Chief Delphi - Open-source FRC code

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Re: Open-source FRC code

Instead of all this arguing about GPL vs non-GPL, why don't we just make our own license? As I see it what we need absolutely need is:
1) Redistributable
2) Intellectual property (not like Monster Cables, may they burn in whatever place their religion proscribes to people who rip off innocent customers with imaginary techno-jargon and sue all their competitors over idiotic claims, but just to keep people from saying 'I made this' when they didn't)
3) Compatible with Kevin's license

A thing that I think may make teams more likely to post code:
1) An additional clause teams can choose to license their code under if they want to that requires that the code not be used verbatim

Anyone else think making our own license is a good idea?

Re: Open-source FRC code

Or how about something awfully simple, such as the BSD license. It can be used in commercial projects, but the company would still have to attribute the copyright-holder. There's tons of open-source licenses out there besides the GPL, you just have to choose the right one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSD license

Copyright (c) <YEAR>, <OWNER>

All rights reserved.

Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions are met:

* Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer.
* Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution.
* Neither the name of the <ORGANIZATION> nor the names of its contributors may be used to endorse or promote products derived from this software without specific prior written permission.

THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY THE COPYRIGHT HOLDERS AND CONTRIBUTORS
"AS IS" AND ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT
LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR
A PARTICULAR PURPOSE ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE COPYRIGHT OWNER OR
CONTRIBUTORS BE LIABLE FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,
EXEMPLARY, OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO,
PROCUREMENT OF SUBSTITUTE GOODS OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR
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LIABILITY, WHETHER IN CONTRACT, STRICT LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING
NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE) ARISING IN ANY WAY OUT OF THE USE OF THIS
SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGE.

Re: Open-source FRC code

Quote:

Originally Posted by shawger (Post 664634)

IANAL, but unless I'm reading this wrong, that would imply that the entire program must be licensed under the GPL, which it is not.

If I license my code under the GPL and release one or two files, it has no ties to any other pieces of code. At all.

You download it, you put it in your project, but realize that you cannot distribute the entire project now--you cannot relicense the entire thing to be GPL. But that's irrelevant--if you are using this for a private use, the GPL does not apply to any of it.

From the GPL FAQ:

Quote:

The GPL permits anyone to make a modified version and use it without ever distributing it to others. [snip] It is essential for people to have the freedom to make modifications and use them privately, without ever publishing those modifications.

I think this is entirely clear.

I will take into consideration future rule changes, and may write my own license, because we do *not* want teams to copy anything out of this code repository verbatim.

JBot

Re: Open-source FRC code

JBotAlan - Yes, you are correct. GPL is fine for diffs, but you cannot redistribute your code along with Kevin's (which I guess his license prevents anyway). Sorry, I got confused with the whole distribution thing.

I'm surprised you don't want anybody copying the code verbatim though. If you don't want that, why not just release psuedo-ish code to show the process you went through? I'm not sure what the point of making the code open-source is if nobody can use it.

I personally believe a publicly available repository of code used by FIRST teams would be a major asset and even contribute to leveling the playing field between teams with huge resources and teams with few resources. Besides, a lot of the code will need to change, unless you release your complete robot plans and someone clones your robot too. I find it unlikely that someone would blindly copy a piece of code into their robot, and have it actually work properly.

Re: Open-source FRC code

You could just zip up the functions and files that you wrote (minus WPIlib, Kevin Watson's, and/or IFI's code) and upload it to CD-Media as a White Paper, and provide it "as is".

Just remember, we're getting a new Controller in 2009. For all we know they might want us to program it in Scheme*.

* Oh the horror. (I (will (never (look (at (a (parenthesis (the (same (way (ever (again)))))))))))).

Re: Open-source FRC code

Quote:

Originally Posted by artdutra04 (Post 666368)

For all we know they might want us to program it in Scheme*.

Hey, don't knock Scheme too hard. It's a good language to know, and there's a lot of powerful things that can be done with it.

While functional languages (scheme, lisp, ml, etc) are not used nearly as much as procedural languages, it's still useful to know one. Having more tools in your belt (or knowledge in your head) gives you more ways to approach a problem, which will help to make you a better programmer. Once you know any one object-oriented procedural language, like C++ or Java, it becomes very easy to learn another. That does not translate so well to learning a functional language.

When reviewing resumes of applicants at work, I always look to see what languages they list. If they include some functional language, I always mentally give them a few bonus points.