Re: Is Defense key to this game?
 

I'd beg to differ. Look here at this semi-final finish. That's red on the left with 60 bonus bots on top, and 8 ringers in a row on the rack, with none from blue. Score: 316 to 0. 2 great offense bots (175 & 501) and 1 strong defender (1824) providing 60 bonus points possible almost every time.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7283886@N02/417182098/

Re: Is Defense key to this game?
 

Well the fact that the opposing alliance has no ringers up shows that they must not have been that much of a threat. I know it was a semi-final match, but the red alliance had to leave the rack open at some point to get on the ramp. Wouldn't that give the other alliance a chance to put on some ringers or some spoilers. I'm just questioning the abilities of the blue alliance.

Re: Is Defense key to this game?
 

My team designed to be a fast scorer, but unfortunately we were unable to get our arm working until the end of LA, so we kept it disabled the whole time. However, our speedy mecanum drive enabled us to put up a decent defense, and if the opposing alliance only had one scorer, we were usually able to prevent them from scoring during the whole match. In one match on Friday, our alliance was unable to either score or lift, but our human player managed to score one ringer. We were able to fight off the opposing alliance's scorer and kept it 2-0 until the last two seconds when they got around us and placed a ringer =P

At LA, most of the alliances I saw in the qualifying rounds could only score a few ringers, and successful lifting nearly guaranteed winning the match. However, there were some amazing offensive bots (254/330/4 got a row of 8 during finals) and in those matches, while lifting was still important, the ringers were much more so.

Most of the defenses I saw in qualifying matches were played by rampbots of average speed. This isn't very effective against great scorers; I saw 254/968 constantly get blocked and then zip around to the other side of the rack in a split second, and 330 was usually able to push their opponents into the rack and score over them. Some alliances were able to block 254 by ganging up on them, but when they were allied with 330 they were impossible to stop. Is it possible to stop an alliance with two strong offensive bots like that?

Re: Is Defense key to this game?
 

I do believe defense is the key to this game but at GLR they made a rule where if the do not have possession of a game piece then you can only get in their way and not push them. this makes it a lot harder to play defense. I think the rule there was made because of our team if not others but we played real aggressive defense. it was disappointing that they changed the rules on the last day of competition. maybe they made this rule to have more high scoring matches?

Re: Is Defense key to this game?
 

it all depends on the alliance your facing in your current round....
in nj regional we won with a completely offensive strategy and in the nyc regional we won with strong defense and a decent ramp robot

Re: Is Defense key to this game?
 

Defense is key in this game, as much as it is in any game where there are a limited number of scores that can be achieved.

When you say "lifting takes 1 robot out for about 25 seconds, and 2 for about 15." I agree with you, based on what I've seen. When you say "in that time, the other team has the capability to beat them through tubes." I disagree strongly for several reasons:
1. It's hard enough to score undefended when you're in practice matches. Now add in the fact that you're looking at 60 points staring you in the face. Add to that typical end-game pressure, and the fact that you're making a choice to forgo your own ramps if you take too long.
2. Have teams been frequently looking at an open string of 4 on their side, just waiting for people to leave them alone so they can turn it into 64 or 128 points? Effective teams have limited the scoring opportunities on the rack. Your alliance of three that can all place a ringer in the final 20 seconds doesn't usually have the luxury of extending an already long row. There really aren't that many places left, as it turns out.
3. Even the best tube scorers I've seen haven't been perfect, and it gets worse as you get farther from the player station and there's more stuff in the way. You lose effectiveness as the spider legs fill up.
4. Your alliance now has to increase your score over 60 points to negate their ramps. It's hard enough to score 60 points on the rack, much less in the last 20 seconds of the game, with a limit on tubes available and places available.

If the rack is empty, and the defensive robots go away to get on their ramps, an alliance of 3 tube scorers gets up to 4 (with a robot that can actually score quickly enough to get 2 tubes in the last 20 seconds). 16 points. An alliance of a lifter and two amazing tube scorers in the same situation can get their 2 or 3 tubes on the rack, but how easy is it to get two robots up in the (now) <5 seconds left?

The alliance playing defense, however, has 15 seconds to waltz over to their rampbot and get 60.

I can't account for every strategy and everything that can go wrong. I've seen some quite basic arguments here, and I thought I'd give some scenarios a whirl.

Re: Is Defense key to this game?
 

A great scoring robot can get from 6 to 10 tubes by itself, as long as the opponents allow it to. At Detroit and GLR, I only saw two great scorers - 67 and 1114.

Good scoring robots can get 4 or 5 tubes themselves. I saw a dozen or so of these between DT and GL - and I'd probably forget a few, so I won't list them. 4 or 5 tubes isn't enough to offset a 60-point bonus. If 2 good scorers are combined on an alliance, they can combine to get a high score, as happened at GLR in QF2-2. Or a good scorer could get help from an alliance partner to manage 6 tubes in a row, if that partner can add 1 or 2 to the row.

Good scorers who have a good ramp-bot on their alliance can strategically scatter ringers around the rack, so that their opponents cannot get more than 4 or 5 in a row. Once that is accomplished, they can take their time getting up onto the ramp. That would be the offensive-defense strategy.

If you are up against a great scorer with a good ramp-bot, the only hope you have is to play an aggressive defense to prevent scoring. And then hope as well that you can place a few tubes and get onto your own ramp-bot. Great scorer alliances can be beat - witness SF1 at GLR.