Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

We want to buy a band saw for our team to use this year. I would like to learn about other team's experiences and recommendations about using various types for cutting aluminum stock such as:
1. Horizontal/Vertical Band Saw like the Jet 414458. http://www.amazon.com/414458-HVBS-56...0946661&sr=8-3
or Grizzly G0622
http://www.grizzly.com/products/G0622

2. Portable Band Saw with base like the Grizzly G8692
http://www.grizzly.com/products/G8692
or Milwaukee has one like this also for a lot more money.

3. Vertical band saw like the Delta BS-100
http://www.amazon.com/Delta-BS100-Sh...947095&sr=8-31
or various other larger ones.


It's obvious all of these have pros and cons. If you were to pick one type, which one? Or are there other better alternatives?

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

We make extensive use of a 12" Hitachi bandsaw. If you slow the blade down to the lower speed setting and use the right blade then it cuts aluminum wonderfully. The trick is in the blade. Read through this tread for more info.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

This one would be pretty sweet :D

Unfortunately those are out of most of our price ranges... awesome saws if you ever get to use one though.

For cutting long tubing into shorter pieces, or for cutting solid stock, or for anything you want a straight cut for, go with the horizontal bandsaw. I've heard that if you use horizontal bandsaws in the vertical position very often, it can become very hard to get a straight cut when switching back to using it horizontally, however.

If you're looking at cutting lots of thin stuff and cutting angles or contours, go with the vertical bandsaw.

P.S. We have that Delta vertical bandsaw, and considering it's small size, it's not bad at all.

Also, that JET and Grizzly saw are exactly the same saw, just branded differently. KBC Tools also sells the same saw for $225. Don't pay more for the JET. Buy the cheapest one you find.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

If you are buying your first band saw, the best choice is the
horizontal saw (with the possible conversion to vertical).
It will be useful for makeing nice square cuts on a variety
of stock, both aluminum and steel. If you can afford
a saw with a coolant/lube drip it is a good idea because
it will extend the life of the blade and keep the work a lot
cooler, although it can be messy.

Eugene

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Look in the yellow pages and B2B book. There are probably a couple of industrial power tool companies in your area that sell band saws. They quite often take trade ins when companies upgrade. You might get lucky and find a real nice used high end band saw.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

This should do the trick

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Do not attempt to use a wood band saw for cutting aluminum.

After a while the wheels inside will melt and spray your hands with molten plastic.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

you say this like you have had personal experience... molten plastic doesn't sound like a whole lot of fun

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

I bought the small Jet horizontal/vertical metal cutting band saw for my own uses as well as helping my team. I have been happy with it. Two minor problems to report: 1) The table for use in the vertical orientation was bent in shipping and had to be hammered out, 2) Does not always make perfectly square cuts*.

If possible, lay eyes/hands on each model before choosing. Pay attention to the bearings that hold the blade straight and how the material is clamped. You want roller bearings, not bushings or pads for most accurate cutting. See how close to the blade you can clamp a piece as this will limit the size of some cuts.

Also, check on price and availability of replacement metal blades. They only break when you are using the saw so ALWAYS have spares on hand.

*I've been told a trick, but have yet to test it regarding straight cuts on a band saw. Many blades are stamped and as such have a lip on the trailing edge of the blade. Holding a wet stone to the trailing edges (before cutting) in theory will break this edge and provide straighter cuts.

Regards,
Lee

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

As already stated, for heavy cuts (like a hacksaw) use a horizontal, for cutting patterns or intricately on thin stock use a vertical. The blade is the critical point, not the saw. Learn how to properly adjust a band saw - it is not intuitive - and it will serve you well.

As for getting a band saw, if budget isn't a huge issue, go for a name-brand tool in the 12-14 inch range. If budget is an issue, then a used tool can be had for a fraction of the new price, either saving several hundred dollars, or getting you a far superior machine for the same price.

A band saw made for wood CAN be used, but it's kind of like using a screwdriver as a chisel - it'll do, but it's really not the right way.

Don

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

As I said before, PLEASE do not do this. You WILL destroy the band saw. I have done it before.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

At my house, I have a Ryobi vertical band saw, which is about as much of a "wood band saw" as you can get. Home Depot didn't even sell any blades for it to cut aluminum, but after searching around other local stores (and eventually finding some at Lowe's), I switched out the wood blade for a metal-cutting blade. Since then, I've never had any problems with cutting aluminum or steel.

As long as you lave a blade with enough teeth per inch to sufficiently cut aluminum (or steel), you can use any band saw.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

It really doesn't sound like he's in the price range to be buying anything name brand.

It'll set you back over $2000-4000 for anything by Kalamazoo, Wells, Dake, HydMech, etc.

I think Dake is the only one that even sells a 7x12 model, and it's identical to the one that JET, Grizzly, KBC Tools, MSC, etc all sell under different brand names.

To put it this way, in the price range he's looking at, he can't afford American iron. It's all going to come out of some Taiwanese or Chinese factory, so which nameplate gets stuck on it from that point on is pretty irrelevant.

If they do happen to find a bigger, name brand used bandsaw, then there are awesome deals to be had and you would notice a world of difference in performance compared to the JET or Grizzly.

For light duty stuff, it really shouldnt make a difference though.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

This is very curious to me. Of course it is possible to destroy anything if you work hard enough at it but I am really wondering what bandsaw you managed to melt and under what conditions. Could you please post more specific information on the brand/model of saw you destroyed, what type of blade you were using, what type of material you were cutting, and more specifics about what you feel lead to the tool failure? We would all like to learn from your mistakes so as to avoid duplicating your experiance.

Thanks!

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

I have used a wood blade to cut aluminum before. While it is not recommended, it does work alright if you go slow and are careful. The cut will come out a bit rough and the blade will not last as long, but it does work. Just do not cut something thin with a wood blade. The general rule is you want to try to have at least 3 teeth of the blade in contact with the workpiece. If you don't go to a finer tooth blade for the thin material.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Just a note from experience with bandsaw brands....

We ordered a bandsaw for our team last year and decided to go with Delta, however the first bandsaw we received came with a broken foot which could not be repaired(cast iron) so we sent it back for a replacement.

When the replacement came, I had it's own problems, the tensioning knob on top was broken, and a few others which I can't remember.

We don't know if it was the shipping companies fault, or just broken machinery from the get-go, but from what we have experienced, we will not use delta again.

Personally I would go with the Grizzly bandsaw. The drill press we got from them works very well and we are pleased with the quality of the product.

-Chuck

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

I find for the applications that many FIRST teams encounter, especially if you cut your own frame railings or similar, that a horizontal bandsaw is tremendously helpful. For very small tasks, a vertical may often be slightly more appropriate though.
116 has both a horizontal/vertical and a bench-top bandsaw, and uses both. The horizontal in definitely the workhorse of the shop though, although that could be a bi-product of 116 cutting their own frame, axles, etc. The bench top is also small enough that 116 brings it their competitions. It's also a Delta, and has been fairly reliable (although it has had issues). Their other Delta tools haven't been as lucky, and have had MANY issues, and I certainly wouldn't recommend Delta as a brand for tools in general.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

We've been considering a bandsaw, but so far lack the space and funds for a fairly nice one. In the meanwhile, this past season we bought an inexpensive Sears power miter saw ($90, but found on sale for $60), and a 7" carbide blade designed for aluminum (Morse CSM754AC Metal Devil, $30 at Amazon). While it will not do long rip or fancy cuts, it works really well for angle and cross cuts on aluminum. It's also light enough to be easily transportable. Even if we do eventually get our bandsaw, I'm sure our miter saw will still get plenty of use.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Don't be duped into buying a horizontal/vertical bandsaw combo. Been there, done that. Now we just use it for horizontal only which works out OK - I think we got it from MSC for about $200. We recently got a nice Delta 12" Vertical Band Saw for those special cuts. I also can't emphasize the importance of a nice disc/belt sander combo to go with it. That will get any framing cuts perfectly square and burr free.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

I've been working with the JET model you pictured for basically all my simple aluminum cuts since I joined the team. That being said, I haven't once seen a benefit in turning it to vertical.
For simple stock, like angle or 8020, just clamp it in and let the saw do the work...hasn't failed on me once. Now, I have to say I have had a problem before with large stock. Cutting a plate of aluminum that was just smaller than the clamp, the entire cutting surface of the blade ended up running through the cut, and with the various dings in the blade from repeated cutting, something ended up jammed, and the blade snapped. Now I'm sure that was mostly just from repeated wear and tear on the blade...but it resulted in a snapped blade nonetheless. It's an easy fix, but quite the annoyance when you're in the middle of build season and you don't have a spare part on hand. So my advice; buy a spare blade or two, it'll help you greatly in the long run.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Don't forget to think about the blade. Here is an interesting article about cutting aluminum. Even though softer than steel, aluminum cutting can be a pain of that is your job in industry.

http://www.manufacturingcenter.com/m..._realities.asp

I have not dealt with any of these companies but it give you an idea of the different types of blades available.

http://www.toolcenter.com/BANDSAW_BLADES.html

http://www.southern-tool.com/store/b...alculator.html

Somewhere I have seen where you specify the type, tooth count, set etc

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Indeed, that echos my experience - but like the "screwdriver as a chisel" example, it's really not recommended.
Also, there is a fire hazard when cutting steel, if the sawdust has not been carefully removed from the machine.
Don't assume they're making straight cuts in bars or extrusions - it's nearly impossible to cut out an irregular shape on a horizontal band saw.

Don

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

For years we used ether a table saw or a chop saw to cut aluminum and felt very unsafe to use even if clamped. We than puchased a Sears 14 in vertical band saw on a stand and now we don't know how we worked with out it all these years. It made cutting soo much easier and SAFER. When set up right it cuts straight and square. We also used it to cut curves in square tubing, plates and plastic. You must use a attached vacume and always clean it out every time and the blade will last quite a long time. Do not let it build up with shavings. We use the wood blade for our cuts, and if some one needs to cut steel use the sawzal or a hack saw not the wood blade on the band saw.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

In 294 shop we/they have a nice horizontal that is rather old (looks expensive), a $2000 + vertical and two cheap wood verticals with steel/aluminum blades.

So far the only issue we had with the vertical wood ones is putting on a blade backwards (teeth facing up). Also, these have been around at least 20 years before the team got them so they've been through a lot.

Also, don't rely on a bandsaw to make perfectly square cuts... Unless all the machines I've worked with are messed up, it is slightly off (not consistently either, just a little bit of back and forth with the blade).

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

If the rollers are not aligned proper and the hight of the rollers with the work are not at proper location it is impossible to make a straight cut. The saw we have is brand new and we have double check our adjustments and it cuts right on the line. I can use a fence and it follows very striaght but I am using the smallest blade. I also took some 1 x 2 aluminum tube and was able to follow a cureved line with no problem for a length of about 14 inches. I am sure that if you are using an older band saw the rollers are not true and may have loose bearings. and maybee all the hardware is not there. Take some time and check it out it may be worth replacing the worn parts.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

I consider my vertical bandsaw as one of my must-have tools for building. They can be tempermental if things are not aligned properly but when you have the right blade and adjusted correctly its great.

I've had trouble cutting freehand and keeping on the line I intend to cut. The saw works best when a guide is clamped to the table that keeps everything running straight.

Just because you're working with metal don't forget to check out the woodworking magazines for great tips on building jigs and fixtures for your saws. If you have a big chain bookstore nearby check out the ShopNotes magazine Volume 16 Issue 95 (on newstands until Oct 30, 2007) www.ShopNotes.com. There is a good article about "The secrets to cutting Perfect Parts". These techniques work for wood and metals too.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Remembering that we may have some novice builders here, I should have mentioned that sometimes the articles taken from woodworking may be more inspirational than literal. In that article they suggest using the bandsaw to cut close to your cut line then trim the excess with a router. I might do that if I'm cutting wood or plastics but I wouldn't suggest using a router to trim metals. I would instead build my jig and templates to cut as close to the line as possible and eliminate the second cleanup pass with the router.

I use CAD when developing my patterns so I might scale the template up (or down) if I felt the need to preserve an offset.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

You can use a router on thin aluminum. Two years ago, Team 228 used this material that was 0.125" polycarb sandwiched between thin layers of aluminum. We used a router to cut it out in a perfect arc, and it worked just fine.

Or if your team has [access to] a milling machine, you can still cut the aluminum parts slightly large and square everything up there.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

Agreed, a hand-held router can cut aluminum up to about 1/4" thick - but it is one of the more dangerous operations you can do. Extreme care is required. Thinner aluminum is less stressful on the machine.

You can also get bits made specifically for metals. I worked in a factory where they cut out the openings for glass in steel entry doors, using a router and a masonite pattern.

3 years ago one of our parents used a hand-held router to cut out the holes in our cart frame, 3/16" aluminum. Even I was scared, but it worked fine.

Don

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

We have one of those delta one and it isn't all that good so definatly not that one.

Re: Band saw for cutting aluminum
 

I have heard of teams building a braket for the router and attaching treaded rods in x, y, format conected with motors, using joysticks you can control it much safer than by hand and more acurate. I did use a router to make a large turn table out of 1/4 aluminum, I built a jig for it but at still was not a safe operation, the vibrations , heat and clamps made it difficult. the finished product is at http://team1322.org/machnical.htm