Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

I predict we will soon need a separate thread dedicated to Hellraiser 'bots, similar to the KoH 'bot thread from the 2003 FRC game.

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

Oh yeh, definatly a fun field. There will be a lot of innovative designs in this one. Of course I've already designed a bot what with capabilites to score and lift hurrah.
But the new team will be the ones doing the designing...I'm taking a bit of a coaching role for the new TFC team.

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

ok, well I'm just allowed to help them figure out how to make something work after they come up with the inital design. So once they know what they want the robot to do, I help them figure out the how.

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

Folks - FYI - I went to Walmart (the supplier named in the FVC Hangin'-A-Round Bill of Materials) to get some softballs. Guess what - My local stores aren't stocking softballs right now - Not a one in the store. Softball and baseball equipment is stocked only seasonally, and this is not softball season. Grrrrr :-(

I wonder how many Walmarts in similar or farther North latitudes/locations across North America have similar policies. The BoM might benefit from a wee edit....

So I went to Modell's - Expensive and uninspiring selection.

So I went to Dick's - Found a bucket of twenty-four 11" "Official" white softballs for $50 (That's about $2/ball). They tried to charge me $60, but the tag on the bucket's handle said $50. I wanted yellow balls, but all of the yellow ones were 12" balls.

Blake

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

Same problem up here in Connecticut. Had to go to Dick's too. I found individual yellow 11" 'fast pitch' Wilson balls at $4.50 each. The Worth 'slow pitch' balls were white and $5.50.

Anyone know if there's a weight difference between fast pitch and slow pitch softballs???? :confused:

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

I did some Googling and found this site - http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2001/WilliamPoon.shtml - It cites a couple of regulations for the mass of an 11" ball. Of course one of them is from a manual that is only distributed in printed form and the URL for the other is a dead link.

The citations list two mass ranges for 11" balls: 165-175 grams and 167-174 grams. Both pertinent citations say the 11" ball circumference should be 11" +/- 1/8"

More to your point - I did not find a specified difference between balls used in slow, fast or modified pitch games. However, that could be because I didn't find any much of anything useful on the subject. Who out there is better at picking search terms than I?

There seem to a zillion variations in ball construction (including the zillion that Worth offers); and the specs commonly used to separate balls seem to be Circumference, Coefficient of Restitution (COR), Lbs of force required to achieve a specific deformation, Cover material used, Stitching used, and Core material.

Apparently ball mass is not something that players use to separate one ball type from another.

Bottom line(s):

• Get an 11" ball, not a 12" or larger.

• If Worth makes only one ball that matches the vague spec in the FVC BoM, it isn't obvious on the Worth web site.

• Cross your fingers and don't spend too much money just yet...(I haven't opened my $50 bucket of balls yet.)

• I think the Hangin' Around BoM needs a bit of improvement (Such as a more precise ball spec or an explicit confirmation that the vagueness is intentional).

Blake

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

wow. what a great game. i love it. its the last 3 years of FRC with some extra twists. huge thumbs up to the FVC GDC

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

Thanks Blake,

My main concerns were mass, there weren't any weights listed on the packaging, and the composition differences between slow and fast pitch balls. I'm sure it's an issue of energy transfer. Slow pitch balls are probably slightly "harder" so they preform similarly to fast pitch balls which are being thrown with higher energy. Slow pitch balls will transfer energy a little better than fast pitch balls. In this game it shouldn't matter, other than if there had been a weight difference.

The other factor that might be important to some teams would be color. The manual references the high visibility yellow balls, not white. If a team wants to use a light sensor to key in on the balls, there would be a difference in signal between white and yellow balls, and it would also allow contrast between the white field lines and the balls.

I'll also agree that this year's game is great!!! Thanks GDC!! :D

I'm always a fan of large size scoring pieces for vex. That atlas ball is even bigger than I'd expect. Very cool. :cool:

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

I would add cover material and stitching to the the list of variables that can have a noticeable effect on robot performance/design.

Unless standardized, the ball covers encountered in competitions can have different friction and "give" when some ball pick-up or handling mechanisms try to rub, squeeze or bite into them.

Similarly, I think the different stitching approaches available can have a non-trivial effect on ball pick-up and handling.

Blake

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

I couldn't agree more.
My daughter is a softball pitcher and they need to know what brand ball they will use before the season. Not only is there a huge difference in the height of the stitching, the actual texture of the ball can be vastly different.

I recall last year, certain used racquetballs would not be picked up by our bot due to their smoothed shell.

Softball brand will need to be specified before experimenting with the bot.

Mark
FVC160

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

You might not want to count on that. Many previous FIRST game pieces have included some minor variation in features; this variation has been considered part of the challenge, not grounds for replacing the gamepiece. For example, if the gamepiece specification in the manual only calls out circumference, then the circumference is the only feature you can count on when designing your robot.

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

those looking for ball information... direct from FIRST procurement folks:

the "official tournament" softballs are optic yellow, cork core, 11", 0.44 COR, 375 lb compression from Worth, part # YWCS11. It is labeled as a "Retail recreational softball"

The field BOM will be updated accordingly.

However, nearly any 11" circumference softball will do for testing and practice. Also, please remember that there may be slight variances in softballs, even from ball to ball (as well as other field components), and teams need to design to accommodate this.

In the future, any FVC team desiring an official answers needs to use the FVC Q&A as directed in the game manual. It's located here:
http://forums.usfirst.org/forumdisplay.php?f=35

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

I just tried that link, and I didn't have permissions to see the forum (while logged in as the FRC Q&A username). Is this how things are supposed to be?

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

I had the same problem. I had to send an email to the webmaster a few days ago and the problem has now been cleared up.

Mike

Re: Hangin'-A-Round -- Official Game Discussion
 

I just saw something that JVN posted on the VexForum about the '06-'07 FVC Game. I thought it was pretty cool so here it is,
I just thought that summed it all up, and pretty much put my thoughts into words...lol. I think this will be a great game!