different things. gosh dave why do u make this so hard

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I honestly don't understand why people try so hard to see something that isn't there. Any sane person knows there will be no water game.

Water=Bad for Bots!

I guess it could be fun though, at least for Dave.

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Seems like a Salinger reference to me..."A Perfect Day for Bananafish".

A Bananafish being a fish that goes into a banana hole, then stuffs itself with bananas, thus becoming too engorged to escape the hole.

Crazy guy...

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

Well, I don't think many people were expecting projectiles this year either. Who knows what the GDC will come up with next? Time travel?

Re: pic: 2007 Game Hint?
 

well maybe the robot is considered as part of a name because it's trying to be like the fish but there is a banana on it so maybe "banana fish"?
well i know banana fish is a magazine from japan but it's also a brand of crib bedding so maybe in the 2007 game there will be no ramp onto a platform but the robot will have to get onto the platform all by itself

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I think the four colors being reflected on the robot may indicate we will have not just blue and red alliances but green and maybe yellow too. That would be a lot of robots on the field. One thing that keeps popping up in my head is the little plow bot is always used as an example of building strong or limitations of designs...so this may be not something that will happen to all robots. The blue line looks like it is part of the blue starting box. Not quite sure why he felt like putting fish in. I also think having projectiles this year made the game more exciting, I don't think they will get rid of the projectiles idea...just tweak it.

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I see fish..O__O .. underwater game?? that would be COOL!! I'd be really happy if this is true!! :D

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Fishing happens in the water, fly fishing is another type of fishing.

Maybe there's going to be more projectiles?

I don't know. Everyone will know how to solve the problem if we had to shoot balls again.

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I have a headache in just thinking about the possibilities of a water game. I guess IFI will be extremely busy trying to make something that relys heavily on electricity into something thats water proof. Talk about a few fried Spikes and Speed Controllers =). As for the Banana on what I like to call baby bot that banana symbolizes that if you can figure out the 2007 game before this years through you can have a banana. =p. Chances are the blue box baby bot is in symbolizes a starting grid, scoring location, soring object load up location <----like in 2005 Where the human players would have to wait for the robot to be completely in its box in order for the human player to get off the mat and safely load the tetra(s) onto their bots. However I could be wrong, I don't think anyone can see what goes on in Daves large mind (not even the therapists he goes to after making our heads hurt from his crazy yet extremely funny hints).


By the way I think that baby bot should have some sick time for himself, Hes been hit and everything else and yet hes the only one getting this torture, stop picking on the small people =):]

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no, not underwater but underwater themed.
you can clearly see the traditional carpet texture here, and from the reflection on the back of the bot, you can see that there is some fishy design going around, adding to the theme.
Also there, is a row of colored circles on a mount. I see this as the third coming of CMU, where the bot has to identify from like 6 or however many) different colored lights. (combining the colorful use of the technology in Triple Play -- green vision tetras, and red and yellow reflective triangles under the goals and at autoloaders and the like with the practical light-up technology in Aim High)

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Its May 2nd...i want to know what the banana is for...Please

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haha, i just noticed that and was going to post about it.

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ahhh ; now that Nats are over i can actually think about this picture!

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Our team has been discussing the water game for a while and all I kept thinking of is that there is probably just a water obstacle in the center of the feild (like a river...) which is why the robot is surrounded from its opponents. There must be some kind of dry lanfd, otherwise you cant get your robots on and off the field. So, again, I think there is going to be a river of water dividing the field in two and I also agree that it may be something like capture the flag (apart from the tagging). I think you will have to go to the other side if you really want to score lots of points. Also, thats gonna be a LOT of water to pump into the georgia dome next year...

Regarding the colors, I'm guessing it's three (blue, red, and green) like the hint we were given at nationals about the vision sensing next year.

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Just to make sure that I don't slip up and give away too much, are you a-peeling for one clue or a bunch?

-dave

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Teflon field surface!

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Does the blue line represent a barrier of some sort? The robot is on one side facing the fish on the other side.

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the blue line looks like the starting position box for the blue alliance.

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Carpet / Water Area/ Carpet

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We'll settle for as many of the proverbial good clues as possible. ;)

(Dave, you really know how to drive us all bananas.)

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Remember that whole thing at Nationals about changing light colors? What if, instead of having one light that changed a few colors there was a whole row of lights that lit up at random times (one at a time, of course) ... And looking at the reflection on the back of shovelbot - I see four lights (blue, red, green, yellow) in a row ... :ahh:

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i say the robot has to carry a banana to a point on the field drop it and try to peel it without slipping in to a water barrier :D


ya i dont know :confused:

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Key Words Slip, Peeling and Bunch - Known Colors Red Blue and Green - Confusion Sets in on a very tired brain :confused:

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there are white dots on the clown fish like thing...as far as i know clown fish dont have circular markings.

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wow your really observant! it took me a bit to find it after u told us about it! very interesting about the colors.. maybe he wasn't kidding about the different colored lights or maybe the balls are going to be different colors and we have to shoot or place them in their appropriate colored goals.

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i have some more thoughts after re-reading this. i think that the blue line in the middle will be a river which might explain the slip part. and i think that u can't cross this river and u have to use an arm or something to grab different colored fish on the other side held down by Velcro or something sticky which might go with the peeling part. and about the bunch part.. maybe if u can grab more than on fish at a time u get more points? now i have no idea about the banana....maybe there could be some banana like obstacles on the field?

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This game just gets crazier everytime we get a new hint. Maybe we are stuck in one place? Or mabye a floor with no traction?i still don't know.

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I don't think a water game will happen for the following reasons:

A) Practice fields would be INSANELY hard to construct, because in addition to the field elements, teams would have to basically build a POOL to test their robot in.

B) It occurs to me that dripping wet robots being constantly wheeled to and from the field would create an enormous wet floor hazard throughout the pits.

C) Aside from the obvious problems of robots sinking and then needing their entire electrical system replaced, the water would quickly become polluted with grease and who knows what else. Besides the "yuck" factor, how would FIRST dispose of this water after the event?

D) Considering how much damage was done to the fields this year, I shudder to think what could happen with a water filled field. (Tsunami!! :eek: )

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an all HDPE floor would be awsome. If they had that, I think it would be the first year since 1992 that they wouldn't have carpeting as the main field cover...

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I love to look up words in dictionaries and find things to think about, has anyone done this with these words?

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HOW DID THE WATER IDEA GET STARTED??? :confused: :confused: :confused:
I noticed that everyone here is talking about a water based challenge sometime in the future. Why is this? There must have been some rumor or story that I never heard about. I really would like to know why everyone seems to take this idea so seriously. I'm not criticizing either FIRST or any one individual. I just really want to know the reason why WATER is being anticipated.

What I would like someone to do is to reply to this on this post and include links to other threads within this forum where I may find the story behind the idea of the water based challenge.

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Water can not be a possibility. The safely percautions, the extra materials, the necessity to make robots water-tight and protection from electricty. It would be a mess I can't see FIRST doing. Teams that can't build so wonderous carpet robots will have a heck of a time with water bots.

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For a quick reprise of the never ending discussion about a water-based game, you can read through this thread. And for all those that believe that a water-based game is an absolute impossibility, I would recommend that you pay particular attention to Post #11 in that thread.

Nothing is "impossible." "Highly improbable" is just the start of an interesting intellectual exercize.

-dave (I am still holding out for the jello-based game)

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I just got pwned by Dave...how awesome is that?!

I don't think FIRST would still have a water game though.

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I told Dave at IRI 2002 I didn't think FIRST would lower robot weight, either.

I said something like, "It would throw off veteran teams and - for rookies - it's hard enough to meet the 130 lb limit, as it is!"

Dave said, "Hm, interesting ..." and walked away. ;)

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You only want a jello based game so that you can eat the jello at the end of the competition ;)

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Mmmm... greasy jello :rolleyes:

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Why wait for the end?

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What about a Jello game that your robot has to take chunks of jello out of a jello-vat and the teams with the most jello they grabbed win the match and can eat the jello. The loseing team can eat their jello too in the spirit of Gratious Professionalism.

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Reminds me of something on Nickelodeon. One of those crazy kid shows from "back in the day" but still sounds good to me!

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Long ago and far away - there once was a jello commercial that highlighted the letters j-e-l-l-O with musical notes.

different colored musical notes - jello - cool. You guys can figure out the game, I'll listen to the music.

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Technically, they didn't lower it.

It's actually about 4 odd pounds higher than before, when you consider that a battery weighs ~14 lbs, and the weight limit is 120.

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A jello playing field could lead to some interesting drive systems.

Peeling and slip can mean the same thing (peel out on a slick surface?). Maybe everyone peels out and bunches up on the side of the fields?

And I don't remember if this was mentioned; is there ANY possible significance to the fact there are 3 fish, rather than just one?

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Hmm..might they bring back 2V2 with 3 robots maximum on any side of the field at any given time? And 1 robot as backbot or so.

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The robot delivers Jello to the human player. The team is awarded an extra point for every ounce of Jello the human player eats before the end of the match. The points are doubled in the semi-finals, and quadrupled in the finals (as I suspect the HP will be slowing down considerably by then). The HP's would really hate reruns due to field failures, wouldn't they?

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What kind of jello????? Thats a huge factor.

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blue, red, green, yellow - cubed

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Dave has been pushing a jello based game for a long time, what if it was really a metaphor for something that jiggles, or something that is extremely hard to pick up. Perhaps it in reference to a large group of really small objects that separate if lifted incorrectly, like trying to eat soup with a fork. or Jello with a fork, where as you can eat jello with a spoon.

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Try inversing the colors on the original picture. You can see the circle's a lot better.

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The only way to eat jello is with chopsticks! The only problem I would see for using real jello is that it's consistency depends on the temperature... hmmm... maybe a game where you have to transfer the jello before the lights melt it? Or a game on an ice-rink?

Heidi

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I doubt they'd go back to 2v2, or 4 teams a match style.

With the rapid growth of FIRST. 4 teams a match wouldn't be adequate.

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Maybe you have to grab the banana to cross the line and you can't get touched by your opponents (fish) or you get points taken away and you have to deliver the banana to a spot on the other side with out getting touched by your opponents. The three fish seem to be waiting for the robot to cross the line (which is underwater) so they can tag him or block him from getting to the spot. :confused:

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Here's what I'm thinking...

1) The whole banana thing was just to make the line for having a "bunch" of clues. Which brings me to my next point...

2) That post saying a "Bunch" of clues means that the picture gives away more than one element to the game...

3)I have two different thoughts on the words "slip" and "peel" in that post...
They are there to enhance the bannana theme :( . Or they are there to show that their will be a slipery aspect to the game. However the picture shows the game on the traditional carpet, meaning that the slippery aspect must be introduced in the scoring portion. Still working aout how this could be...

4) Enough with the follow up post... Back to the picture... The whole water-esque look of the picture could be a few things... To fuel threads like this about a water based game (however I don't think this is correct, because a post was quickly made downplaying the possibility of a water game), meaning that the water feel of the picture represents something else. I would just like to go on the record that I don't think any water at all will be on the field, it sort of contradicts the whole 'saftery first' thing. So... again... I have no idea what the water may represent but I'm working on it.

5) There is one robot on the field and three fish. Now I have a few ideas on what this means. First, it could be that points are allotted on a 1 v 3 basis, with there being four rounds, each robot getting a turn to be the offensive robot, and that being the period where that robot can gain points for ranking. However, there are a few factors working against this, it would completely do away with alliance selections, and in the picture a blue startign box can be seen. This blue box probably means there will still be alliances. Now my other thought (which I think is the most plausible thing I've said in this whole post...) on what the fish could mean is that they represent three ways to score. This wouold tie in with the whole "slippery" way of scoring supported by the bananas thing earlier. The other reason I think this is true... take a look at the uppermost fish, it's one of those fish who have a light hanging from their head. I'm thinking it represents the light for the camera. The other two fish look smaller, but not as tough, and they do not have a light. Meaning that those will be the other ways to score and will not use a camera and are not as tough to get but will produce less points. The textures and colors on the fish could very well have something else to do with how to score, but I'm saving that thought for another day...

6)The lights reflected on the back of the robot... On this one I'm gonna say take it at face value, those are the colors for the Autonomous light. However I did have another thought, why are the lights reflected on top of the robot? Could this mean that there will be colored lights high above the field that the robot can use to find position during Auto, it certainly would make for a more complex Auto, something that seems to be a pattern as the years go on...

7) I know that the design on the thing hasn't changed much through all the animations, but why does the robot still have a plow on it? Could this also be a clue on how to score? Once again... I don't know how... Still working that out...

Anyway... I know I left alot of blanks in this post... but it's everything I've though of when I looked at the picture. Just a side note, I love how the picture came out so early this year. It gives me something to ponder when I don't want to listen to whatever the teacher is saying in school...

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I don't know if anyone has said this yet but, by the blue alliance box this tells up that they will not be changing the alliance colors. Thus this debunks the idea of the multi-colored lights. Proving they were just a joke, well at least in the colors they showed us. Yet then again what other easily distinguishable colors are there?

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What does the blue allianc box have to do with the lights??? I mean the light was green this year and the alliance colors were blue and red??? Or do you mean that the alliance format wouln't change, because blue was a color they showed us and they could also keep blue and add more alliances... Sorry, just a bit confused by this post.

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Morgan and I were talking about this the other day. I believe that what he means is that since there is a blue alliance as indicated by the blue alliance starting box, there will once again be the red and blue lights, indicating the red and blue alliances above the player stations. So if they did have the red/green/blue lights for the camera to track, the camera can accidently track the red and blue lights of the player stations.

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Oh... Sorry, gotcha! Thought you meant the light above the scoring target. Oops. Thx for clarifing. However, I do think they can make the scoring lights those colors and just do away with the lights over the drivers stations and just make them electronic displays or something.

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No problem. But then again, the displays that show the team numbers on the player stations are also red. So unless they come up with a solution to the player station lights, I'm still kinda iffy on the whole switching colored lights issue. However, it's still never a bad idea to be prepared just in case... :rolleyes:

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If they make the colored lights and the driver station lights different enough shades of red/blue, I don't think they'll have many problems.

Or, if these lights stay on the whole match, the red/blue light can indicate the players station AND a target to hit.

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An underwater game?! AWESOME!!! :eek: Though it'll be kinda hard to waterproof the whole electronics system; I mean, one gap and your whole system is SCREWED! It's a very challenging task, but it'll all be fun in the end (if we don't spring a leak). Alright everybody, it's sink or swim (no pun intended)... ;)

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Capture the Flag