Buckeye 2008!!!
 

So just wanted to start up a thread about who is going, what to think about the teams, maybe post some pictures, and more! I for one am very excited and am always excited for Buckeye. It was the first FIRST competition that SparX ever went to and my first FIRST competition!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Team 612 is going for the very first time. Does anyone remember the pit dimensions at buckeye?

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Uhm... arent they always 10'x10'x10'? As i remember, buckeye is a little on the generous side usually, but I wouldn't bank on it.

1024 actually tried to back out of Cleveland after our plans got changed in Chicago, but turns out we can't. Sooo... Cleveland here we come!

Looks like a lot of teams are going I haven't met before... should a good time.

Does anyone know where the team social is going to be held? (hoping for science museum)

See you all there,

q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Team 1714 will be there for the third time. We're looking forward to it.

You dont want it to be at the rock n roll hall of fame?

Joey

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

The team social will be at the Great Lakes Science Center on Friday.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Uhm... no? I'm not really a rock-and-roll person. Actually, we (1024) ended up doing a whole bunch of math-y exercises out in the area in front of the rock-and-roll hall of fame after we all exhausted the get-to-the-highest-place-in-the-building thing.

Among these: Use the circumference of that huge flower planter to figure out how far it is accross (since it said "Do Not Walk on Flowerbeds"), How many panes of glass were in the triangular faces of the hall of fame building?

Great!

-q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I hate the Rock n' Roll HOF. The food is bland and there's more security there than the White House. They don't let you take pictures of anything. I'd rather go see a Cavs game instead.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I agree with the previous posters; the rock and roll hall of fame (doesn't deserve capitalization) would be a poor choice, as, especially for Ohio teams, it gets really old really fast. However, the Great Lakes Science Center (does deserve capitalization) is a wonderful choice, as it can never get old, and we all should be science oriented people.

Team 2603 is attending Buckeye, and we're rather excited for it. It's going to be fun, and I get to see my Fluffy again.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Go figure, the 4th-place Cavs will be playing the 5th-place Raptors at 7:30 PM at the Q on Friday the 21st. But I hear they will be showing us all a Mars-based IMAX movie at the Team Social at the Science Center this year.

48 will be at Buckeye looking forward to seeing familiar faces 379, 1126, 191 from last year, as well as all the other strong teams that will be in attendance.

And 1024, while it's unfortunate you couldn't unregister for Buckeye, the rest of us will still be happy to see you compete there.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I hope to go this year, see what happens...

On that note, is there someone that wouldnt mind letting me stay with them?

Well after looking at the teams attending, looks like there is quite a few great teams heading down to Buckeye, sure looks like it'll be a good show

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

You must be a load of fun at a party... :rolleyes:
Let there be ROCK! :cool:

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

personally im really excited to see 1024's hybrid mode...so im not so dissapointed that they didnt unregister either

what robots do you think will be strong at this regional/go the the furthest into the tournament

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Only these teams will have played in a regional previous to buckeye this year.

48
120 (Pending Pittsburgh)
184 (Pending Detroit)
191
250
379 (Pending Pittsburgh)
612
639
1024
1048
1126
1250 (Pending Detroit)
1502
1506 (Pending Detroit)
1629 (Pending Chesapeake)
1714 (Pending Wisconsin)
1990 (Pending Pittsburgh)
2048 (Pending Detroit)
2228
2252 (Pending Pittsburgh)


There will be plenty of experienced teams of this years game coming to this regional. This is one thing teams should take note of who will be in attendance.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I am excited to attend Buckeye! This is my first time returning to the regional since 2004 with Greater Rochester Robotics (#340). It should be a great regional! :yikes:

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Well, I have my hopes for who will go furthest into the tournament (rookies!... maybe?), but I really doubt that my hope will be right. Therefore, I agree with deshirider that the teams which have already had a regional this year will have a definite edge.

PS: deshirider, you forgot a couple of teams that have already had a competition this year, albeit not a full-fledged regional: the rookies that went to Kettering.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

How about some pics/video of the robots that will be competing at Buckeye?

I'd love for some Finger Lakes intel on our Rochester-area visitors....


48:

Picture:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/30834

Video:
http://www.thebluealliance.net/tbatv/team.php?team=48

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

48
191
250
612
1024
1126

Those teams have experience in this game in the eliminations and a few of them were finalists and champions. So they have a significant advantage knowing how to play this game and play it well.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I'd watch out for 379 as well - co-champions with 48 at Buckeye last year. They'll have a regional under their belts in Pittsburgh by the time they reach Cleveland.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Photos:
Here's a nice pre-ship photo without bumpers or rear data display: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/30494

Here's a few more, thanks to 1038: http://www.frcpics.com/thumbnails.php?album=38

Videos:
ABC Had our robot on the news for about a minute in the chicago area if you can find it.

As usual, the blue alliance also has recorded matches of our robot: http://www.thebluealliance.net/tbatv/team.php?team=1024

For laughs, here's a video of an early prototype of our pneumatic ball launcher: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=63146

(NEVER BEFORE SEEN!) For grins, here's the earliest video I have of our autonomous navigation system running (wow it's come a long way): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpERtTK8LLI

For comparison, here's a later prototype of the navigation system with most of the autonomous nav features seen in the matches: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRUsb2Pls4M

See you all at Buckeye!

-q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Team 2228 thought that the trading cards were very sucsessful at the Finger Lakes Regional, therefore we would like to trade them at Buckeye, with a new and imporoved version. In order to make this possible we will need teams to send 2 pictures of there robot / team, and team infromation (please fill out the attached Xls sheet with your info and email that to us) to cards@hflrobotics.com by Thursday March 13th.

Any Questions Please Send me a message or an email to

webmaster@hflrobotics.com

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Team 250 has never been to Cleveland, and we were wondering if there were any good resturants to take the team to. Possibly something inexpensive, around $10 per person or less would be ideal, and within walking distance of the competition would be great too.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Koko don't for get team 1731, they were the finalists for the VCU regional.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Hello Everyone,
Yes, we signed up late (kind of last minute actually), but we're very excited about coming to the Buckeye Regional! If you haven't seen it yet; you can check out our robot (The Riveteer) at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jecO-WTRoFQ. There are also plenty of pictures and videos on our website http://www.team1731.org. See you there!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Are there any plans to webcast this regional this year? I didn't see any on the NASA FIRST Webcast Database page. I would volunteer, but I have NO idea what it takes or even if I'd have time to make it work. Thanks.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I normally take a bunch of our kids (walk down ) to Hard Rock
Cafe. They have a lot of burger/fries stuff ( fried macaroni?) and
you can get out of there for around 10 bucks.

Just make sure you have adults with the group if you walk to keep
an eye on your guys.

They let us do separate checks last year also. Nice people.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

i highly recommend winking lizard. look it up online, great food and reasonable pricing.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I too would like to know if there are any plans for a webcast.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I've requested information on this from the Regional Directors.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Alright, thanks a bunch. :)

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

In conjunction with Engineers Without Borders team 612 is creating a system to remove indoor air pollution from simple fires in Honduran kitchens.

In order to do this we are using activated charcoal, solar panels and old, unused and recycled computer fans. We have already collected a bunch of extra fans from previous years kits and from students at our school and were hoping that the teams at Buckeye would be able to contribute more to this. We will have a box set up the regional to collect extra and unused fans if anyone is willing to give one or two away. We are willing to accept fans of every size and every type as we will burn through them in our prototyping phases. Thank a bunch!

Please PM me if you have any questions since we should keep this thread more about the regional than the computer fans that 612 needs. :D

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I can now tell you that, YES, there are concrete plans for a Buckeye webcast. Stay tuned.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

my bet is on 1731 and only because I've seen them personally in action. They were also gracious in giving us a single pneumatic solenoid, no questions asked. Everyone will see just how potent they are.
612 also.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I usually don't dine in that area of Downtown, but a quick Google Local search shows a few within walking distance, including fast food (Subway, Mr. Hero's), a deli, and a Rascal's House pizza parlor.

Also, I second the recommendation for The Winking Lizard. I've been there, food's good, the atmosphere is awesome.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Friday Awards:

• Woodie Flowers Award: Martin Rothwell of Team 612 (congratulations, Mr. Rothwell!)
• Autodesk Visualization Award: Team 1008
• Delphi "Driving Tomorrow's Technology" Award: Team 1629
• Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers Entrepreneurship Award: Team 612
• Rockwell Automation Innovation in Control Award: Team 1001
• Xerox Creativity Award: Team 1787
• Imagery Award: Team 1317
• Website Award: Team 48
• Judges Award: Team 2048

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Saturday Awards:

• Regional Chairman's Award: Team 612
• Engineering Inspiration Award: Team 1629
• Regional Winners: Teams 1024, 1126, 1386, 2048
• Regional Finalists: Teams 94, 1731, 1990
• Chrysler Team Spirit Award: Team 379
• GM Industrial Design Award: Team 1024
• Johnson & Johnson GP Award: Team 1250
• Motorola Quality Award: Team 1126
• Highest Rookie Seed Award: Team 2632
• Underwriters Laboratory Industrial Safety Award: Team 48
• Rookie All-Star Award: Team 2387
• Rookie Inspiration Award: Team 2603
• Judges Award: Team 963

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Congratulations to all the winners and all the teams, and especially 612, and the hardworking group from Western Maryland - Team 1629. I'm so excited you qualify to go to Atlanta! :)

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Wow and to win the regional with 1024, 2043/1386.... Congrats to our winners!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Fantastic job all Buckeye regional teams! It was a pleasure! :D

Shout out to our great alliance partners 1126, 1386, and 2048. Thank you all!

Also, a special note to finalist 1731: We love flashy things (bright yellow robots, large led displays, etc.) and we loved your innovative robo coach control concept. But, we have some suggestions. 1) Your robo coach needs to have a mirror ball mounted on a helmet on her head. 2) Also, she needs some kind of music producing device so she can just start up a dance party complete with lights and music wherever you all may roam... plus, I'm sure the camera guys would think it was GREAT! :D

Thanks to everyone for another fantastic Buckeye regional! We'll see you all in Atlanta! :D

-q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Congratulations to 1024 for becoming only the fourth team EVER to win three regional events in a single season.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Congrats 1024.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Oh... yeah! I forgot about that. Whoops.... :o

Thanks for the compliment!

-q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Are you sure you aren't thinking of 1731? I'm pretty sure that's who had the set of giant colored flashlights.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

The buckeye regional was great and was a really fun experience, especially being the only one I'll get to see this season.:(
Congrats to 1024, 1126, 1386, and 2048 on winning the buckeye regional, you made the elims very interesting.
Congrats to 1024 for the triple crown victory Midwest, Boiler Maker and now Buckeye.
and Congrats to 612 on winning the regional chairmans award.

<revelle> I don't mean to blow my teams own horn but, we also have gone triple crown(-ish) on another award this year. We have won three out of three Safety Awards, Midwest, Pittsburgh and Now Buckeye</taps>

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

we also got our triple crown...our third buckeye victory....thanks too our alliance partners and all the teams that made this a great regional!!!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Mmmmmm I love me some triple crown. 3 out of 5 baby!!!!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Team 1629 had a great time at the Buckeye Regional. Thanks to all the teams who made it a great weekend!

We'd especially like to thank 191 and 2228 - Thanks for being FANTASTIC alliance partners, you guys are such great teams and were a lot of fun to play with. Hopefully we'll see you again either in Atlanta or next season!

Congrats to the winners, and to 612 for winning Chairman's again - you guys deserve it!

Thanks to the refs for running the matches smoothly, and thanks to the judges for seeing our potential for the Engineering Inspiration Award!

See you in Atlanta!!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

This year was pretty fun for me. It was the first time our team stuck with one set of drivers, only switching out once. I know it's GP to let everyone have a chance, but this was much better. Also, our robot [mostly] worked this year. That's a plus!

The GLSC was really fun, it's been years since I've been there. More entertaining than the Rock And Roll Hall, in my opinion.

My thanks: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=66148

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

i also wanted to send a big thanks too our sister team the Xcats....those semi finals were just amazing....if anyone wants to see some intense high scoring matches try to find those....i thought we were on Einstein not Buckeye

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Yep, sorry. I just edited it. Yet another reason why you have to be careful CD'ing while on a late-night bus ride. :o

-q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Delphi Elite, yes I know I already said this to some of your team on the way out, but it deserves saying again... I don't know how you all COULDN'T be the winners of the safety award. What on earth would we do without your safety escorts?

Congratulations, Delphi Elite!

-q

p.s. Your half-track drivetrain is rockin sweet... really like the speed it has now too. See you all in Atlanta!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Wow! Congratulations 1024 on your 3rd win in one season! Good luck in Atlanta.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Thanks for the compliments. In addition to their obvious duties, these kids serve as our eyes and ears in the pits, pointing out teams in need of parts or assistance. They've given me more reasons to smile this year than I can count.

I've actually started to see teams mimicking the safety escort actions on their own - imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. It's nice to see their practices assumed internally by other FIRST teams. The safety escort motto - walk carefully and carry a big mouth!

Thanks to 1008 and 1532 for joining 48 in our (yet another - 3 events, 3 QF finishes, 3 lose first, win second, lose third situations - only on 48 do you see such patterns of consistency in seemingly random events materialize.....) short but sweet elimination run this year. Your teamwork in sticking up for alliance partners placed in precarious positions more than makes up for not advancing in the elims.

Thanks to 48's own Frank Bosak and David Thomas from 964 for putting on a great webcast. We DIDN'T have the draw of Karthik and Copioli like Waterloo, but we still had upwards of 150 viewers simultaneously watching our little ol' robotics competition from abroad. Great job, guys.

And I think someone over at TBA needs to take a look at the stats for your linked sig banner, Q - they list you as semifinalists at Buckeye! Oops....

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Speaking of the webcast, it is still up on uStream.tv but it's very laggy, and trying to find specific parts in a video that long is tedious. Is there a way to download it? I've been trying to download it off of uStream.tv but I couldn't. Would it be possible to cut it to hour long pieces and put it on youtube (where it can be downloaded with just a bit of work). You guys did a great job with the webcast, but if you did this too that would be awesome. Thanks.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Frank only recorded the webcast vid of Friday's matches - he was a bit wary of saving that much stuff to ustream - didn't want them to pull the plug lol.

I *think* we had a VCR recording the feed in VHS throughout the weekend - not sure if Dave T. or anyone from 191 got any good quality vid that could be digitized, parsed, and uploaded to TBA or SOAP.

If someone else had the patience to parse the video (Koko Ed?, Ellery?), I'd look into what kind of source tapes we have and send them out.




If we still have them, I'd attempt to send the tapes if someone else wanted to do the parsing.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I think Ellery has the capture card and he's REALLY busy with school. So I don't know....

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I can give you my new address for a copy of the tapes and upload the raw digital footage so the excellent team here can help me parse it.

Lesman, hold on for about a week or so. I might be able to parse some of the UStream video, but I have to wait for the service to convert it to WMV.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Team 2048 had an Awesome time!!
cangrats on the 3rd trophy! You guys deserve it we're glad to be a part of your alliance!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Team 2228 had a great time at the Buckeye Regional!, we got hybrid working and went to the semifinals with team 191 and 1629. the refs did a good job and the field program was fixed ,see you guys next years!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I would like to say thank you to everyone who made this competition possible. After Thursday, I didn't know what was gonna happen. Also a huge thanks to all our alliance partners throughout the competition! To all the teams who gave SparX awards, Thank you! To 1386, thank you for being there and doing your best for us. To 2048, thank you for stepping in and doing exactly what we asked of you and what we needed from you! To 1024, congrats on your 3rd victory of the year, and thank you for selecting us, it was an honor. And to my own team, 1126 SparX, for making my final buckeye as a student one to truly remember.

"It's all about the stories." -Dale B. SparX mentor

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

as stated above 2228 had a great time at buckeye!!! after a complete turn around from FLR we got our bot working and were thrilled to make it to the semis with X-cats 191 and GaCo 1629!!! Another great FIRST experience, and a memorable one for a senoir!!

Thanks for the great competition and congrates 1126, 1024, 1386, and 2048 for winning!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

If you need any help with this, I can help. More accurately I can put Lesman and some of our other team members to work on this.;)

And thanks Team 48 for the web cast. I had a couple of friends watching who loved it. Their first time to see a FIRST competition.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Thanks for the suggestion. Best I can do is point you and your teammates to the central collaborating point for TBA/SOAP: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/fo...play.php?f=175

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

The Buckeye Regional was amazing! After coming back to the hotel on Thursday I wasn't sure how the Buckeye Regional was going to be. I would like to thank all the FIRST volunteers, planning committee, both the FTA guy and IRI guy for fixing the field issues Thursday night, the referees, judges, and the game announcer and MC who made the Buckeye Regional fun and exciting! Congrats to team 1024 for being three time regional winners this year! Also I would like to thank them for picking us to be alliance partners in the finals. I would also like to thank teams 2048 and 1386 for helping us out in the finals. We couldn't have done it without you guys! Again thanks to everyone for making this regional possible and FUN! I would also like to thank the X-cats team 191 for being so gracious throughout the week and helping us out when we needed it. You guys are awesome!

As many of you watched I believe that it was Match 59 and Finals match #2 when our Robot had troubles and just stopped on the field. After match #59 we took a look at the problem. After looking over our entire robot we took another battery in and it worked perfectly. After doing more diagnostics we found out that the battery that was in our robot during match #59 had a bad cell. Then in Finals match #2 the same thing happened with a different battery. The cell went bad. We are not sure how this happened but are wondering if anyone has had similar issues or anything that they think could possibly be causing this problem. Thanks again to everyone for making this a memorable regional!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Might see if you are putting a very large Current spike
on the battery. A weak cell would fail if it wasn't generating
voltage that matches the others.

Peak reading ammeter would do this or just use a scope
and a .010 resistor in series to see the current spikes.

Thats all I can think of or you had the worst statistics on
record with Two rotten batteries.

Hope this helps

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Congratulations and Thanks to our Partner teams!
What a great alliance!




Photo compliments of Bob Jadloski / Team 48 photog and FIRST

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

1317 had a great time, even though our drivetrain got a little messed up on Friday. Luckily, we had Mini-Me as a backup. :D

Congratulations to the winning alliance, those were some fabulous bots!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I'd be glad to help, especially if a certain teacher gives us some extra free time in Stats and Cisco...

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I'd like to take a moment (and my first post) to thank EVERYONE who makes FIRST happen!

Then I'd like to follow up with a HUGE THANKS to teams 1024, 1126 who saw something in our robot... We appreciate it that you believed in us as much as we believe in ourselves.

After that, I'd like to thank team 2048 for finishing in our spot, helping bring home the victory for our alliance.

Man I sure would really like to find out how to use the gyro and accelerometer to make it easier to navigate in autonomous mode...

and lastly, I'd LOVE to do my best in learning more things that I can help our team members be more successful.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Just come over and see me or any of our guys sometime in Atlanta. I'd be happy to give you all at 1386 some pointers.

Thanks for your assistance in the eliminations!

-q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Buckeye 08' was my first out-of-state FIRST competition, my second in general. The amount of energy and spirit I witnessed there was overwhelming. I can't wait to see what things will be like in future competition. See you all there and good luck!

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Compared to last year's competition, what you seen was nothing. The energy there wasn't as great, but hopefully next year will be better.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Does any one know where i can find pictures of us two Leprechaun's? I have looked and i cannot find any.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Blakcheez-
If what you say is true, then I'm definately sticking around. What I saw at buckeye 08' was incredible, but if past years have indeed yielded greater results, then I'll be around to witness them in future years. If I saw only a portion of everyones energy at buckeye, I can't wait to see what everyone will be like in Atlanta.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I don't know, but there's not much posted on CD media from Buckeye, and the region's site hasn't updated the gallery yet.

I've yet to attend an Atlanta event, but from what I hear, it's awesome.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I'm not sure there are any photos of said leprechauns in this gallery but is what 48 has available from buckeye. I might also suggest contacting Frank Bosak the webmaster of our site he might have the rest of the photos taken at buckeye.

It is an awesome event, IMHO other than IRI it is the best of the best FIRST has to offer. Take the time to take everything in from all of the FRC, FLL and FTC events and pits that you can. Driver or not, find an excuse to make it to a field, ground level, during the playoffs, it is breath taking. it is also a great chance to meet the legends of FIRST and some of the friends you make on these message boards.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Delphi E.L.I.T.E. just posted a nice high-quality mascot picture here.

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Just a status update request... not nagging... ;)

But, does anyone know what the status of the recorded match footage of buckeye is? Has anyone got a real live copy of the straight video (not split by match)? Is anyone splitting it?

If you have the video (whoever you might be) and you have no one to split it, if you could just split it into youtube-size chunks (like I did for BMR before SOAP got it) and put it on there, it'd be greatly appreciated. There's one match in particular that I'd love to watch a re-run of... specifically, the one where I hear that our robot may have made 7 hurdles during teleoperated period (Maybe Qulifications #36?).

Thanks so much whoever(s) you are,

-q

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

Qbranch,

I have access to the video, but really no good way to get them to you. However, I did watch matches 36, 43, 59 and 65, and you did not score 7 hurdles in any of them. The rest of the qualification matches seem to have too low a score to have 7 hurdles (unless there were a lot of penalties). Sorry.

Mike

Re: Buckeye 2008!!!
 

I believe the team to speak with is Delphi E.L.I.T.E., team 48. As far as I know, they're the only ones who recorded [most of] the regional, unless Mike is saying that SparX has it also.