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-   -   Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used? (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41548)

AV_guy007 25-04-2006 17:58
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
my team has a wireless pinhole camera that transmits in UHF and uses a 9v battery. it is very strong and small making it ideal for this kind of use.

we thought one of the best times to try it would be at a off seson event instead of an actual regional.

i dont know if it will happen now because of the fact that it must be powered by the 12v batt.

Al Skierkiewicz 25-04-2006 18:19
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericand
Any way, we will have the parts in Atlanta and time will tell if we can configure them acceptably for use during the competition.
Eric,
If you need help come and find me. I will be at one of the inspection stations, likely Newton.
Al

ericand 03-01-2007 18:16
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Looking forward to the 2007 season, I have not seen any more discussion about rule changes that would allow for batteries to power cameras like the one we used last year. I really want to thank all the officials who granted us exceptions to enable our camera use last year, and I fervently hope that the rules will have been adjusted to make it easier this year.

Ericgehrken 03-01-2007 19:09
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
I think every robot at least at the nationals should have an onboard camera that is a source of video feed to the big screen. I think it would show what the players (robots) see while competing which would make FIRST more like a real sport because you can watch the game from the bleachers and then you look at a screen and you could see what the robots see. It would just be like in NASCAR where every car has an onboard camera which sends video feeds to the big screen at the track and to the television broadcaster.

dtengineering 04-01-2007 14:55
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
I have noticed that the CMU Cam has a composite video output. Certainly in pre-ship date testing having this wired up to a transmitter might help the programming team to figure out just what, exactly, the camera is looking at. Just remember to pull the transmitter before you ship.

Secondly the RC does return digital data to the OI. It would be difficult... but not impossible... to compress the CMU Cam's image, fire it back to the OI, have the data dumped to a Laptop over the dashboard connection, have the laptop uncompress the data and show a very laggy, pixellated version of what the CMU Cam sees to the driver station during a match without violating any rules, express or implied.

It might not be particularly useful, but it would have to be considered for one of the design or control awards just for the sheer coolness of it.

Jason

Al Skierkiewicz 04-01-2007 15:13
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Jason,
As I understand this, the data link RC to OI cannot pass enough data to display even occassional video images. And feed back of this type I do believe would have violated the rules in previous years. On Saturday we will know for sure on the rules and if the control system has been modified. Stay tuned...

ericand 04-01-2007 18:01
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Transmission would be nice, but adds lots of complexity. All I want is to be able to record to a SD card for later review....

Tim Arnold 04-01-2007 19:09
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
In 2005, our rookie year, we were denied to be allowed to use a wireless camera at UCF as they didn't have time to approve it (or something). We asked around, and every time they just had a "what the heck is that" look, and said no.

I suppose they have a right to be concerned about interference, but it was verifiable that the camera ran on the 2.4ghz frequency.

Oh well, old news. Just figured I would toss this in to remind teams to get it approved before matches start, even before practice. Things simply become too hectic and busy for the staff to analyze things that require time and have little benefit.

Nawaid Ladak 04-01-2007 19:53
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
actually, if we could us cameras on the robots, it would sort of be like what nascar does to it's racecars, make it a more enjoyable sport i mean on the video screen, insted of having those veiws of the feild, we would have a veiw on the feild, like last year, with the camera next to the top goal.

speaking of camera's

Imagine Nationals in HD. Oh man would that be something for the people who won't go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Arnold (Post 548011)
In 2005, our rookie year, we were denied to be allowed to use a wireless camera at UCF as they didn't have time to approve it (or something). We asked around, and every time they just had a "what the heck is that" look, and said no.

I suppose they have a right to be concerned about interference, but it was verifiable that the camera ran on the 2.4ghz frequency.

Oh well, old news. Just figured I would toss this in to remind teams to get it approved before matches start, even before practice. Things simply become too hectic and busy for the staff to analyze things that require time and have little benefit.
orrection, you guys DID use th camera for one match, because was watching the match from it. i remember but you guys didn't get a god signal at all.

RedHeadRobotics 07-01-2007 20:23
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
I think that it would help a lot if we were allowed to use cameras. Afterall, it's going to be hard for the driver to see on the other side of the spider rack. Oh well, we can't change the rules.

cdfps 07-01-2007 20:34
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Here is some onboard footage from team 348's 2006 robot at the NYC regional.


http://media.putfile.com/nyc-regional-1

The first minute is pretty boring, but it picks up when the game starts

Matt Krass 07-01-2007 20:35
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz (Post 547912)
Jason,
As I understand this, the data link RC to OI cannot pass enough data to display even occassional video images. And feed back of this type I do believe would have violated the rules in previous years. On Saturday we will know for sure on the rules and if the control system has been modified. Stay tuned...
Actually I believe that the rule prohibited the use of a secondary transmitter to send feedback of that nature to the alliance stations, I thought it would be legal to use any feedback that could be transmitted over the existing data link.

That said, it does seem technically infeasible to send video, even low frame rate and low resolution, but you can send the tracking data back and use an application like the Java CMU app or LabView to show what the camera sees in relative terms. Or perhaps a heads up display on the drivers safety glasses, we did that last year with great success.

Tim Arnold 07-01-2007 20:40
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreedomForce (Post 548028)
orrection, you guys DID use th camera for one match, because was watching the match from it. i remember but you guys didn't get a god signal at all.
Yeah, I forgot about that. We used it in one practice match with nearly dead batteries; we didn't know we were supposed to get it approved before use... whoops.

RedHeadRobotics 07-01-2007 21:02
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
OK, now I'm confused. If we wanted to get video feedback from the robot during the game for the driver, would it be allowed? I know it would have to probably be on a laptop and so on. But would that be ok? Please help!

Guy Davidson 08-01-2007 01:08
Re: Can Wireless Video Cameras Be Used?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericand (Post 482227)
At the Las Vegas Regional, Team 1425 and Team 8 both had recording cameras mounted on their robots during some of the matches on Saturday.

There was some controversy on Friday about the permissibility of the cameras on the robot since the lead inspector, who had approved our camera on Thursday was not available. Saturday morning, we were given permission to use the cameras.

In this case, neither of the cameras were capable of broadcasting. The cameras recorded to on-board media and the video could only
be viewed after the match. Team 1425's camera was an action cam made for this sort of thing by Oregon Scientific. I'll try to find a way to post some of the video.

The game officials did say that they would be discussing the issues raised by our requests and their decisions with FIRST and that hopefully things would be clearer for the events in Atlanta.
Our camera was just a private camera there. It didn't even transmit. We just recorded video.


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