A&E after thought
 

I just wanted to see what everyone thought about the show on A&E. I thought it was good, but they didnt show engoh of our robot ( even though we were the #1 seeded team). Oh well. Either way this was good for first and I enjoyed the show.

Gabe Goldman
Head of Design Team; Public Realtions Manager
J.R. Tucker HIgh School

Two Thumbs Up!
 

Congrats on being the number 1 seed...first off :)

I for one want to commend A&E for a fabulous program. This is the first time I've seen a tv network really dive into more than just who won the game. For once, they looked at the team. It was much more personal than simply "lets congratulate the winners" - let you look into the world, even briefly on some of these students and engineers. Made you want them to succeed even more than anything.

I want to congratulate both the Grundy High School and Herndon High School teams for their incredible FIRST spirit and refusing to give in no matter what the odds. I am not proud to admit that I used to be one of the ones (you know who you are!) that would look upon the VCU as a "rookie regional" as if that made it any less exciting. This program, and meeting two of my best friends, however, has forced me to admit I was wrong. Well funded, or "underdogs" - we really are all alike in FIRST.

I hope more networks take notice of the precedent A&E has set and sees us all in the competition for what we really are.

~ lora

Overall, I thought the show was great. But, being a member of one of the two featured teams, I don't exactly have an objective opinion. As good as the show was, I do know that there was some much more interesting/bizarre footage that the camera crews collected, that would have made an even more entertaining show (although it may not have done much to promote FIRST - most of you know how things tend to loosen up about 1:00 in the morning on the day before shipping the robot...):)

On a more serious note, I do want to offer a public apology on behalf of our entire team for an unfortunate remark that was recorded and aired near the end of the show. A statement was made that was disparaging of another team. The phrasing of the comment was unfortunate, unnecessary, and unsportsmanlike. It reflects poorly on the values we, and all of FIRST, try to embody. For us, it cast a sour note near the end of an otherwise very positive program, and we are sorry.

-dave lavery
lead engineer
Team 116 - Herndon High School and NASA Hq.

It sucked
 

I am sorry, but I thought the A&E presentation sucked. Not to diss any of teams in there. But they didn't diversify. They didn't show what FIRST was all about. They didn't show the awards (animation, chairman's, etc), the nationals, the history, the nationals, the whole excitement. I thought the program was limited and I think got people off on the wrong foot of what FIRST is. The announcer made it more look like a team Robotica competition. Better luck next time for them.

I thought the show was good. I especially liked how they looked specifically at a couple teams, and their experiences throughout the season. It was incredibly easy to relate to what Grundy went through (e.g. struggling to finish on time, running into trouble with weight limit, being mentally & physically exausted towards the ship date, etc...). A&E did an outstanding job relaying to the viewer what it is like for students and coaches to participate in FIRST.

On the other hand, I think A&E could have done more to show what FIRST is all about. Keeping in mind that it is an entertainment show and not a documentary, and especially that the show is labeled "The Competiton," I cannot complain about their approach (I thought it was great for the most part). However, it would have been nice if they took a minute or two to make it clear that FIRST is not just a competiton (it isn't just "all about winning", as they quoted a student saying early in the show). FIRST is a way of inspiring students (and the general public) to figure out something they want to do in life, and to look at technology in a different light. Instead A&E seemed to highlight some more negative aspects of teams (I seem to recall terms such as "morons!" and other similar comments among teams)... While in reality the competitions are still 99% graciously professional.

Although the A&E show was nice, let's hope next years game will allow us to get a lot more publicity, and that we can do better than being compared to people who make chicken noises.

Patrick

Well, I think it was a pretty good show but they cut most of the best parts... especially 2 really emotional talks about how first has impacted us and how it has changed my life.
and I dident know I sounded like that!!!

but on the morons thing... our team uses that not as a discourageing/degreading word..but more of a joke than anything.. its one of those things that starts at 430 in the morning and just never stops... know what I mean?

and dave ill relay your words to the stradigie guy on our team...

but all in all i think it was a nice show... and its a good last bang for the grundy team.... this will be their last year... politics has gotten in the way of having the team and nobody except for a very select few adults and all of the kids wants it.. but I hope to start a team at the community college and continue the tradition at least in the area.

did I mention that i dident know I sounded like that?

It was alright
 

I enjoyed watching the A&E program. I also agree that they could have done more to show what FIRST is really about and not just a competition. I also think someone should have informed A&E that FIRST is all about being graciously professional, maybe they wouldn't have aired that end part. But, I've heard far more than 'morons' in the alliance station. A&E was just showing what happens, and that did happen a lot, teams wouldn't corporate and it just messed everything up.

Our team can also relate to one of our advisors being sick, the teachers husband was sick and didn't have a voice for a while. But we pulled through pretty good. But look at the bright side, FIRST finally got some publicity.

If you didn't see the program, you can order the tape by calling
1-800-423-1212 or order online at AandE.com/store.

Re: It was alright
 

I get my points across best when I'm blunt, so here I go...

Your point about someone telling A&E about gracious professionalism is misplaced. Someone should tell all the teams & individuals about it. The producer didn't manufacture those comments, people said them. They were a part of the competition and the producer has a right to use them. Maybe the individuals should have restrained themselves better.

The fact about comments like that is most, if not all of us, (myself included) have thought or verbalized similar feelings. We get caught up in the moment and think, say, or do things we shouldn't. We're not perfect, and I don't think we should try to pretend we are. If someone unintentionally does or says something out of line at a competition, accept their apology and go on :)

Mike

Sadly..I missed the show..
 

I totally missed watching the program. I had planned on watching it, so I never thought to set up my VCR to tape it. I regret that now. My parents got the great idea of going down to Palm Beach Gardens around noon, so, instead of being at home watching the show, I was at Office Depot with my family looking for memory for my dad's Palm. Fun fun. Oh well. I hope someone around here taped it...

~Angela who now knows to always program her VCR, even when she thinks she'll be home to watch a program

I have to say I agree with you Mike on this one. I drove for team 69 for three years, in FIRST for 4 and still going - I'm one of the most die hard FIRST-a-holics as anyone who knows me will tell you. I try more than anything to stick to Gracious Professionalism...and although you dont mean to, sometimes things slip out in the "heat of battle" it's happened to me, I will admit to it. Happened more than once.

If A&E had manufactured the sound bytes, fine, I'd have an issue with it. But as it was, things like that are also part of the competition. You apologize and move on.

Though from what Justin said, I think it would have been nice for them to put the interviews where it really showed how FIRST was changing lives. But really - it was A&E's first try. I for one hope they come back to try again. :cool:

I really wish they hadn't put the turkey calling thing at the end though ;) The rowboats were fine...but turkeys?? :p

~ lora

You have a point their Mike
 

I never really thought of it that way, you are very right Mike. It is the teams fault, A&E was just showing how competition is. Some people do say stuff they don't want to say in the heat of the moment, I know our driver said some stuff he shouldn't have. I apologize for not thinking before posting, but you have a real point there Mike, I admit my mistake.

The gracious professionalism comments, meetings, and general display did happen.. many times actually.. and very few were filmed... and evean fewer of those that were filmed actually made it into the program.... also there were at least 4 interviews where emotions ran really high about the goals and morals of frist and what it means to the kids and to the adults... thiese aslo were cut and pasted into the documentery...

I'm sorry
 

Although I was unable to view the entire A&E program, I have been informed that some of my actions were not "nice" and not whta FIRST is all about. I understand the sportsmanship and cooperation FIRST tries to convey and wishes its competitors to practice. As many people have already stated, in the heat of battle and under the stress of competition things slip out, and unfortunately for me it happened on national television. I would like to extend my heart felt apologizes to Team 388 and their strategists. Thank you and God bless.
Justin "Hertz" Hirt

Time for my two cents....
 

As the driver for Team 122 I got a few interviews with the A&E Crew. I can tell you that the interviewer from A&E was not looking for gracious professionalism. He would ask questions like (all quotes are paraphrased, btw),

"So after winning last year, do you think you'll come out on top this year??"
My responce - "I don't really know, I'd like to, but right now I'm just really happy to have made it this far and to have learned so much."
A&E - "but don't you really just want to go out there and win??"
Me - "Not really, I just want to go out there and hopefully show off all that our robot can do (which never ending up happening at VCU, btw)."

This kept going on and on. A&E would try to get me to say that I wanted to crush the other teams, I would always try to give the gracious professional answer. Needless to say, I was not in the show. ;)

In conclusion, they were looking for exactly what they said they were - The Competition. Gracious professionalism does not (however unfortunate that may be) fall into that category. As for T166 and the comments aired, I don't think that there's a FIRSTer out there who doesn't understand and empithize with you. This episode about FIRST is a good start, but I see it as merely the beginning. Next year let's hope that there's a game that they can explain (although I must say that Jeff Seaton did a wonderful job trying! Go Jeff!). Thank you all, and good night.

~Tom~, who has gotten off his soapbox but thought that his comments should really be heard.

P.S. I just wanted to add on and say that I've heard from others that Grundy is a great group of guys (and gals, don't wanna leave you out) and I can personally vouch for Herndon. I had a great time with you all up in DC.

I respectfully disagree with the last post. I don think they were looking for teams that were going head to head battling. They were just trying to show the essence of what the competition is. I agree that they cut out some stuff they shouldnt have, but it still shows first in a good light.

As far as the one un gracious comment, I say this: we all do it. How many times have you talked with your team in planning meetings about who you would pick. I am sure that everyone doesnt go into the finals as one of the top four seeds with smiles and candycanes in their hands. No, they go into it ecited, hyper, and full of energy. If you did notice, it was the first time they were in that position. MY team was #1 seed. We had our list planned before the qualifications were over. That way we didnt have to stress out.

Anyways, to get to my point--- I think that we should all just let it go. I am sure the guy who made those comments already feels bad enogh. Everyone makes mistakes, just let it go.

I think thats what i was trying to say. ANyways, I hope i got at least one point across.:confused: oh well?!

Gabe Goldman
Head of Design Team; Public Relations Manager
J.R. Tucker Robotics

OH yeah. I forgot to say.

I remember hanging out with some of the Grundy peeps in 1999. They are really nice people. SO i can vouche for them too.


GRUNDY---YOU GUYS ROCK. (especially those wheels you had.. they rocked too.)


Gabe Goldman
Head of Design Team; Public Relations Manager
J.R.Tucker Robotics Team

I watched it last night round 11, and then when it was over I couldnt get to sleep so I threw in some UTC 2000 footage.....

But seriously, I thought it was very good. Finally, someone can explain the game! Sure, it took 8 months since its release, but I think A & E really hit it on the head, by focusing on scoring & balancing, and keeping the time multipliers & alliances on the backburner.

I really liked how they focused on Grundy and made them into the "root for the underdog" team. Teams like that are overlooked a lot, and it was good to see them contrasted with the NASA team, and furthermore, watch the NASA team be contrasted with even bigger teams, like Metal in Motion & Gila Monstors, who both just seemed like this impending force throughout the entire show. (Which, when you're a rookie team, thats what teams like that look like to you anyway.)

I also would like to see more than just the robot building & competing, but I rather feel that all you can really fit in a quality fashion in less than an hour is, well, the robot.

But all in all, if I had 45 min to show a video on FIRST, I think that would be a good one to show; it's like having newer ESPN footage.

Given what the show is about, I think that we got about the best treatment possible. The official A&E description of "The Competition" says:

"Terry Bradshaw, will take viewers inside the action of some of the country's most outlandish competitions to meet the people whose passion reveals a lot about America. Through colorful interviews and in-depth coverage of the players, The Competition explores these contests and the people who enter them with one goal in mind: winning."

With that as their focus, we can't be surprised that they concentrated on the regional competition event itself, and de-emphasized some of the more important elements of FIRST. Overall, I think that the show portrayed FIRST in a good light, and did a lot to promote FIRST. All the comments I have heard so far from non-FIRSTers (i.e. all my neighbors that I made watch the show so they would finally understand what we were doing all those times in my garage at 1:00 in the morning in the middle of February), have been very positive.

-dave

RE: Jess' Comment about the ESPN Footage...
 

Okay,

I don't know if folks have ever seen the ESPN footage...and maybe some years are better than others but....I have the 1996 footage...and it is _horrible_. The ESPN people are complete morons...and you get the impression they are just covering it because they were assigned to, they don't really care at all about FIRST. There's no excitement to thier voices, nothing. It is also so cut up that it really slows down a match. If they had just showed a few complete 2 minutes matches it would have demonstrated the real excitement of FIRST. I've always thought that the 1996 game was one of the most exciting ever....and I watched the ESPN coverage of 96 I wondered what I was watching...because it wasn't the Hexagon Havoc I saw that's for sure. I haven't seen A+E yet...but i think we should all be glad ESPN isn't butchering FIRST anymore.

-Justin

Cable went out where i am and i missed it (i sware the cable company is out to get me) :(

Oh well, hopefully they will show it again, so i can put more then static on this tape.

I saw the first 5 mins and the last 2 or so and from what i saw they did a good job, but 7 mins isn't enough to base that on.

ive heard a lot about the espn coverage, and mostly its been bad. but still, im curious cuz i never saw it. do you happen to know if its available anywhere. did anyone digitalize it by any chance?

I was shown the ESPN footage in high school (i'm not sure whether it footage from the '96 or '97 season), and that's what got me to sign up for a FIRST team. Hey, it's a lot better than nothing. We showed the ESPN footage in classes this past fall to get students to join our team. I think the A&E footage will be good to show to classes as well.

Patrick

I saw all but the first 4 mins. of the video and i have to say i loved it. All of the other videos made arent nearly as well done. What i really liked was the fact that they showed how hard the game really is, and how tough its is to win. I didnt like the fact that they didnt show much about the spirit of first, but thats not what the general public cares about and they make the show for the general public. I think the best video is the one first made and was shown numerous times on TV last year. They showed it during lunch at kickoffs, then later on, on Discovery Science. They also had it available for teams to get for recuitng money people and other teams. But as far as videos done by TV this was one of the best.


Andrew

Pleasantly Surprised.
 

Hello Everyone,

I watched the A+E Special today, after having taped it yesterday. I was pleasantly surprised. After my rant about ESPN. I think that A+E did a pretty fair job covering the event. I think that we all need to keep in mind that FIRST is a massive organization, program, with a lot of missions, goals, etc. A FIRST competition is 3 days worth of robots playing complex games, executing complex strategies. Sorry if I offend any athleetes out there but in comparison a sporting event might be simple to cover. That being taken into account I think that A+E did a good job because the focused not on just the competition or just the building but really provided a good look at how you go from, that time that every FIRST team (rookie or vet) knows, crunch time to fielding a robot. They did a reasonably okay job with the matches. I still think that they were to cut up and really created a slower feeling to them...maybe that is just because a FIRST comp is always more exciting when you are there watching a couple hundered ppl scream @ the top of thier lungs in support of robots. All in all tho...my hats of to A+E for a very nice portral of FIRST. Anyone who could make this years game look even semi-exciting/fast paced on TV....deserves a round of aplause. ;) (come on I had to get @ least one chepshot on the came in :p )

-Justin

Does anybody else find it a little odd that A&E didn't even have a few words with Dean or any other FIRST rep???
Also why was nothing mentioned about the Nationals?? It seemed like the Va. finals was the last step in the Competition.

Other than that I found so much of that show true to life. Like having people who were near exhastion or sick near the last days, or finishing the Bot hours before shipping or still fixing it at the comps. Or what about the many Bad Alliances or Bad luck; ie. a black ball getting stuck under the bridge and nothing we could do about it!!!!


Overall it was a good presentation about FIRST and even if it wasn't the best coverage as some of you seem to think, Some coverage is better than none at all!!:)

I agree about that. Fixing the robot in the pits always seems to be a big part of the competition.

Black ball stuck under the bridge is bad luck? I think one of an alliance member's adult advisors hitting the big red stop button and losing all the points for the match is bad luck :(

To answer a few questions,

They did have footage of some bad aliances and such.. but they dident put it in...

and disney wouldent let them come to nationals,

the reason for no footage of dean or woody is that they were only at the va. regional and dean and woody werent there.

Justin Stiltner
Team #388
Epsilon
Grundy Va,

Now for me to add my own comments on ESPN coverage..

I didn't start out in FIRST when I was in ninth grade like most people. I started in FIRST in 7th grade. I didn't even want to do it. My dad was the teacher representative from MCHS and dragged me to the meetings. One day when I was in sixth grade he brought home a video of a bunch of kids acting like idiots all over EPCOT and driving little robots all over the place to earn score. He also showed me what I believe was a team's Chairman's Award submission. Then I got interested. Soon my dad had copies of all sorts of competitions and we watched the nats of 97 on ESPN that April. I fell in love with FIRST. I didn't care that the coverage was bad or that they didn't show all of the mathes. To my seventh grade mind, it was the most awesome competition I had ever seen before. ESPN doesn't air the competitions for the sole purpose of those of us who missed competitions to watch them, but also to get kids (of all ages..eg engineers..oops! did I say that out loud?) interested in it. You could have the worst video coverage you could imagine and it would still inspire someone to want to get involved.

~Angela who never thought she would say that much, but oh well..she's got half an hour of class left

Re: A&E after thought
 

DEAD THREAD REVIVIAL!!!!
YAYYYYY!!!!! :p

Anywho...

I just picked up this video tape on Ebay.

I didn't remember it being from soooo long ago. 2001 seems so far away!
(My first year in FIRST was back in 2001)

If anyone ever gets a chance to pick up a copy of this, it's still one of the coolest specials a TV network ever did for FIRST.

Re: A&E after thought
 

I have a copy of that special too. I thought it was a pretty good special too. How long did you look for this old thread?

Re: A&E after thought
 

At first I was disappointed I missed it for a robotics meeting, than I realized it didn't come on last night, it came on back in the day before I knew about robots. If anybody could host a copy for people to stream I think it would be neat seeing as almost everybody on an FRC team as a student currently has probably not seen it since it was before our times.

Pavan.

Re: A&E after thought
 

Didn't take me too long to find it. I replied to it when it was originally started way back when, so I just remembered that and did a search for "A&E".

I didn't even open my copy of it, nor do I even plan on doing it unless I really have to.
I think I taped it back in the day, but you go around CD mentioning making a copy of stuff for everyone (hard copy, or digital copy) and people go all crazy with quoting copyright laws and what not.

It may still be available from A&E on their website as a stream, or we could always write in a campaign to request it to be played again a few times so more people can see it.

Or you can just buy the video. Mine was purchased for less than 7 bucks on ebay. lol

Re: A&E after thought
 

I have this on tape somewhere in the archives (read: my parents' basement). I bought it from A&E right after it aired, and used it as a recruiting tool when I was starting my high school team for the 2002 season.

You can still buy it directly from A&E, who will burn it to a DVD+R for $25 (including shipping). http://store.aetv.com/html/product/index.jhtml?id=74274

Oh, and the last two minutes are not to be missed (those who have seen the video will know what I mean)!