School Issues
 

First I am glad that you have a place for people to come to talk about issues they are having at the school level. My son's highschool is giving robotics a try for the first time this year and they have already run into some roadblocks. Some seem to be insurmountable. They found a teacher to support them after school and on Saturdays which I thank that teacher for his willingness and support. However the teacher feels that because he is the adult that he is in control of how the robot is designed and produced. This includes things like shape, electronics, and designs.

The one day that the kids with the FIRST mentor had to themselves they got more accomplished then the whole prior two weeks and it was the KIDS that did the design and the work. Now the teacher did not like the kids robot and wants his design put back. The FIRST coach told the kids that this is their robot they need to stand up for it. The problem is the teacher feels and has stated that "FIRST people say a whole bunch of stuff and you need to filter out what is useful and what is not" now that bothered me greatly for these kids to be told this.

Secondly the kids received a Inventor 10 software for use. My son was going to be using that to set up and design the robot but the kids were told they can not use it because the computers can not handle it and there is no money to do upgrades. We took our computer in (which can handle it) and we were told no they would not install it on a home computer because it would not be able still not be able to be opened at school where they needed it.

As Rookies my son was trying to go after several awards including the Autodesk Award and he was told by the same teacher that this team is not aiming to win any of the major awards that this is just to try it out to see how it works. Several kids who had joined the team dropped out at that point becuase they were already quite discouraged.

I have adviced my son to talk to FIRST mentor/coach which he has done. I am still seeing a problem with the teachers control of the robot group. However the problem ends with if we do not go with the teachers idea the teacher will drop us and we will have no place to work. How do we go about resolving this issue?

I do realize that an option would be to become independant however at this time that is not an option that can be considered.

Re: School Issues
 

Well, if it makes it any easier, the Inventor comment is bunk. By calling Autodesk, you can convert your network licenses standalone, in which case you get 10, standalone licenses, able to be installed on 10, different, un-networked computers. It takes about 5 minutes, and they're extremely helpful. Good luck! 877-500-6974 Wait for an operator, have the software nearby, and ask them to convert your FIRST network licenses to standalone.

Re: School Issues
 

I think that what she meant by not being able to be installed is since im on the same team it was said that the techs would not install the new inventor on the school computer so if the new inventor was used it could not be opened in inventor 5.

So he would not allow us to install inventor 10 on the home computer and also will not let us near the software. He keeps it under lock and key and lets no one near it.

So far we have not even gotten the kitbot built because the teacher keeps on changing things around and changing the robot.

In other words he is having the robot built to what he thinks is the best, not what the team or the first mentors think is best.

Re: School Issues
 

This is tough advice, but since its your first year, build any robot and go to a regional. At the regional, get the teacher to interact with other teams and the students to learn from the surrounding atmosphere. You can also ask established teams who are willing to help for some help. At least you are building a robot - you are lucky. These issues need to be sorted out slowly. Good luck.

Re: School Issues
 

That is true at least they are building a robot and getting some experience.

Re: School Issues
 

I know of a team that had similar problems and they seemed to have resolved it by doing the following:

1. Speak with the teacher/students/parents/mentors and make sure everyone is aware of the ideas associated with FIRST (Student involvement, GP etc.)

2. Define roles for the students, the parents, the teachers and the mentors. By doing this and having everyone agree to it, you don't alienate anyone and you make sure that everyone is on the same page.

3.Get some other teams to visit your meetings and discuss how their team operates so your teacher understands that this is a student driven project.

If the problem persists, pull some parents together and talk to the teacher. Just make sure you don't cause any bad feelings for the teacher, you do not want to lose your advisor mid-season.

I hope this helps.

GO 1403!!!

Re: School Issues
 

well here is how things worked out. everytime the students walked into the room things had been being done with the robot by the woodshop classes and the teacher mentor bringing to his over all plan. motors moved, electronics adjusted, frame mounted, panals placed. each time we would take apart and redo according to the plan that the team agreed to in the design stages. finally we moed robot out of the school on weekend to allow more time to work on the robot. this was when the most progress was completed. Our teacher mentor became quite insulting to the kids everytime something was placed calling them idiots and morons and the final straw broek when the teacher took a hammer to the motors and smashed them. calling our first mentors names not able to be repeated. parents and students met with school staff and the descision was finally made to remove the robot from the school due to work environment nmot being suitable for students. the staf was also shocked to find out that grades were being based on the work done during robotics and that students were afraid they would fail because we did not go with the teachers plan. teacher was removed from the project after parents met with school staff. it was very tense situation and feelings did get hurt however we as parents felt it was not ok to insult students and first staff for ideas and work they are doing. now we are working without a teacher but with many parents and mentors and much happier. we now have a working robot with a name and with a mind of its own (literally moved without joysticks not sure why or how but it moved forward on its own) teacher has been reprimanded for his usse of grades and insults to intimidate students and we are working as a team :D

Re: School Issues
 

The part in bold is what surprised me the most. This is not at all within the ideals of FIRST and GP. But I am glad that it turned out ok and you have a working robot. The robot probably moved because of the adjustment on the joysticks wasn't set to zero (wheels at base of control stick). But Good luck and I hope you do well at your competition!

Re: School Issues
 

It's unfortunate that your students have had some difficulties in their rookie year. This can be a learning lesson for you all - establish what the team wants to look like - there is no one way to do a FIRST team (and we won't get into a discussion on that here because there are other threads that talk about this) - some models have the students doing all the work, some have the adults doing all the work while inspiring the students, others are a blend. Look on these threads for ideas about organizing teams, creating handbooks, establishing rules and consequences, etc. Do a post-season assessment of each student on the team (there is a white paper about this).

I will send you information about joining NEMO - the Non-Engineering Mentor Organization - other mentors can help with ideas about team organization and issues like this. And also remember, these forums are public forums and we need to carefully think about how and what we post here as they remain forever online.

Re: School Issues
 

now that our group has moved on away from the situation they have found different ways to view the problems and what to watch for next time. they envision mentors that are more coaches team members rather then strict teacher student line drawn situation. i think this team sees where it could have handled things better and where it handled things well.

I am also proud to say i have actually learned more then just robotics with this group. I learned that we can form a long lasting friendship within our team that goes beyond the robotic work room. members help each other with homework, relationship, and I even learn how to safely jump start my car. (without sparks flying) The memories formed with this group will last a lifetime and i hope will be passed on to the next groups that come along and i think that is what FIRST is all about.