Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

One of my predictions for this year's competition is that there may be a great deal of magic smoke as a result of high RPM motors stalling out, and mechanical parts exploding from strong centrifugal forces.

What do you think?

If you have some good pics of magic smoke in action, feel free to post them

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

When mechanical parts explode all the magic noise leaks out all at once, and it stops working.

You can sometimes get some of the magic noise back into the parts by yelling at them, hitting them, or bashing them with a hammer

but usually they have to go back to a machine shop, where they can be pumped full again by the noisey machines.

Mechanical parts are only suppose to give out their magical noise a little bit at a time!

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

I've noticed some chain moving at high velocity. I can't ever remember seeing a chain come apart. Maybe I'll get to see it happen.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

i can see smoke happening via motors get red hot. there may be shrapnel flying if a robot starts shredding balls. it is possible. this also brings up another good point, if motors stop working correctly, will there be balls flying into the stands? :ahh:

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

THAT WOULD BE REALLY COOL TO SEE!!!!!!!!!! LOL

Josh

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

with all the spinning wheel shooters this year, some with variable angles, Im thinking about the steam generator station in Buffalo, along the Niagara River (near Strawberry Island).

Many years ago one of the 12 foot diameter generator armatures broke loose from its bearings. Since it was mounted vertically it bounced around the inside of the brick building for several seconds, like a giant top gone wild.

Finally it hit something solid and flew out through the brick wall, landing in the niagara river a few hundred yards away. You can still see the patch where the hole in the brick wall was repaired.

So what will happen if one of these spinning shooter wheels breaks loose inside a robot? It would be like a metal tornado inside the machine!

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

I would hope teams to the time to properly balance their high speed wheels to minimize the vibrations that would tear apart machines. Also I woupld hope people properly use Loctite, lock nuts, lock washers, and jamb nuts to prevent things from coming apart. Hopefully we don't need to resort to safety wire.

I do believe though that I will detect the oh too familiar scent of FP magic smoke very quickly as someone will stall them or have improper air flow kill one at the regionals I attend.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

Yesturday we were testing the camera on the robot and we were running our shooting mechanism and the camera lens flew off the board and shot across the room ...It wasn't damaged but what a close call...

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

I love the smell of magic smoke in the morning!

I figure balls will be flying in to the crowd all the time, just from driver error... or will the crowd be made to sit further away this year?

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

Our chain came apart :D


We were running it at 4000 RMP, and the cnain hit a peice of lexan just right so it unclipped the masterlink...

That was scary :o

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

I missed that, Cody, when did it happen?

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

When you were at district jazz, I think.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

Yep, as Cody said, it just unexpectedly unclipped. However a horrible noise it emitted, it just kinda slopped off and into something static; not too exciting unless you're right beside it. The area we have it in is rather enclosed though, so I'm not sure there won't be some exploding/flying chains on other robots... I'm more worried about plastic wheels shattering towards the end of a second regional.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

We never did find the side of that masterlink though... I'd imagine it would have done some damage to flesh if it'd hit someone :P

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

We just had some magick smoke let out. We are trying to figure out why. I was the operator and aparently the hopper was smashing into some wires, and damaged the insulation enough so that... ooopps, black, red, power, ground, poof!

Thought I'd share the story since it happened 10 minutes ago as of now.

Two wires touched.

Paul Dennis

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

that would be a neat feature if you could do it with the whole camera: remote viewing!

your robot would have an out-of-body experience

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

This is the author of the original post...you wouldn't hapen to have a photo of the wires would you?...if so, please post it

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

That happened to us two years back, except it was while bringing a mast down. wires crushed, scary sound, bad things. Don't think you were on the team then, Doug.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

this year i learned that you can get magic smoke and a nice sized spark if you let the wires of a motor touch after they have been unplugged directly from your battery if the wheel they are spinning is still going fast enough. A logical occurrence if you look at it in retrospect but still quite scary and confusing when it first occurs.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

no double posting kids....lol

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

In the words of one of the students as he was working with our launcher prototype, "The real surprise came when it bounced off my face." He wasn't referring to the ball, by the way.
Make sure your screws and bolts are tight, boys and girls!
Oh, and we got magic(k? Aleister Crowley lives again?) smoke from our joysticks earlier. That was interesting.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

You got it.


Wait.


Um.


Shoot.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

We did get a little magic smoke this year--apparently Victors don't like having the battery wired to the motor side. :o At least we had some fun pulling it apart and looking at the damage.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

Yeah, make sure that youre running your Victor's for any spinwheels in Coast mode. Trying to brake them can cause some bad results if they're still spinning too fast. At least for our team, that helps.
Make sure your shooters are well enclosed too.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

Im surprized to hear that (actually I am shocked and dismayed :^)

if the Victors can spin a motor up, it should be able to coast or brake it

in fact you should be able to spin the shooter up to full speed, then throw it into full reverse (to stop it) without hurting the victors.

But then again, maybe the shooter wheels being built this year are using them in ways they have never been used before? If you blow one out using it this way I would definately send it back to IFI for failure analysis.

And if we start seeing a lot of victors fail on shooter wheels, it would be useful to instrument one and see how much voltage and current it is seeing when it brakes the motor.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

I will run an inline amp test in about an hour or so and post how much ours takes. Given that it runs at about 31A it'll probably be close to twice that ?

-Mikw

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

I would expect you might see 100A on the motor for a brief period. A DC clamp-on ammeter might be the best choice.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

WOW and i thought you meant sparks flying when your robot hits another robot and flames shootingt into the air and the balls are shot at the target and smoke pour out when your robot hit the ramps silly me. pyrotechnics is where i was thinking. **runs to talk to team**

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

When one refers to magic smoke he/she is referring to the smoke that comes from faulty wiring or electronics.

check out this link for the real definition............you must read this short article in order to fully understand what "magic smoke is"................there's more to it than what I explained to you.

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

As a Field Supervisor this year I think I'm going to wear my safety Glasses AND a hardhat... I'm sitting WAY to close to the action :-D
(At least if we had these problems last year, while I was a ref, I'd be watching the machines at all times and could duck out of the way or something...)

Heh. Please... don't impale the Field Supervisors... I beg you... :eek:

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

Sorry didn't have a chance to run the amp meter. I have a dc, inline amp meter capable of over 600amp, DC. I simply bolt the wires to the lugs on the shunt and turn the meter on and the device, I have used this for numerous items, including a 2500watt dc to ac inverter (capable of over 500 amp surge at 12volts). I wont get the chance to hook up again until probably saturday but will post my findings.

-Mike

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

the smell of burning rubber will be strong, from belts getting hot, or from us atleast

Re: Magic Smoke and Shrapnel
 

okay flames plus carpet bad thing....blinking light good thing got it thanks :D