Chief Delphi - Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

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Chief Delphi (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/index.php)

- Regional Competitions (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=10)

- - Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!! (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55293)

Josh Murphy

05-03-2007 19:02

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

I to noticed this while watching the webcasts. I don't think it is that big of a deal for the driver because there is a clock across the field that you can see.(i think or was this visible to anyone?) The audience would be the ones confused because they are looking at the progress bar.:)

SSMike

05-03-2007 19:12

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by artdutra04 (Post 590841)

If I had to choose between the progress bar and the clock, I would choose the latter. A clock is much better for forming an exact strategy, because then you know exactly how many seconds are left in the match.

But I have a solution that makes everyone happy. :p

As anyone who's familiar with iPods knows, they have both a progress bar and countdown clocks on the screen that are displayed when playing each song. A very similar concept can be adapted for use on the FRC scoreboard displays.

This would be a great idea and I think that we should use it at Competitions. It will be a lot easier for the drivers so that they can see how much time that they have left.

The only problem that I can see is that if they start doing that now, then some people who have already competed might complain.

mizscience

05-03-2007 19:52

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSMike (Post 591267)

Part of FIRST is about progression, and if the system is found lacking and is changed, it just benefits the entire FIRST community as a whole and shouldn't be cause for complaint. Yeah, anyone would be a little miffed, but hey, you can't please everyone...

But yes, there should definately be a real clock somewhere on the big screen at least.

:]

mizscience

05-03-2007 19:53

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRosser314 (Post 591183)

HMMMMM, good idea but there may be a copyright to that type of thing that apple would get mad about, if they found out.:D

Well, i doubt we'd be using the EXACT same mechanism as this Apple countdown, so i don't know if copyright would be an issue...

:]

Andrew Y.

05-03-2007 20:40

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

if i was in the stands i would have been pretty annoyed by the bar...not even gonna lie

as a driver i was not too worked up by the clock on the fields. They were not too hard to be seen through the rack.
but.......a cluck ontop of the rack would be great!

AdamHeard

05-03-2007 20:51

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtaman02 (Post 591181)

I have many things to comment about when it concerns this game. a more visible clock sadly enough is not one of them b/c Teams are suppose to work in co-opertition with one another forming a dominant alliance. Very Very Very Rare does that alliance do what they say they are gonna do. Having a Visible Clock will not change a thing. Even with the extremely Audible Game sounds doesn't make the alliance do what they have to do. I have played in the FIRST Game and I have Volunteered at the FIRST Game and I have not seen anyone look at the screen to see where they stand as far as time was concerned. Heck I don't even think the teams pay attention to the scoring. They're too busy concentrating on whats going on in front of them. Now what teams should do is appoint 1 person only to keep an eye on the clock and have them run back and forth in the player station informing the alliance how much time they have left to complete the game successfully. Now if you want ask FIRST to put up more visible timers on top of the player station b/c I do agree that one on each side is not enough or better yet put the countdown timers on top of the goal. b/c my person opinion is your eyes should be on the game not looking for a clock.

My team has been doing that as long as I have been on the team. When I was an operator last year I would constantly look at the the screen to see the time, and a different perspecitve of the field.

If we've been doing, I'm pretty sure many teams do the same.

fluffy

05-03-2007 21:35

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Y. (Post 591361)

as a driver i was not too worked up by the clock on the fields. They were not too hard to be seen through the rack.
but.......a cluck ontop of the rack would be great!

im not sure about a chicken, but a clock would definetly be helpful;)

Lkr220

05-03-2007 23:19

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

I think the scoring display should have a true clock and state what match number it is. Like others have said, a true clock would be very helpful during endgame when you may only have a handful of seconds to climb a ramp or score a tube. It is nice to know exactly how much time you have left and not just an approximation.

My team scouts every match, and offers the data we collect to every team at the regional. For accurate data we keep track of match numbers which also allows us to see alliances. However, we switch on and off, so the same 6 people aren't always scouting. I know sometimes when I am focused on a match I forget which one I am in. It would be easier if they posted the number during the match as well as on the screen with the final scores for the match.

Zoheb N

06-03-2007 01:04

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Put me down for getting the clock back. After watching the first week of regionals, I was frustrated in trying to figure out how much time was left in the matches. All I could tell was when there was less than 15 seconds left in a match which does not really help when you want to find out what to do or how long it takes a team to get up a ramp (for scouting). This also really puts a major road block for teams who use the time to decide when they should head for the ramps. In the first week there were many teams who looked like they could have gotten up the ramp if they just would have known how long was left because they would wait until the progress bar was almost out before they noticed there was like 3 seconds left when they needed 5 to get up the ramp.

I think FIRST really needs to bring the clock back.

Wetzel

06-03-2007 09:55

Adapt or fail

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Scheck (Post 591097)

From a spectator's point of view, the remaining time should be clearly displayed. The uneducated eye should be able to figure things out in a matter of seconds. It took me a few matches to even realize that the progress bar was there!

I would think that the uneducated eye (walk in spectator) would figure out the time bar pretty quickly. I think it would take them longer to figure out the game.

Wetzel

mormannoob

06-03-2007 10:41

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

i think it might be cool (but mabey usless,but still cool) if it was on the score board at the arena

anyway i prefer the clock because as a lot of people have said its nicer to know exactly howmutch time its left in a match instead of an estimate

Dave Scheck

06-03-2007 11:01

Re: Adapt or fail

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wetzel (Post 591773)

I would think that the uneducated eye (walk in spectator) would figure out the time bar pretty quickly. I think it would take them longer to figure out the game.

Wetzel

Point taken, but what I was getting at was that if FIRST wants to make this spectator friendly (which I think has been their goal at least in the past few years), they need to display the time in terms that the audience is used to. A clock is the standard way to keep time, not a progress bar. It needs to be big enough to read clearly, the font needs to be fixed width so that there is no change in width, and if the time is less than a minute it needs the prepending zero (i.e. 0:59).

The focus should be made, as you said, on figuring out the game, not trying to decipher how much time is remaining in the match.

As for the iTunes progress bar idea, I have to disagree. I think that it would clutter the already precious screen space. Keep it clean, keep it simple and you can't go wrong.

mtaman02

06-03-2007 19:00

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Too make life easier and more spectator friendly FIRST should put clocks on top of the scoring goals (The Rack for this year) and I'll settle for a redesigned Real Time Score Board with Clock, Progress Bar, Score and where the Scoring Objects are placed. That way everyone can be happy and it will still be cool looking.

ChrisH

06-03-2007 19:30

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtaman02 (Post 592105)

The way the Field control system wiring is set up, this is pretty much impossible. We might be able to slide the clock to one side of the player station, but I'm not sure even that is possible

sanddrag

06-03-2007 19:33

Re: Petition: Scoring Display needs a TRUE CLOCK!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisH (Post 592132)

The way the Field control system wiring is set up, this is pretty much impossible. We might be able to slide the clock to one side of the player station, but I'm not sure even that is possible

I hear ya. I remember assembling the field and there is a high probability all the cables reach right to where they go and no where else. But, if at all possible, some sort of clock that displays minutes and seconds would be a WONDERFUL feature to have at the LA (or any) regional. Thanks for looking into it Chris.

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