[FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

With 2.5 weeks until the championships, I doubt there is much time left to copy designs. We have spring break in the middle of this time too. I know we will make a few tweaks and spend our time practicing from here on out.

I would like to challenge the FVC community to post pictures of their robots that will be competing in Atlanta. SPAM just posted ours - 3053 posted theirs a week or so ago - let's end the secrecy and show the world your genius. BTW, we won't have much time to marvel over your genius in Atlanta, as it will be crazy!

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Our slowness in posting photos has been caused not by secrecy, but more by absent-mindedness (my forgetting to ask the team if it was OK to post). In fact, we would like to take this opportunity to shamelessly market our team and robot, Desubot.

Desubot is a relatively small, fast robot whose strengths are in defense and assisting. Abilities include:
1) Scoring 2-6 (in the low goal) in autonomous
2) Quickly stealing balls from the opponent's side and herding them into the low goal (or to a high-goal alliance partner). She can also steal balls from an opponent's low goal, but this tends to be slow.
3) Climbing the platform and chinning up.
4) Despite lesser weight, surprising ability to pull robots off the chin-up bar and push them off the platform
5) Pushing/pinning the atlas ball when needed. Can't do both # 3 and #5 at the same time.

She ranked #2 in the qualifying matches at the Northern CA Championship but imploded in the semifinals, sporting not one, but 2 disconnected wires! (The wires are now anchored down VERY tightly in multiple places).

The team originally had grand designs of being able to score in the high goal that never came to fruition. They credit the teams that succeeded; in their own words, "The #1 alliance deserved to win -- both their #1 and #2 robots were better than ours," and yet realized the strengths of ours, "Despite its complete and utter lack of elegance, it was arguably the most versatile." We have no expectations about advancing to the elimination rounds, but thought perhaps a high-goal team might find an assistive robot to be useful.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

how did team 3617 qualify for Atlanta?

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

We won the Inspire Award.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

At the midwest regional in the championship it was two highgoal robots verses a strong lowgoal robot and another lowgoal robot that didnt work. The first round of the championship the two highgoal robots beat the lowgoals 90 something to 50-60 something. The second round one of the championship on of the main axles broke on one of the high goal robots. (the ref's wouldnt give us a 5 minute time out and would only give us a 3 minute break. not enough time to fix) The two crappy low goals won... NO COMPETITION FROM THE MIDWEST.... fyi

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Sounds very interesting. Would you mind posting a picture of your robot in this thread, I'm sure many of us would love to take a look at it. Also consider this an opportunity to shamelessly plug your robot and perhaps help your team in the alliance selection at the Championship.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

A low goal robot isn't necessarily "crappy" -- it differs from a high goal bot the way a guard differs from a center in basketball. True, we can't score over 100 points, but neither can our opponents when we swipe over half the balls from their side. Our bot is a true point guard -- fast, good ball handler, and when we control the softballs, we control the game. Wouldn't necessarily want 2 of us on the same alliance, but to a high goal team that doesn't move very fast, we're a better complement than another slow high-goal bot. For some shameless boasting, I might also add that the #1 pick (a high-goal bot, whom the team agreed was the 2nd best bot) lost as our opponent but won as our alliance partner.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

I don't really understand what you mean by this. Are you trying to say that the teams coming to the chamionship from the MidWest Regional aren't good? Aren't you coming from the MidWest Regional? Didn't you say you competed there? Based on your post I know you didn't win, but I assume you won the Inspire Award. Please clarify what you mean and how your team qualified for the Championship.

Also, you say your team and 3390 will be coming "incognito". 1) What team are you from? 2) What do you mean by incognito?

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

A low goal robot can definetly compliment a slower moving high goal robot. However, two fast moving high goal robots are probably going to beat even the best low goal robot and a slower moving high goal robot almost all of the time. Even a low goal robot partnered with a fast high goal robot probably isn't going to fair too well against two fast high goal robots.

That said most high goal robots our team has seen have been rather slow and unmanueverable, so low goal robots definetly have their value and place. I'm not sure how true this will be at the Championship. All I can say definitively is that our high goal robot is quite fast and manueverable and working with a low goal robot probably wouldn't be advantageous for us.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Since we are giving plugs (albeit to ourselves), I would like to plug another team from our regional. During finals match 1, our robot and our alliance partner both had scoring issues. We had scored enough before the problems to win the match. Between the 1st and 2nd match we took our time out, but we could not diagnose and fix the problem with either robot in time. We obviously lost the second match.

Between the 2nd and 3rd matches, our opponents used their timeout for our benefit. We were able to fix both robots, and we won the last match by 1 point! Those two teams demonstrated the essence of gracious professionalism that afternoon.

One of our opponents (Team 1902-Exploding Bacon) won the Inspire award and is attending the Championships. When you see them, please pat them on the back and thank them for spreading the true spirit of FIRST.

BTW, the other opponent was team 1369-Minotaur.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Well I can't answer for him/her but I know the following:

Winning Alliance: 3505 (Omaha, NE) & 3365 (Crete, NE)
Inspire Award: 3391 (Elkhorn, NE)
Team 3390 (Elkhorn, NE) was Runner-Up Alliance

So team 3390 didn't qualify for the Championship, perhaps they got one of the open slots?

The first picture is of the winning alliance, the second picture shows the Inspire Award robot pushing the Atlas Ball.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Let me correct myself. I think I called them crappy because we had a tough break and im bitter. There is a VERY strong low goal coming from the midwest regional and the other robot did not work at all. My team made it to the finals at the MWRegional undefeated. THe first round we won the match and the second round of the championship our robot got rammed (it snapped our main axel in two - (our axle was twisting already so that didnt add to it) Our robot was rendered useless. So we lost the second round. The third round we tried to pin the atlas ball but we were really immobile without that axle and in the last 10 seconds the atlas ball rolled to the other side.

What I mean by incognito is team 3388 and team 3390 joined another team from my school that won the inspire award. 3388 and 3390 also went to wisconsin losing in the semifinals to a team that well deserved it (they were amazing)

In a few days I will post a video and a few pictures of my robot.

I hope this clears things up sorry for any confusion =)

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

So the robot you were talking about will not be playing in Atlanta? Or, are you talking about the robot from the team you joined?

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Attached is a picture of Radnor Robotics Team 2005. We were on the winning alliance at the Diamond State Tournament and a semi-finalist at the PA Vex Tournament.
The robot is in two stages. The back stage rises up to the high goal.It was designed so that we have a continous path from the floor to the goal. We can store three balls in each stage. The second stage uses an ultrsonic sensor and limit switches to autoindex the balls once the fall into the stage.
The robot can also hang from the bar in about 5 seconds.

Good Luck to everyone in Atlanta. I am sure it is going to be a blast!

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

The team we joined was kind of a hostile takeover (they didn't care) and we just made a new robot.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Im assuming 3391 since they are from the same school you are and are the only team going to Atanta

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

What are you going to do about the engineering notebook then? It will show a total transformation in the 10 members of the team.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

the notebook will probably be extremely long because it will tell the tales of three different teams and what they have learned and gone through and what they finally came to a conclusion about

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

just a quick fact: the maximum number of points that a team with two low goal scorers can score is 54 points.
-22 balls in low goal (which is a little above its max.)
-posession of the atlas ball
- both robots park on the platform

despite this fact, a low goal scorer's speed and agility could compliment a high goal scorer.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

What do you mean "despite this fact"??? Two low goal bots is a completly different kettle of fish than one low and one high.

I suggest that little info in your description of the max score of two low-goalers has any bearing on the subject of an alliance of a low bot and a high bot.

Plus, why don't you entertain the thought that low-goal bots can also hang from the top or side of the bar?

I don't have a dog in this fight; but I also don't want to see low-goal teams dis'ed because of a misconception that they can contribute little to an alliance's score....

Blake
PS: It's a quibble, but it is possible to stack balls in the low goals.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

i wasnt dissing low goal scoring robots. i was merely stating something that i discovered and found interesting. Low goal scoring robots are very competetive when paired with a high goal scorer. two low goal scorers are not very competetive together. and in regards to hanging, i havent seen a low goal scorer try to hang but it would be very interesting to see one try to hang from the side.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

OK - So let's add in the possiblity of taking the autonomous bonus and hanging instead of platform'ing. That adds 30 points (more than 50%) to your previous high score estimate....

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Ya, but you have to keep in mind, in Atlanta there will be at least 15% of the teams that can score in the high goal as fast or faster than in the low goal in terms of balls. If pressed, I can personally probably list around 10 robots that can average around 17-20 high goal balls per game.

I'm gonna put myself out on a limb here, and say that there will probably only be 2-4 out of 24 teams in the elimination matches that can ONLY score low goals without hybriding with hanging/high goaling, and they will all be second picked.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

How many balls do you think those high goal bots can score if they have a high capacity low-goal bot hauling the balls to them, instead of having to go fetch them on their own? Hmmm, that might work well.

How many balls do you think those high goal bots will be able to put in the hole if they have a low goal bot constantly between them and those goals or between them and any balls they want to harvest off the floor? Hmmm, that might cause some lowered scores.

How many of those high goal bots will be delighted to have a low goal bot use much of its 18x18x18 for components that are very good at getting and keeping the Atlas Ball, even if an opponent wants to toss it out of the arena. Hmmm, doubled softball scores might be nice to have.

I'm not saying I would build a low goal bot if I were going. I'm not saying I wouldn't. I'm just suggesting that there are non-trivial advantages to devoting machinery (volume, weight, motors, ...) to parts of the game other than high-goal scoring.

Non-trivial doesn't mean better than any other strategy, but it does mean that if I had a high-goal bot, I would think carefully about whether I wanted an ally that had the same weaknesses and strengths as me, or if I maybe wanted an ally that could complement my weaknesses and strengths with a different set of capabilties...

Blake

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Well said.

We'll see how Atlanta plays out.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Here is 3495's robot, though it is still being tweaked. We can score 3 balls at a time in the high goal, and have 10 wheel drive(the end wheels are raised) powered with six motors. We don't hang, but we can get on the platform and keep others from hanging.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Our team (3053) modified our robot after the PA tournament; it's been done for a few weeks now but I hadn't gotten around to posting any pictures of it.

What's obscured by the arm is that the drive train is powered by 6 motors. Each motor is on a 60 tooth gear, and each wheel is on an 84 tooth gear. The robot is moderate to high speed (relative to other robots we've seen), and has quite a bit of torque. Because the front and rear wheels are linked by gearing, if one wheel gets lifted off of the ground (when driving onto the platform, or sometimes when in a war over the Atlas Ball), all of the torque gets transferred to the other wheel instead of being lost.

Pictures below:

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

Kevin is doing a little bit of testing, juggling balls to figure out the nuances of programming the robot to do it in autonomous mode.

Re: [FVC]: I challenge you to post your Atlanta Vex robot pics
 

I like it.

Think about adding some dead weight (bolt on some more metal pieces) just to give it more friction (friction force = coefficient of friction of the surface(s) multiplied by the normal force (the amount of the weight that is pressing on the surfaces that are in contact)).

Losing a little acceleration and a bit of top speed might be worth it in order to keep those six motors producing as much friction as possible when you need it. You want that investment (six motors) in your drive train to pay off.

Plus more weght down low will make you that much less top heavy when lifting balls.

Blake