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-   -   Best Way to Get Points (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60843)

Doug Leppard 06-01-2008 21:16

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
If you want a bot that wins especially a regional. then you will need a complete package, hybrid and hurdle,

thefro526 06-01-2008 21:22

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
I think that a good robot is going to need speed and the ability to hurdle balls. Personally I'd like to use a two-speed transmission with a ~15 fps high speed a 7fps low speed. 7fps would still be fast and stable enough to carry a track ball and 15fps is way more than enough to make quick laps around the feel while still remaining turnable

Doug Leppard 06-01-2008 21:28

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thefro526 (Post 670446)
I think that a good robot is going to need speed and the ability to hurdle balls. Personally I'd like to use a two-speed transmission with a ~15 fps high speed a 7fps low speed. 7fps would still be fast and stable enough to carry a track ball and 15fps is way more than enough to make quick laps around the feel while still remaining turnable

Wow that seems fast. Have you ever had a robot that went 15fps?

waialua359 06-01-2008 21:30

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Iboshi2 (Post 670399)
If a hurdle is performed, the alliance gets 8 pnts. If the robot then follows up by crossing the line, the team gains another 2 for a total of 10. To match this one hurdle and follow up, a robot would need to rotate the track 5 times or push a trackball around 2ish times. Even with the issue of the time it may take to hurdle, it seems like hurdling is a much more attractive option for the teleoperated 2 minutes.

I totally agree with this statement.
Role playing with a squarebot that simply pushes balls or spins around the field are no where nearly as effective as hurdling + passing overpass line combo.

Daniel_LaFleur 06-01-2008 21:37

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug Leppard (Post 670455)
Wow that seems fast. Have you ever had a robot that went 15fps?

I believe that you will see bots going faster than that ... but not successfully.

SSMike 06-01-2008 21:47

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur (Post 670473)
I believe that you will see bots going faster than that ... but not successfully.

Yeah I agree with you there. Despite the numerous rules that try to limit contact, I forsee many teams attempting to go as fast as possible around the track and most will eventually bump into something.

thefro526 06-01-2008 21:47

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Quote:

Originally Posted by thefro526 View Post
I think that a good robot is going to need speed and the ability to hurdle balls. Personally I'd like to use a two-speed transmission with a ~15 fps high speed a 7fps low speed. 7fps would still be fast and stable enough to carry a track ball and 15fps is way more than enough to make quick laps around the feel while still remaining turnable
Wow that seems fast. Have you ever had a robot that went 15fps?
No fastest I've ever driven a robot is like 12 or 13 fps. I know its theoretically possible and it would only be driven at 15fps high speed for short bursts in strait lines. The turns would probably be taken at the 7 Fps low speed or lower.

IbleedPink233 06-01-2008 21:50

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
My team was at first wanting to get screaming speeds like 15 fps, but we realized that we would also need maximum maneuverability, so we quickly toned it down.
Hurdling is going to end up being the dominating strategy - I don't see an alliance of three bots who rely on doing a bunch of laps winning a regional.

Cow Bell Solo 06-01-2008 22:00

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Iboshi2 (Post 670399)
If a hurdle is performed, the alliance gets 8 pnts. If the robot then follows up by crossing the line, the team gains another 2 for a total of 10. To match this one hurdle and follow up, a robot would need to rotate the track 5 times or push a trackball around 2ish times. Even with the issue of the time it may take to hurdle, it seems like hurdling is a much more attractive option for the teleoperated 2 minutes.

That is incorrect.

You get 6 pts for hurdling the trackball over and then 2pts for crossing the finish line.

Look at <G18> in Section 7 of the Manual - The Game

Jake177 06-01-2008 22:02

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cow Bell Solo
That is incorrect. You get 6 pts for hurdling the trackball over and then 2pts for crossing the finish line. Look at <G18> in Section 7 of the Manual - The Game

<G11> Each TRACKBALL that HURDLES its own FINISH LINE will earn 8 points (2 points for CROSSING the FINISH LINE – re Rule <G10> - and a 6 point bonus, yielding 8 points total).
A hurdled ball is worth 8 points, regardless of what the hurdling robot does afterwards.

I think people are underestimating how hard hurdling one of the track balls will be. First off, keep in mind that these balls seem to be considerably heavier than any other "big balls" from past games. I don't remember any exact weights, but I recall being able to pick up the balls from 2004 and 2001 fairly easily. Second, as I see it hurdling involves three major steps:
1. Gaining control of the ball
Assuming the ball was just hurdled, it will take several seconds to stop bouncing around after falling 6+ feet
2. carrying it around the track back to your alliance's hurdle
<G13> A TRACKBALL that has CROSSED its own FINISH LINE must CROSS the opponent’s FINISH LINE before it can score by CROSSING its own FINISH LINE again.
Under the previous assumption, this involves completing almost an entire lap
3. Passing the ball over the hurdle
Either throwing it over (which I am still not convinced is a viable solution) or reaching it over and dropping it on the other side

That being said, I do thing hurdling will be the most important part of the game. I think the most successful alliance will be three hurdlers in a hurdling rotation. Bot1 hurdles a ball, which bot 2 picks up and brings back around the track. Bot1 then goes under the hurdle, and prepares to pick up the other ball, which bot3 is bringing around the track.

Torboticsmember 06-01-2008 22:06

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Our team will probably go for hurdling the track ball, then have some back up plan I hope. But it seems that if you can hurdle the ball well you will be able to rack up some points

Daniel_LaFleur 06-01-2008 22:12

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
This is just for the trackball hurdled:
Quote:

<G11> Each TRACKBALL that HURDLES its own FINISH LINE will earn 8 points (2 points for
CROSSING the FINISH LINE – re Rule <G10> - and a 6 point bonus, yielding 8 points
total).
The above does not include the 2 points for a robot crossing it's own finish line.

With all the traffic out there, I am not so sure this will be at all easy ;)

GBilletdeaux930 06-01-2008 22:18

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Ok so hurdling the ball, at first glance, sounds like a good idea... but balls do bounce...and this ball inperticular bounces about 4 feet when dropped from 6 1/2 feet which i would think is roughly the high point of a ball going over the bar.

i have a post going about bouncing track balls and trying to formulate ideas on how to regain control here http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...threadid=60890

so unless a method of regaining control is found... it might be easier to get points a different way...

SSMike 06-01-2008 22:19

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur (Post 670539)
With all the traffic out there, I am not so sure this will be at all easy ;)

^ Understatement of the year

From what I have seen most people are concentrating on how hard it will be to pick up the trackballs. But what about when you have already done that. Depending on how a robot is built, 10 lbs. in the wrong place could cause the robot to tip over. To make this worse, the robot would now be impeding traffic. Even if you don't tip over, you could possibly drop it from unintentional bumping. If this happened, as Jake said above, how long will it take to recapture a trackball after it has fallen (and stopped bouncing). It may even cross the finish line, meaning you would have to bring it around the track before you could hurdle it. Just my take on it.

nuggetsyl 06-01-2008 22:21

Re: Best Way to Get Points
 
It seems to me that a lot of people posting on this thread thinks it will be easy to pick up and put the ball over the overpass. The ball is slick, if you drop the ball just once you will have wasted a lot of time and will not be able to make up the points of 2 robots pushing balls around the track and one driving around.

7 laps with ball 28points

3 over bar 3 laps 30 points


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