Chief Delphi - bumper customization?

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bumper customization?

Quote:

<R35> The use of bumpers is strongly encouraged. Bumpers can reduce damage to robots when they contact another robot or field elements. If you choose to use the specified bumpers, you will have both a more robust robot and the traction advantage of a heavier robot. Bumper height has been specified so that robots will make contact bumper-to-bumper and so that the balls will be pushed rather than pulled under the robots. Note that robot wheel/tracks must be properly positioned relative to the bumpers to avoid trouble climbing the ramp. Obviously harvesting balls from the floor or launching balls along the floor must be done through gaps in bumpers or over bumpers. As the bumper mounts are being designed, please think about carrying the robot. The bumpers do not make good handles. Please do not "lawyer" the bumper rule - it is meant to help. If used, bumpers must satisfy the following constraints:
Bumpers must be designed as shown in figure 5-1
Bumpers must be removable so that they can be weighed separately from the robot

Bumpers must weigh, in total, no more than 15 pounds including any fasteners that attach them to the robot

Bumpers must not include sections that weigh more than 3 ounces per inch (i.e. no short bumpers with giant heavy fasteners)

Bumpers must use a stacked pair of 2-1/2 inch "pool noodles" as the bumper material

Bumpers must use 3/4 inch plywood backing 5 inches tall as the bumper structure to attach the bumper ("pool noodles") to the robot

Bumpers must be covered with a tough smooth cloth (1000 denier Cordura Plus® strongly recommended)

At the start of the match bumpers may extend outside the horizontal starting dimensions for the robot (as specified in Rule <R05>) by up to a maximum of 3-1/2 inches per side, nothing other than pool noodlesand cloth may extend more than 1 inch beyond the robot boundaries

Bumpers must be positioned on the robot so that they remain between 2-1/2 inches and 8-1/2 inches above the floor

how does this allow for customization? i mean they kinda limit your ability to design.

Re: bumper customization?

That's exactly the point. Basically they're giving you 15 lbs and three extra inches on each side. If you don't like the rules...you don't have to use them.

Re: bumper customization?

I think that they didn't want people designing "bumpers" with ball gathering mechanisms, or otherwise using the "bumpers can extend outside the robot boundaries" rule to an ungracious advantage.

Re: bumper customization?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Collin Fultz

If you don't like the rules...you don't have to use them.

clarification.... you dont have to use the bumpers. not you dont have to use the rules. :p

Re: bumper customization?

You don't have to use the official FIRST spec bumpers. But...

If you do, you get the extra 15lbs.
You also get the extra 3 inches or so.

You can make your own bumper however you want but,
You don't get the extra weight or size.

You still can only contact other robots within the defined 'bumper' zone extending 8" from the floor. Also your bumpers cannot be more than 10 degrees from vertical. These last two restrictions are Rules, not Suggestions (like the bumper design).

Re: bumper customization?

Anyone wonder how FIRST is even getting fifteen pounds out of the bumpers anyway? I mean, there is only a certain amount of perimeter on the robot, and only a certain way that you can build the bumpers. 15 pounds seems like a little much, unless you pour a little lead shot in with the noodles...;)

Re: bumper customization?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Blair

Anyone wonder how FIRST is even getting fifteen pounds out of the bumpers anyway?

Not all plywood is created equal. Hint: the best plywood for the purpose doesn't come from Home Depot.

It's a pity they specified plywood for the backing board. Our front and rear bumpers (more like collision protection bars) last year were 4/4 red oak. They had significant quantities of dings and scratches, but our robot was otherwise untouched. Plywood is pretty wimpy stuff by comparision. If you think of solid lumber as nature's own composite material, in plywood have the fibers are going the wrong way in an application like this.

Re: bumper customization?

The rules are a bit strict, as they do not allow for any customization to the bumpers, if the bumpers are to exceed the legal limit of the robot. But the bumpers are a huge advantage, seeing as they add width and weight over the legal limits without being illegal, bu tthat's only if you use the bumpers in the rules.

Re: bumper customization?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schneidie

The rules are a bit strict, as they do not allow for any customization to the bumpers, but the bumpers are a huge advantage, seeing as they add width and weight over the legal limits without being illegal.

They do allow for some customization, but still put all teams on an equal playing ground. The previous years bumper rules simply stated that they had to be soft so that you could hit them and not get hurt. Well different teams have different pain threshholds so to speak, and therefore there were a bunch of different designs. These are customizable in that you are allowed to leave opening for ball gathering etc, as well as being able to choose different colored fabric to cover them, so they can still match your robot.

Re: bumper customization?

Bumpers are a great idea. The problem is that the rules are very strict. With our kit frame and wheels and the lack of modifications allowed, we can't go up the ramp with bumpers. The modifications to the frame and wheels that would allow us to go up the ramp have undesirable effects. So at this time we most likely will not use bumpers. If First in an update allows modifications to the bumper height we would use bumpers. There are many problems with collisions involving bumpered and non-bumpered bots. This whole bumper issue needs rethinking by First going forward. Mandatory bumpers in a bumper zone with certain allowed design modifications would be a very very good thing.

Re: bumper customization?

Well one thing my team usually does rather than bumpers is to design the robot so if someone tries anything, they'll be hurting thimselves more than the damage they wanted to do on us lol. See we cant get in trouble because we didn't try to hurt anyone, its just that someone tried us and hurt themselves in the process Bwahahahaha.

Re: bumper customization?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gdeaver

Bumpers are a great idea. The problem is that the rules are very strict. With our kit frame and wheels and the lack of modifications allowed, we can't go up the ramp with bumpers.

I might be mistaken, but is there a rule that says that IF you put bumpers on, they must be on all four sides? If not...well there's a possible solution to your problem

Re: bumper customization?

well assuming that the rule posted previously^ is the only rule about bumpers, it suggests that you can put your bumpers on in sections. Since it doesn't say anything about all four sides, I think its a safe assumption that you can do bumpers on only two or three sides.

Re: bumper customization?

I was just wondering if anyone has found a source for the specific pool noodles? I remember a thread where someone was having a hard time finding the noodles.

Thanks,
Kirk

Re: bumper customization?

we were able to get our bumpers one ebay pretty cheap just look around

Re: bumper customization?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team 614

we were able to get our bumpers one ebay pretty cheap just look around

Not sure if thats allowed to be honest. I'll have to check the rule book and such.

Re: bumper customization?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcel

Not sure if thats allowed to be honest. I'll have to check the rule book and such.

Why wouldn't e-bay be allowed? It's available to everyone.

Re: bumper customization?

I suggest looking at the Q&A for bumper rules as there are several clarifications.

There is no rule specifying bumper must be on all sides, but with no bumper is opens the interpretation of another robot pushing you to be much looser. The Q&A specifically addresses partial bumpers and gaps needed for ball gathering/etc.

Also if you want to know how to use 15lbs for your bumpers an above post mentioning all plywood is not equal was quite right. If you get your plywood at the Depot our bumpers will sail right through yours.

Re: bumper customization?

If you want to "customize" your bumpers, just get some cool material to put on the outside with a cool design.

Your robot should be the custom work, not the safety equipment. It is designed for a reason how it is, and why it is, with safety in mind.

Re: bumper customization?

the bumper are a good idea. it reduces the risk of damaging your robot if you ram something too hard :yikes:

Re: bumper customization?

Quote:

Originally Posted by weavedawg

the bumper are a good idea. it reduces the risk of damaging your robot if you ram something too hard :yikes:

VERY valid point. We ...uh...dented our robot in testing the other day...."Hey lets see how fast we can go..." " how do we stop.?!" "@#$* Corner corner corner!!!" (not the best way to stop :-p)