Chief Delphi - Keepers in Teleoperated mode

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Chief Delphi (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/index.php)

- Rules/Strategy (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=6)

- - Keepers in Teleoperated mode (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52738)

Spencer E.

23-02-2007 22:47

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Thanks for all the help Bharat

Spencer E.

23-02-2007 22:57

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Quote:

Originally Posted by T3_1565 (Post 585283)

I wonder.... If your auto mode ends up with you with a keeper on a leg, but you have not let go yet. Does it count when the first thing you do is drop the keeper? Do you think it would score?

Hate to burst your bubble, but:

"<G12> KEEPER scoring - A SPIDER LEG can only be SCORED with a KEEPER during the AUTONOMOUS PERIOD. At the end of the AUTONOMOUS PERIOD, any KEEPERS that are not HANGING are considered void."

Bharat Nain

23-02-2007 23:04

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Please refer to the rule below:

Quote:

<G14> Late KEEPERS - After the AUTONOMOUS PERIOD ends, ROBOTS may not HANG any
KEEPERS for the remainder of the match. Any KEEPERS that a ROBOT may POSSESS
must be immediately released and dropped to the floor. If necessary, referees may validate
placement of KEEPERS during the pause following the end of the AUTONOMOUS
PERIOD. The referees may remove any KEEPERS that are not HANGING. If a ROBOT
HANGS a KEEPER after the AUTONOMOUS PERIOD, it will result in a disqualification. If
the “late KEEPER” is placed on a SPIDER LEG on which an opposing RINGER is already
HANGING, the “late KEEPER” will be ignored during the calculation of the match score. If
the “late KEEPER” is placed on a SPIDER LEG on which a RINGER from the same alliance
is already HANGING, the two will cancel each other and both will be ignored when
determining if the SPIDER LEG is SCORED. Note: as RINGERS and SPOILERS can be
HANGING only after the end of the AUTONOMOUS PERIOD, any KEEPERS HANGING on
a SPIDER LEG after a RINGER or SPOILER will automatically be determined to be a “late
KEEPER.”

jgannon

23-02-2007 23:35

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bharat Nain (Post 585277)

If thats not the first thing you do(definition of immediate), then you will be given a penalty.

I keep hearing people talk about this supposed penalty for not immediately dropping a keeper. <G14> doesn't say anything about a penalty for not dropping, only a penalty for hanging. The Q&A that you posted doesn't say anything about a penalty, either. Can you please tell us where you're getting this information from?

Bharat Nain

23-02-2007 23:44

Re: Keepers after autonomous

You are right, there is no penalty. They told us to get rid of it immediately, but did not tell us what will happen if we do not. Thanks for the correction.

Rick-906

24-02-2007 01:19

Re: Keepers after autonomous

its not as though you can do much with it is there?
there is no real need to penalize teams for wandering around with a keeper, theyre already wasting their own time.

unless someone came up with a clever use for unscored keepers

Japper

26-02-2007 13:43

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Does the robot even have to leave the home zone or can it drop the keeper there and then position itself to load a ringer so that once automous mode is over, it is next to the ringer load chute and ready to be loaded?

Also, can team tweak their autonomous code in the pits at the regionals before the competition? (before or after robot inspection?)

akshar

26-02-2007 14:10

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Japper (Post 586611)

the robot can drop the keeper from wherever its postion is, provided it does it immediatly at the start of teleoperated period. your robot can also go wherever in autonomous, as long as it is not ramming a robot, or breaking anyother rules. autonomous can be tweaked in pits.

Tom Bottiglieri

26-02-2007 14:37

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Japper (Post 586611)

Also, can team tweak their autonomous code in the pits at the regionals before the competition? (before or after robot inspection?)

Yes. There may also be a practice field provided at your regional for this very purpose.

kawelch

27-02-2007 12:33

Re: Keepers after autonomous

There is no penalty for not dropping the keeper. It is itself the penalty. It can not be scored and you can not pick up another ringer while you have it, so you are wasting time.

http://forums.usfirst.org/showthread.php?t=5307

Quote:

According to <G14>, teams are instructed to drop a keeper immediately after autonomous. However, there is no penalty/consequence mentioned if we do not do this. What happens if a team does not drop a keeper immediately?

From GDC:
There is no explicit penalty if a Robot keeps a Keeper in its posession after the start of the Teleoperated Period, unless the Robot Hangs the Keeper. In that case, it would be a violation of <G14> and would result in a disqualification. If the Robot holds on to the Keeper but does not attempt to Hang it, the Robot is just delaying the time until it is able to take posession of a Ringer and continue play.

lancerbotics

27-02-2007 13:45

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Do you have to have a keeper on your bot during autonomous mode or can you pass on that? Our robot does not have a scoring arm to place any rings.

akshar

27-02-2007 14:21

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Quote:

Originally Posted by lancerbotics (Post 587160)

Do you have to have a keeper on your bot during autonomous mode or can you pass on that? Our robot does not have a scoring arm to place any rings.

you do not need to have a keeper during autonomous.
it was answered in the FIRST Q and A: http://forums.usfirst.org/showthread...ghlight=keeper

lancerbotics

27-02-2007 16:46

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Thanks

Kevin Kolodziej

03-03-2007 16:14

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Quote:

Originally Posted by From GDC

There is no explicit penalty if a Robot keeps a Keeper in its posession after the start of the Teleoperated Period, unless the Robot Hangs the Keeper. In that case, it would be a violation of <G14> and would result in a disqualification. If the Robot holds on to the Keeper but does not attempt to Hang it, the Robot is just delaying the time until it is able to take posession of a Ringer and continue play.

This is official from FIRST, so why was the head ref at New Jersey going ON the field after autonomous mode and removing rings from the possession of the robots?? Did I miss something? For an organization that preaches safety like crazy, I don't see how this can be viewed as a necessary action. The two instances I saw this done were during the quarter finals, and in one instance, the ref actually tipped the robot over because its grip was so good. I could not believe my eyes and am very frustrated with what I saw. Does anyone have any insight into this??

Travis Hoffman

03-03-2007 16:19

Re: Keepers after autonomous

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Kolodziej (Post 589410)

A robot actually hung the keeper after autonomous but BEFORE teleoperated period during one match at NJ. It seems the field control dudes can delay the start of the teleoperated period. After autonomous, the arm was disabled and drifted down from the middle row, dropping the keeper down to the lower row and scoring it. The refs stopped the match and forced a reset.

That head ref seemed rather agitated at having to go extract keepers from the robot death grips....

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