Re: Midwest Regional
 

they are really strict on the line rule, if your bumper fabric goes over they are calling it, so no wonder there is 300+ minus points. Follow the rules!!!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

88-74
wildstang won.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

and now 1114 is the lone undefeated team.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

surprise surprise:p although, 48 showed they could be stopped, and gives other teams an insight on what to do lol

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Heh, thanks Wildstang. Now all my friends in Service Repair think crab drive is "teh awesome." Which it is.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Isn't 1755 5-0? http://www2.usfirst.org/2008comp/eve.../rankings.html

Re: Midwest Regional
 

1114 goes down!

*EDIT* High speed raming in hybrid??

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Ouch, plus a yellow card...

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I should have said undefeated and untied, but that doesn't matter anymore.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

what were the penalties in 1114's match??

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Yup, all the normal rules still apply in the hybrid period.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

And for those who missed it, what actually happened?

Re: Midwest Regional
 

But how do you control that? You cant bump a robot, wait for it to move, and then pass in hybrid..

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Did their (2386) arm just like... explode?

Re: Midwest Regional
 

You avoid programming your robot to drive so fast during hybrid that you can get penalized for it.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

AH, so they make it so you cant lap twice pretty much :p
1114 was down an alliance partner, if they had them they prolly would won with lap points atleast
And 1024/71 put on a good show

Re: Midwest Regional
 

they have a fast hybrid and smashed another robot

high speed ramming yellow card for them

can't believe they lost though, they weren't having a bad match!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

It has been my experience that the Refs will warn you before they give you a yellow card so you should know what speeds are allowed.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

It doesn't say you will be warned in the manual so there is no basis for that argument.

Regardless, they went too fast, rammed a team, and got penalized.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

quite the traffic jam =]

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Interesting to see what happened when a robot was blocking the entire lane...

Re: Midwest Regional
 

The Basis would be my experience, it has happened to 2 different teams I have worked with at 3 different regionals.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

thats 2 matches in a row 1114 lost

Re: Midwest Regional
 

yeah that was nuts... but slow them down... and they can't do it alone anymore.. that match proves it. good work by killer bees too!!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Wow, it's really sad to see such a good robot like 1114 have this kind of luck. :(
I expected them to be one of the front runners, (which they still sort of are) I hope their luck changes :o

Re: Midwest Regional
 

They're still the Belle of the ball.
If they aren't seeded they'll be the first robot picked.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I just saw some defense! preventing a 12 pt end bonus

Re: Midwest Regional
 

no kidding, but what are the chances of them not being seeded? slim to none there lol

Re: Midwest Regional
 

So you sacrifice your ability to score points to make sure someone else doesn't get in your way?

I think it was pretty weak that they got a yellow card for that. It was pretty clear to me that a team had driven out about 3 feet and then stopped right in 1114's path in a previous match (when their hybrid mode never took that course before), in a clear attempt to get in their way. As far as I can remember, obstruction in hybrid counts just the same.

I wish they were explaining these penalties better. They never gave an explanation when 1114 got the other 10 pointer in that match, or the 20 pts in the match after.

Furthermore, when that one team fell over and blocked the entire lane, does anyone know who was penalized for aggressive play, and why? It clearly states in the rules that you can push a downed robot that is blocking the field out of the way.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

i understand that they will be picked. i was simply saying how disappointing it must be for the team.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

1114 is beatable, in week 1.

Looks like we may have parity...

We are in for a fun season, everyone...

Re: Midwest Regional
 

2039 fell over and blocked the path. Winnovation (1625) tried to get through and got a yellow flag for agressive driving. This puzzles me, because when 2039's teammate pushed them away to get through, nothing happened.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Beatable when they get penalties maybe.

1114 is the only robot I've seen that has the potential to dominate this game.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Well, I'm just saying that if you drive slow enough then there's no chance you'll have to worry about it.

Frankly, I'm in favor of that yellow card. Yesterday during practice one of the very-high-speed hybrid robots (could have been 1114, but may have been one of the others) rammed into a robot really hard and tipped them over. When they fell, their arm hit the field border and sheared off. The high speed ramming rule is there to prevent destruction of other robots and should apply in all phases of the game. I doubt a team who has to go back to the pits with a busted-up machine cares much whether it happened in hybrid or operator-controlled mode.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

The strategy by 33 in that match was impressive though...you have to admit. If i remember correctly, the 33 alliance would have won even without the penalties on the 1114 alliance.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Yes, 33 was impressive. One of the differences was that 33 could place. I don't want to get into the whole arm/shooter debate, but the arm bot won that match...

Re: Midwest Regional
 

thats what I saw too! They played that very well, sending 1675 after 1114 and getting a clear path the score themselves!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Good point.

It seems like FIRST wants hybrid to be exciting, but if everyone who has a really good hybrid mode is going to have to drop their speed to make sure they don't ram anyone unintentionally, it's going to get boring real quick. One of the coolest things I saw while watching today was 1024 doing 5 lines in hybrid. Luckily for them they seem to take a path that nobody else does, and haven't had to deal with ramming yet.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

1024 takes that corner really tight and stays close to the lane divider. It looks like this helps them stay away from other teams who don't want t get caught on the divider, but comes with the risk of getting stuck themselves (happened once or twice).

They also appear to have decent collision avoidance on board.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

1114 is by far the most impressive individual team I have seen in Midwest or NJ. And even they have two losses. This game is focused on alliance play and alliance strategy, and I really don't think anyone at any regional will completely and utterly dominate. Some may or may not go undefeated, but it won't be common and they'll need lots of help.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I havent gotten to see 1114 yet.:( Right when I turned the webcast on the scores from the 1114/33 match that everyone is talking about was up. I missed it by 2 minutes!:ahh:
Joey

Re: Midwest Regional
 

video for midwest has been going up on SOAP throughout the day, find the match number then go download it!

the site is http://soap108.com

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Thanks!!!! I thought they put the video up after the comp. My day is good again.
Joey

Re: Midwest Regional
 

First match for us was a pretty good match, second match was stupid mistake one of leaving a shooter safety on preventing us from shooting, third match a robot beached itself on our pickup tongue, and 4th match or the one we stopped moving the battery came unplugged. and ALL of these things are never ever ever happening again. grrrrrr

Re: Midwest Regional
 

A battery came unplugged. Ouch :(

Once in Aim High, a poof ball hit our robot exactly on its off switch. The robot was off for the whole match. It was terrible.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

The match we were in when 2039 fell over and blocked the track we incurred penalties for a robot driving on top of our scoop.....again, the refs then gave us a yellow card for entanglement twice, and we have made changes so it shouldn't get stuck under people anymore. bad 3 matches

Re: Midwest Regional
 

just curious to hear what people think of our bot from team 2358? we're 3-3-1 right now.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

your hybrid mode is pretty good! three lines right?? thats the last on I saw, and you launcher is pretty good too good job!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I believe you guys are doing very well, especially for a rookie team! Your hybrid mode performs almost every match, which is very good.
Also, your catapult runs on a pretty neat spring design, which I haven't seen yet on any other robot.(I think its a spring design, you never know with the web cast resolution!) You guys seem to really shine in qualifying match 40. The camera gets some really good views of your robot in action.
I would not be surprised if you guys were up for some pretty good rookie awards this year! :D Hope to see you at nationals!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Haha, sorry to hear about that. I know exactly how that feels, one random unrelated problem after another. Good learning experience, that's for sure.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I finally got to watch archived matches.
Conclusion: WOW!
That 33/1114 match was as good as it gets. 33 is right up there on the scoring considering its an arm bot. Very efficient, quick and smart driving.
1114 definitely the flavor everyone predicted them to be.

One thing I did not see and curious as to whether 1114 can place on the overpass? 33 won that match with placement of ball at the end (not including penalty on other alliance).

If they got together, that would be a case of the armbot, shooter, and xxxx as an effective alliance??

Re: Midwest Regional
 

1114 can place on the overpass. Match 29. They attempted in Match 4, but failed.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

thx for the words of commendation :)

just to clear up a few points:
1) we dont use hybrid, its fully autonomous.
2) its not spring powered, its actually elastic exercise bands :D

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Todays March 1, 2008. When is the Wildstang's webcast going to be up? I keep on trying and it says that it cannot find the URL. So when are they going to broadcast??? Thanks.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Matches start at 9:30 (CST). Look again around 10:00 EST.

- Gary, Creston grad 1975

Re: Midwest Regional
 

You posted this at 7am Central. They don't even let us in the building that early.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

112 points pre-penalties for 111, 1024, and another team.

It stands! Congrats to 111, 1024, and 2356 (2358?)

Edit: But now it's 1114 and 1625 on a team together, let's see what they can do.

104 points for that team... minus 30 for penalties.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

did 1114 mentor 2386?

thats what it seems like to me, we'll just have to see if we have a new Rookie Sensation born in the eliminations

Re: Midwest Regional
 

darn I was hoping for a 1625 1114 pairing.:(

-edit. I see we picked 16. Looks like were building a pretty good alliance.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

1114, 1024, 2041
Sounds like a winner to me

Good luck to all teams in the playoffs

*1v8 is gonna be the closest match, im predicting*

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Alliances

1: 1755, 71, 2338
2: 1625, 16, 648
3: 1114, 1024, 2041
4: 2386, 2358, 843
5: 48, 33, 2039
6: 1675, 1038, 1982
7: 1781, 503, 101
8: 111, 1243, 1504

Sorry if I screwed up any team numbers. Its kinda hard to read off the webcast.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

1114 and 1024 are going to put up alot of points in Hybrid.

also the 5th seed alliance captain is 48 not 46

Re: Midwest Regional
 

ahem... and Team 2433 as backup (if a robot fails)

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I want to see 3 v 5!! that would be a great match.

1v8 is going to be close

overall they seem pretty even to me, hopefully some stratagy will be the factor!!

Good luck teams!!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I <3 1755's strategy that was the best move ever.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

That was smart picking by 1755 to break up any budding super-alliances. For those that missed it, they picked #3 1114 (declined), #2 1625 (declined), and #8 111 (declined) before finally getting 71.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I agree that the #3 alliance is incredible. There are some really effective hurdlers in that #2 alliance.

A #2 vs #3 semi-final would be a massive shoot-out!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

should be a good elimination round
3 Canadian teams :)

it looks like team 2386 and 843 have similar jerseys

Re: Midwest Regional
 

While I agree that #2 and #3 alliances should score alot, I wouldn't count out the #8 alliance. All three of those teams are capable of hurdling and I'm sure Raul and 111 will come up with some great strategies. Should be exciting.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

when teams do this, it just makes me lose respect for those teams, because the teams taht decline eventually prove WHY they declined and show up this team telling them we shouldn't be respecting you, you should be respecting us.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Why lose respect for teams that are smartly breaking up potential foes?
Would you have respected them more for caving into them and letting them have their way?

Re: Midwest Regional
 

This happens all the time. 176/111 in 2006 on Newton would be the first example that comes to mind.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Not at all. The ability to decline an alliance, and the fact that means the team is not eligible to be picked again, makes for more strategic alliance selections. I particularly like what Wildstang said while declining.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

What did they say?

Re: Midwest Regional
 

It's going to be interesting to see how the #2 and #3 alliances do. Both have two incredibly fast hurdlers, but they implement different hurdling methods. 1625 and 16 launch the ball from the middle of their robot, while 1114 and 1024 lift the ball up and have punchers that get it over the overpass. Should be a great match if both alliances make it to the semis.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Something to the effect of being honored to be asked, but they regretfully declined.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Am I the only one that thinks that picking robots in the order that your scouts feel is appropriate is just good common sense and not even a "strategy" (regardless of whether you think it's smart or disrespectful). I think that I would pick the best robot available to be on my alliance...

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Will teams quit falling over under our overpass! Then we can't show off our robot :)

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I smell a new high score coming in QF 4-1 of course it 3 vs. 1


Edit: Bingo 146 pts.

...and they need to check their numbers before they post them, they had to correct 2-1 already and now 4-1 is incorrect.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

146!!! to 24

Re: Midwest Regional
 

146 :O

Re: Midwest Regional
 

146!!! wow.. 3 on 1 just unfair

Re: Midwest Regional
 

146 vs 24. OUCH! :eek:

Re: Midwest Regional
 

FIRST site has it 138-16 - Huh?

Edit: and it's corrected back to 146-24. Double HUH?

Re: Midwest Regional
 

I can think of the Curie 2007 picking too. 1732 (#1) picked 330 (#2) and 1114 (#4?) before picking 67 (#8?). Broke up a powerful alliance...and wound up falling to 330's alliance.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

It was actually 1732 not 1730 and I believe 67 was the #8 seed.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

2 vs 3 should be good

Re: Midwest Regional
 

in my opinion, i believe you should stand up and fight, no matter the odds, did anybody think that rookie number four alliance would knock delfi elite and the killer bees? but i do see it your way too koko, teams do this as strategy, but like i said, it makes me look at them differently, just like i looked at 1732 last year...

Re: Midwest Regional
 

!!!!!!
Best match ive seen, just happened.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

grrr... the webcast died on me and it looks like I missed a good match...

edit- YES!!!!!!!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Wow, that was a good match. New Favorite.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Refreshing SOAP...

screw Cognitive Psychology.....

edit- why is the match result thingy showing that we lost...
edit2- good they fixed it.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

In a game like chess or checkers or connect the dots or football or basketball or and the list keeps going, strategy is an integral part of the game. As each team learns to understand the strategies involved, they can strengthen the game. Building alliances and preventing alliances from being built is part of the strategy. I respect those who understand that and apply it during the emotional and dramatic moments of selection and game play.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Why are they running the Semi-finals out of order? Shouldn't SF1-1 have been 8 vs. 4?

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Since #4 just played the match before, they changed it so they didn't play 2 matches in a row.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

well... it was a good round :( . I wish Alliance #3 luck in the finals.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Congrats 1114, 1024, and 2041! It sure was fun to watch!!!!

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Congrats to team 1114, 2041, and 1024 great matches and amazing high score, good luck in your regionals to come.

Great job to all teams who participated Midwest was definitely my favorite regional of the weekend.

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Congrats to teams 1114, 2041, and 1024

Re: Midwest Regional
 

Perhaps I should retitle the top seeded member in the Season Long FF League award. Instead of the Elgin Clock Award I could call it the "I Get To Pick 1114 and You Don't" Award.