Rules Questions
 

It says in the rules that,
Also,
My question is, if you place an opponent's ringer over another one of their ringers, is the first still negated?

Re: Rules Questions
 

The real question is, if the opponent has, let's say, eight in a row. Is it possible to take the ten penalty points to place their own ringer over another (negating both ringers) to lower their score?

Re: Rules Questions
 

Yours is negated....theirs still counts and you still get the penalty

my $.02 (hehe didnt see the post below when i edited)

Re: Rules Questions
 

Only the ringer you put on is negated, as per the first part of the rule. If you put a ringer over one of your opponents ringers, regardless of its color, your ringer doesn't count, but your opponents rigner still counts.

Re: Rules Questions
 

After reading through G15 (posted in the first post of this thread), it seems to read assuming you are placing your own ringer. The possibility of hanging your opponents ringer isn't really addressed as far as cancelling that leg.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Does anyone know if it is possible to drop a "ramp" of some sorts in the Home Zone say during auto and complete the remainder of the match? There seems to be conflicting rules saying that we can deploy mechanisms inside the home zone but another rule states that leaving mechanisms behind is a penalty....

Is the FIRST Q&A up?

Re: Rules Questions
 

can you be touching the back wall and still get the levitation bonus points?

Re: Rules Questions
 

no, must not be touching any element of the field...

Re: Rules Questions
 

where'd you read that?

Re: Rules Questions
 

What confuses me is the terms in bold above... First they say you may not leave multiple parts, and then they talk about penalties for single (an intentionally detached component or mechanism) parts...

Regardless, it seems as long as your component does not "impede access to the RACK or an ALLIANCE ROBOT," the 10-point penalty may be worth the risk. Then again, is it truly in the spirit of FIRST to intentionally earn a penalty to win the game;)

Re: Rules Questions
 

Re: Rules Questions
 

thanks for clarification

Re: Rules Questions
 

exactly what i was thinking. just not sure if we can deliberately leave something in the home zone, which would not impede movement of any other robots. there is a specific rule stating we cant do it on the field but no clarification in the zone. i think itll b well worth the risk.....who knows well see

Re: Rules Questions
 

Question...

If a robot becomes disabled while in the opponent's home zone and thus unable to leave during the End Game period, will there be a penalty assessed?

If the problem is electrical then I don't see why one should be, but what if you had a safety violation and the referees disabled you while there?

What if you purposely disable your robot with the E-stop while in the opponent's home zone as an attempt to interfere? (this would be against the spirit of FIRST, but I want it clarified so that it won't happen in a match)

Re: Rules Questions
 

Does anyone know anything about the "STINGER" besides the fact that it's a small rubber tube attached to the back of a SPIDER FOOT.

There was something about it in the Kickoff demonstration. One of the RINGERS was stuck on a rubber tube and they said it wouldn't have counted until it was all the way on the SPIDER LEG. I don't remember if this is exactly what they said about it. The manual mentions the STINGER briefly at the end of 6.2.2 (The Arena, The Rack).

A few questions regarding the rules
 

Hello,
We read through the manual, and didn't find any good answers to these questions (sorry if any have been asked before - I didn't see them):
- Seeing as the leg sets are numbered 1 through 8, is a "reach-around" allowed? for example, does having 7-8-1-2 in one height count as four in a row or two rows of two in a row?
- For purposes of seeing what's going on in the other side of the field, are we allowed to connect the feed from the robot's camera to a monitor in our driver's control panel?
- Are we allowed to pull the opposing alliance's ringers of a "leg"? Or are we only allowed to manipulate their spoilers?
- Is the coach allowed to have a laptop/tabelt pcs/palm pilots with him when he is with the drivers during a match?

Thanks,
Guy,
Team 8

Re: Rules Questions
 

The tube needs to be supported by the spider leg, and not the stinger. The stinger prevents tubes from being unintentionally descored.

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

My team is also wondering the same thing. I also haven't found the answer on here yet.

krissy
team 281

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

Your second and third questions are specifically addressed in the Game and Robot section of the rules (since I encourage you to read this thoroughly and completely, I won't point you to the exact rule number). As a hint, I will tell you that the camera as it comes in the kit cannot transmit a video signal and a custom circuit would need to be created to do so. Your other questions may be there as well, but if they aren't they should be directed towards the official Q&A forum for an official answer. Any answer you get here that isn't directly quoting a rule from the manual should be considered speculation.

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

1. There are no rules regarding wrap around. I assume this will be covered in an update, until then assume there is NO wraparound.
2. No idea.
3. Once ringers are on the rack, they may not be removed, doing so incurs a 10 pt penalty. Only spoilers may be moved about the rack.
4. I believe so, but again, best to wait for clarification.

Re: Rules Questions
 

do u get points for rows if u have a two row on 7 and 8 and then on 1?

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

ok. thanks.

Re: Rules Questions
 

No, if your robot is unable to leave the zone for being disabled, you will not incur the 10 pt penalty.

The demo made it appear that the referees made the call on disabling, especially in instances of danger. If you disabled in the opponent's home zone for no emergency, you will incur a penalty.

Re: Rules Questions
 

This will probably be clarified in an update, but for now assume you will not.

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

If there was a wrap around, there wouldn't need to be a need for the numbers. I'm guessing there is no wrap around. The points start at 1, and go to 8.

Re: Rules Questions
 

How much of the robot needs to be off the ground? The whole thing meaning Drive system and all or can there be a pneumatic lift under the robot and that would be the only device touching once everything is lifted up?

Chances are the question has been asked so if the answer is there just say so and I'll search for it =).

Re: Rules Questions
 

I think it will be addressed in an update, but that they will most likely count as a row of 3 because regardless of the numbers, they are still adjacent.

Re: Rules Questions
 

I'm not sure why you would assume you can't wrap around. As far as I can tell, the numbering is not mentioned at all in the rules, and is only used by the referees to assist them in scoring.

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

As far as I can tell, the number are used to help the scorers (so they can easily tell which column to mark on their scoresheets as they are counting). If you read the game section of the rules, you will notice that the numbering isn't mentioned at all in describing rows. Only the word "adjacent" is used. Since 1 is adjacent to 8, I would assume that there IS wraparound.

However, any answer is pure speculation until an official answer (either in a Q&A or rule update) is released.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Yeah for the robot thing, if u were to persay have a similar design to the wildstang 2001, where the ramp is touching the ground, but the robot on top of the ramp is not, you would still receive bonus points correct

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

If there were a wrap-around then it would be possible for an infinite row (8 RINGERS all the way around). This could get you the highest score of all time:D
But most likely the counting starts at 1 and ends at 8 (with no wrap-around).

If they update it so wrap-around is included they would probably need a rule that states that rows end at 8 RINGERS.

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

The numbers on the racks are for scoring. Refs this year will be using palm pilots to score and the numbers are just a reference. If you think of it logically depending on the inital orientation of the rack it would give a disadvantage to the team that is closest to the 1/8 merger row.

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

We looked around some more and found:
1. No ruling about it yet.
2. R79 says we can connect a laptop to get 'feedback' from the robot. The question is, does feedback refer to technical data, like values from the PWM, voltages, etc., or does it also refer to the video from the CMUcam?
3. Also found it ourselves in a second reading, but thanks to DCA fan for #3.
4. I would assume that since we can connect it to get feedback, we could also run other programs on it? Or is it an incorrect assumption?

Thanks,
Guy,
Team 8

Re: Rules Questions
 

at the sample competition field set-up today in Chicago kick-off event, the stinger was a short (approx. 3 inch), very flexible piece of rubber tubing. I don't see it being an obstacle, easy enough to 'push past.' I believe it is there to keep tubers from bouncy off once achieving scoring position

Re: Rules Questions
 

I found something about the STINGERS. They are 4 inches longer than the SPIDER FOOT according to the field assembly diagrams. Therefore the height of the entire SPIDER FOOT is 14 inches (1 inch longer than the inside diameter of the RINGERS). Luckily the STINGER is flexible.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Just erring on the side of caution. Personally I think it will be okay, but since it's not explicitly stated, I tend to say no until they say yes.

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

Look at R63 and R66. Since the robot controller does not have the ability to broadcast video, any secondary broadcast of video would be disallowed by these rules. R109 does provide for a wireless camera to be installed in certain situations, but this rule is only specifically referring to "non functional decorations". If the camera is being used by the drivers, it could affect the outcome of the match, and is therefore functional and not a decoration (a non-functional decoration camera would only transmit to a recording device for later playback or to the event video mixer for display on the big screen).

Re: A few questions regarding the rules
 

The 2 Rules questions threads were just merged together, posts are in the order of date/time posted.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Anybody else find an error on scoring on p 11 in Sec 7? Shouldn't the Blue alliance get 44 pts?

Re: Rules Questions
 

From what my team and I can comprehend form the rulebook the stinger is used basically to keep the tubes from falling off. In the demonstration the robot had the tube caught on the stinger in front of the spider leg so it couldn't be scored until it was placed over the stinger.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Yes.
Row of 5: 32
Row of 3: 8
Singletons: 2x2
Total: 44

Good catch.

Re: Rules Questions
 

The stingers are only there to prevent the tubes from falling off in the case of shaking. The rule states that the tube must be over the stinger to count, all other instances (ie hanging on the circular plate) will not count as scoring.

Re: Rules Questions
 

If you watch the animation, you will see that red has ringers on 7 and 8. A robot adds one in the same row on 1, and Dave says that the robot "places another ringer, extending the row to three." As such, I would say that you should assume that you WILL.

Edit: Also, if you look at the scoring at the end, the grid has been drawn such that 7 is the first column. It looks like the numbers don't matter for the purposes of competitors, just refs.

Re: Rules Questions
 

I think they mean that you can drop a part at the end, but not in the beginning. Because if you were pinned at the other side of the field, and your ramps were in the home zone, it wouldn't seem fair that you would get the points for part of YOUR bot

In regards to the negation question, my team can't find anything in the rules that says you cannot do that, but the circumstances would have to be right in order for the point loss to be worth anything

Re: Rules Questions
 

The zone is part of the field. Detaching a part within the zone is included when <G40> states that detachment is not allowed.

I can't find the rule, but isn't it illegal for coaches to communicate with people outside of the alliance players/drivers? This wouldn't be allowed because the referee can't be sure the coach isn't using it for communication.

This wouldn't be speculation. Scoring is described by <G54>:

The rules define ROW in 7.2.1:

If 8 and 1 are both scored at the same level, they meet the only conditions needed to be scored as a row (legs are adjacent).

Re: Rules Questions
 

<G56> ROBOTS in HOME ZONE - ROBOTS score bonus points at the end of the match if they are entirely in their HOME ZONE, not in contact with any element of the field (carpet, alliance station, goal etc.) and the lowest point of the ROBOT is higher than 4 inches and/or 10 inches above the carpeted field surface. The number of bonus points an ALLIANCE
receives is based on the total number of ROBOTS satisfying these conditions. Each ALLIANCE ROBOT entirely in their HOME ZONE at the end of the match is eligible to receive the following bonus points:
Each ROBOT between 0 and 3.9 inches above floor level - 0 bonus points
Each ROBOT between 4.0 and 11.9 inches above floor level - 15 bonus points
Each ROBOT 12.0 inches or more above floor level - 30 bonus points

Is it 10 or 12?

Re: Rules Questions
 

now all this talk about dropping ramps in the end zone has me wondering...

wouldn't the ramp be considered part of your robot, and therefore, if you were to be on top of the ramp at the end of the match, the lowest part of your robot (the ramp) would be touching the ground and would therefore be useless:confused:

Re: Rules Questions
 

12, the first is a typo. They said very clearly 12 in the kick off broadcast

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Right--you're not getting all three off of the ground.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Good catch. And what if you're 3.900...1-3.999... they don't account for that 1/10 of an inch... I mean, sure they may give it to you, but what's the OFFICIAL ruling???

Re: Rules Questions
 

I was discussing this with my team mates. If you deployed a sort of ramp, the ROBOT THAT DEPLOYED the ramps, would most likely NOT be counted for the final bonus points. If you can litterally DROP a ramp, and if another team made did the same, then you got on that ramp, then all bots would be counted.

Re: Rules Questions
 

if you may not touch any part of the field then it is practically impossible to get all 3 robots of the ground

Re: Rules Questions
 

now as far as the wrap-around topic... I'm seeing it as the numbers are simply just for reference purposes and that if you have 7,8,1 that would qualify as a row of three because, as stated once earlier, they're still adjacent tubes.

Boy, they sure are making it tough for an Excel score-sheet this year... Time to get to work...

Re: Rules Questions
 

If you are carrying an inner tube, let's say using the vacuum pump, and another robot in passing knocked the tube out of your possesion, would that count as removing possesion from a team, will the 10 pt penalty be assesed? <G36>

Re: Rules Questions
 

It is thus impossible without thrusters to get all three robots off the ground. It is highly improbable that even two will get off the ground, although it is indeed possible. The only way you could get two robots off the ground would be to have both drop ramps and move to the other's ramp. This would not work for two reasons.

First, the ramps deployed would still count as part of the robot, so the lowest point of both robots would be touching the ground, so neither of them would be scored. Second, even if you deployed some sort of ramp, you would be intentionally detaching parts, which is a penalty. I think it goes against the spirit of FIRST to suffer penalties on purpose. (Even though getting another robot off the ground high enough could push your alliance into net positive points)

Re: Rules Questions
 

We almost need a separate rule question forum.....

I'm about to go to the shop to inventory the kit, but I kinda wanted to bring attention to another rule question before I left. It's about how to get rings into play.

That, and "rack" seems to mean both the tubes in the home zones and the actual goal too.

Heres the link.

Re: Rules Questions
 

one way you could get to robots off the ground would be to have 1 robot deploy 2 rams, one on each side, but still connected to the robot, and have the other 2 robots drive up on top of them

my only thought to get 60 bonus points would be to have 1 robot that could deploy 2 ramps then raise them to 12 inches once his opponents are on them
but i remember, in our meting today, hearing something about robots no being able to drive up on top of their opponents but i heard it from a mentor not from an official document so this statement may be false.

Re: Rules Questions
 

INPROTANT!!!!

Lets say we are blue. the red team has 8 in a row. if we as the blue team take off 1 or 2 of there tubes and place them somewhere else. Does that dusrupt there row?

and can you carry around the oposite tube color so that the other team can't use it?

Re: Rules Questions
 

Here's a question about keepers:

Can we "repossess" keepers after they have been dropped? In other words, after they have been dropped, can we "herd" them around on the floor or pick them up if they are in an inconvenient spot for example.

Re: Rules Questions
 

It doesn't matter if you take them off, once they are scored they are scored for that alliance.

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My guess is that the referee would judge whether you did it intentionally or not. If you kept ramming them until the tube fell off then I think you'd get the penalty, but if you hit them once and it fell off I don't think you would.

Re: Rules Questions
 

So even during the game once it is there it is there even if you move the tube in the middle of the game?

Re: Rules Questions
 

Yes, as the rule says, once it is hanging it stays that way, even if taken off accidentally or intentionally.

If you do it accidentally you lose 10 pts, if you are doing it intentionally you will be DQ'd and get 0 points for the match.

Re: Rules Questions
 

ok what if you put on the other teams tubes. do you get DQ on that?

Re: Rules Questions
 

There's no reason that two robots can't fit on top of one robot.

Check <G20>. If you de-score a keeper or ringer intentionally, you will be disqualified. Doing that accidentally will result in a 10 point penalty. In both cases, the keeper or ringer is still counted as scored.

EDIT: Sorry, answers were posted while I was typing.

Re: Rules Questions
 

These rules are all right next to each other in Section 7 of the FRC Manual, The Game, go check it out and all your questions will be answered and you won't have to keep asking here.

Re: Rules Questions
 

I'm interested in a clarification of rule <G40>
"<G40> Detaching mechanisms - ROBOTS may not intentionally detach parts or leave multiple mechanisms on the field. Violations will result in a 10-point penalty per incident. If an intentionally detached component or mechanism significantly impedes access to the RACK or an ALLIANCE ROBOT during the END GAME, the offending ROBOT will be disqualified from the match."

Since it says "parts or multiple mechanisms" which would lead me to believe plural, it would seem that a robot would be allowed to simply drop a ramp at the beginning of the match and let other robots climb up on it at the end. As long as it was only one ramp.

Re: Rules Questions
 

well my team 1778 has been looking in section 7 all over and we can't figure out if you are allowed to posess (carry) the oposite team tubes and or place them. In other words pick them up off the field and then place them or keep them with us. I really don't mean to ask a lot we are all having difficulty understanding the rules. there not really detiled.

Re: Rules Questions
 

<G21> SCORING for opponents - ROBOTS may not HANG a GAME PIECE of an opposing
ALLIANCE. If this rule is violated a 10-point penalty will be assessed per infraction.

It doesn't say anything about possessing them, that will have to be asked in the FIRST Q&A.

Re: Rules Questions
 

read section 8 it talks about the ramp issue in 8.3.1 page 7 <RO6>

Re: Rules Questions
 

Well put indeed. CD Etiquette people!!!

Re: Rules Questions
 

When you say drop, do you mean that a ramp is lowered and still attached to the robot, or allowed to detach from the robot? A ramp could not be intentionally detached.

Also, the manual uses the word "deploy" in a few places, but this doesn't mean "detach". You can "deploy" a ramp if it is still connected to the robot.

<G21> states:

EDIT: Ahh, every time I try to post an answer, five more posts get in while I'm typing...

Re: Rules Questions
 

I mean detach. It says "multiple" which would mean to me "more than one" which would mean to me that you can detach one ramp and leave it sitting in the HOME ZONE. I know that elsewhere in the manual this is contradicted, but I'm hoping someone has some insight on this.

Re: Rules Questions
 

FIRST Q&A enough said.

Re: Rules Questions
 

I also have a question about deploying such extending items, and if they are included in the Starting Position Maximum height, or if they can remain un deployed until the match is started.

Re: Rules Questions
 

I could not find any mention of a specific starting location for each robot... do they just have to be in the home zone?

Re: Rules Questions
 

Agreed, Q&A answer needed before we can be sure.

If you look at <G29> of last year's manual, however, it uses the same wording:



For your starting position, the extending items can be in any position you want, extended or unextended, as long as the starting position of the entire robot fits within the starting size limits.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Anybody see anything yet about driving on to one of the tubes to get 4" up? Can't intentionally damage the playing piece, but obviously you don't want to damge it because you need it to be functional. Thought in the demo video that in the corner of the screen it had a robot on top of a tube.

Re: Rules Questions
 

Somehow once you drive on it I don't believe you will be 4" high anymore... ;)
And it actually is addressed somewhat in the manual:
While this isn't really a rule, it suggests that it wouldn't be advised to drive on game pieces, and would be against the spirit of this and other rules (namely no damaging field elements).

Re: Rules Questions
 

That wording suggests that contact with game object in the possession of other robots is allowed, as long as you are not actively attempting to grasp, pull, or attach to them. So, if a gripper allow for an object to fall off easily, you should be able to bump it off.

Re: Rules Questions
 

What if another robot pops the game piece in your possesion?

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So if it's on purpose, then they might be disabled according to <G34>, or be required to remove whatever piece popped it and then be reinspected. Either way though it still counts as a normal tube.

Re: Rules Questions
 

For all the people speculatin on the multiple item on the floor, consider your robot as a seperate part. So having a ramp detached and your robot on the field would count as multiple parts deployed and in violation of that rule.

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Why would it only have to be one ramp?

Re: Rules Questions
 

multiple parts. But whatever, I can't really see much of a use for being able to do that anyhow.

Re: Rules Questions
 

It is NOT in the spirit of FIRST but to some people, even in FIRST, winning is everything and to win is to prove something to others. But this is very true in the world we live in. Numbers speak for themselves, but how you got those numbers does not matter as much.

Pavan.

Re: Rules Questions
 

I do agree with many on this, By detaching a ramp from your robot it is considered to be a part of your robot, because if it isn't then it is a violation of the rules, but there are many other ways to get a robot off the ground :p.

Also, it is impossible for all three robots to be off the field at the end of the game as at least one must lift ( and/or support) the other robots.

I do have a question though. Are we allowed to carry more than one of our own game pieces?? It may of been mentioned in the brodcast, but I was busy writing things down and may of missed it. Someone on my team told me that you couldn't and someone else told me there wasnt anything against it. Just need to clarify.

Re: Rules Questions
 

You can only be in possession of one game piece at a time. <G09>

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oh, ok thanks! Didn't even notice. I think I skipped the first few words in that rule. lol

Re: Rules Questions
 

deployed stuffs desigend to lift robots...


I dont know about you all, but depoyed sure sounds like... umm.... let me google it.



de·ploy (dĭ-ploi')

v., -ployed, -ploy·ing, -ploys.

v.tr.

To position (troops) in readiness for combat, as along a front or line.
To bring (forces or material) into action.
To base (a weapons system) in the field.
To distribute (persons or forces) systematically or strategically.
To put into use or action: “Samuel Beckett's friends suspected that he was a genius, yet no one knew . . . how his abilities would be deployed” (Richard Ellmann).
v.intr.
To be or become deployed.

deploy

verb

To put into a deliberate order: arrange, array, dispose, marshal, order, organize, range, sort, systematize. See order/disorder.


deploy
v
Definition: redistribute, station troops or weapons


The verb deploy has 2 meanings:

Meaning #1: place troops or weapons in battle formation


Meaning #2: to distribute systematically or strategically


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


anyway... deploy sounds like... to put/place. and in most of those examples, what is deployed in not connected to the thing that deployed. I think you should be able to deploy a ramp, or other lifting mechanizim... and as long as they arnt physically attached by anything more than touching... then you should be able to used deployed ramps.

In a certain game i play(not the one in sig), when i die... i get the message: deployed defences shot down pbhead! and the defences are certainly not attached to who ever deployed them...


I dont know... i think a robot should be able to make itself score those points... its kinda odd if it could not.

and that rule about mechanizims.... what i think they mean there, is that you cant have a seprate entity on the field... meaning you cant have a romote contoled crame to lift yourself up... once its disattached... it cant act like a mechanizim... so if you... say blew up a really big ballon under your robot, and then unhooked the air... and then it would elevate you, and would no longer be part of your robot... since its just a bag 0' air...


i dont know... i am stupid.

Re: Rules Questions
 

In addition to the point above about possibly getting dinged for field damage because of this, I would say that the game objects count as "elements of the field." This would mean you are in contact with an "element of the field" because you are sitting on the toroid which negates the bonus points.

Re: Rules Questions
 

can yom move the center goal? rotate?

Re: Rules Questions
 

Well FIRST is all about teamwork and sportmanship, robots were always given options for things. Like ethier build a bot that can be lifted or build a bot that can do the lifting. Its a choice, Its part of the stratagy.

Teamwork is always key, just hope you work well with your teammates lol.

Re: Rules Questions
 

If you set four game pieces on the ground next to each other and you had a light robot, they would be able to support the weight at 4".
But I'm not really sure what to make of <R37>, since that wouldn't be "pulling" but I don't know if it honors the intent of the rule.

And it's true that the "game piece" may or may not be an "element". Another thing for the Q&A.

Re: Rules Questions
 

<g33> in sec 7, pg 8 of 13. the robot can touch and bump it, but you cant just grab ahold of the thing and spin it to any advantage or defensive maneuver. pertaining to the constant debate on the bonus points, its sounding like its impossible to ge t more than 60 unless we can totally levitate, and if some 1 did levitate/hover, ill give them a box of donuts. it even says on page 4 in the introduction, rev a, "Alliances may score some additional points if, by the end of the match, their robots are in their home zone (which btw, is classified as part of the field, section 6, 6.1 overview, shows the home zones a being shown as part of the field) and have been lifted off the floor by 4" or more by ANOTHER Robot before the final buzzer sounds."

Re: Rules Questions
 

rule G35, 6th bullet, you may climb/attach to a robot of your own alliance

Re: Rules Questions
 

<R46> Items specifically PROHIBITED from use include:
 Batteries different from, or in addition to, those provided in the Kit Of Parts.
I am a little confused about this rule. Does it mean that the two batteries we have are the only ones we can bring and use? If so power management is going to be fun, especially with back to back matches.

Re: Rules Questions
 

even if some team did miraculously manage to levitate, they would have to be able to do so under NO power. Remember, all measurements are (at least usually) taken at the end of the match, after power is killed to the field. Unless you have a drive team with amazing mental capabilities (and I'm sure they would write something in the rules about that...), good luck getting a 100+ pound robot to stay in the air.

As stated earlier, FIRST is all about teamwork, they don't want ONE team to be able to do everything alone. Just remember some key terms that FIRST has coined: Co-Opertition, and of course, GRACIOUS PROFESSIONALISM! :D

Re: Rules Questions
 

um, it would most likely be more like 300 lb+, since the one levatating robot would be supporting the other 2, and if it isnt, then thats a waste, and the mind is a terrible thing to waste

Re: Rules Questions
 

also, on the 4th to last row of scoring diagrams in section 7, (the blue/blue keeper, red/red keeper), wouldnt it be scored as the color underneath, since the late keepers are ignored during scoring?