Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

Now that I think about it, we could. But we won't. I see it as one more thing to seperate the have's from the have not's, and as such, immoral. Ideally, rookies and 12 year veterans are on a level playing field in every arena but ingenuity and work ethic.

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

We built 2 robots for the first time this year. First we dismantled last year's and built one, then once we learned from our mistakes, we hustled to build the competition one. Once you build one, building a second one just like it is a lot easier. Now we get to keep the scrap one here at school to play with before competition.

neat how you call it a twin. I guess ours is more of a clone.

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

If first makes a rule to only make one machine it takes a load off my plate the other engineers plate and the machinest plate. Its not me that loses, the kids will lose. No practice time, no program time, no spare parts, less chance for a student to get some assembly time, less chance to experience what engineers do.

Go ahead first make the rule......NOTE( there will be teams out there to break the rule)

The only gripe here is have teams verse have nots Same as NASCAR.
What if you had two different teams building the same machine what then!!!

Dean said the teams are not fair thats the real world. The goal is the same show students what science and technology is like not to cry when someone else has an advantage.

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

For those who take the stance that it is not "fair" or ethical/moral to build a second robot, and keeping this point SEPARATE from any discussion of whether it is allowed by rule or not ...

How is this any different from a team concepting, designing, developing, building, testing, and perfecting a new drive-train (or other mechanism/system) in the off-season, then re-building it after kickoff to stay "within the rules" ??

I don't believe I have seen any discussion on that topic ...

Remember the primary goal of FIRST - to Inspire students to consider careers in science/technology/engineering by immersing them in a "real-world" type of problem solving environment. A second prototype/backup/practice robot is merely a form of risk mitigation - something that is absolutely required in any technology environment.

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

We have built a second robot that is very close to our final design that we will be using to practice with. We also have enough parts to build a third based on original designs that we did not use. We might do this for practice competition. Our first design was completely different than what we came up with for our final production robot. We could see what our robot would do against something different. :cool:

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

For those of you that think it is a gray area in FIRST ... it is not a gray area at all. FIRST knows about second robots and have tailored this year's rules around the second robots. The rules are as constraining as possible while still allowing a practice robot.

I can tell you this: my students are excited, inspired, and are just having a great time driving the robot and shooting balls. We have a new form of dodge ball called "See if you can hit Copioli while he's walking by ..." where the students try to have the robot shoot balls at me and actually hit me.

Anyway, how about this: you inspire your way and I'll inspire mine. A second robot is within the rules and I won't tell you you're wrong for not building one if you don't accuse me of not being "by the book". "The book" is the rules manual and is does not disallow the practice robots.

By the way, if FIRST did make a rule specifically banning practice robots, then teams like ours would not have been able to loan it out at two separate off season competitions to get other teams inspired about FIRST. Again, FIRST is about more than just the competition.

-Paul

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

building more than 1 :ahh: we are lucky if we get one done in time :D

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

I have no qualms against teams building 2 robots. I used to though. But really, it's just a representation of the real world: you don't always have the funding or resources to best your opponent, so you must then make a better product with what you have.

FYI, we can't and never have been able to build 2, though we would like to

Re: Any other teams building more than 1 robot?
 

Building two robots has several advantages not mentioned here.

1. The students get a lesson in materials / cost management - save resources.

2. Students see a brief look at the importance of detailed plans and drawings.

3. Students get twice as much time fabricating and using the machines ( student labor/creation accounts for at least 90% of our robot. The other labor being Mike A. (Delphi), Mark N. (Delphi) and myself).

4. A robot to take to media events during the season to promote FIRST.

5. A robot to allow the students to modify it in any way at the end of the season and during class.