Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

That's an engineering tradeoff. As much as I loved the old system it was fairly fragile. This thing seems invincible to anything we can do to it.

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

I share nearly all of your sentiments.

I don't consider the proprietary Labview Real-Time environment to be anything even close to mainstream and it appear that all of FIRST is now wedded to the Labview programming paradigm. I see little more than lip service to the C/C++ development possibilities. We'll see what shows up in the next few weeks.

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

Its now well past noon and there still aren't any videos of the revealing. Were the only videos the ones already posted. Did anyone watch the webcast earlier today on curie and record it?

-Mike

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

guys, relax :-)

We have a pretty darned cool new system in the works. A lot of my fears have been laid to rest. programing will come in time. They have already said that we will be able to use C/C++ to program. I have no doubt that the FRC community will be get to work and figure out a fantastic library of code for everyone to use within one year of release. I know some of the older, more established teams are worried about losing ground to younger team. Isn't a more even playing field, no matter how short lived it is, a good thing?

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

This new system is gonna be awesome! I really liked the old IFI system, but I really think this new system is gonna be better. I'm really excited for wireless debugging over wi-fi. Also, from a perspective of preparing for our future, National Instruments is a very big company with a lot of presence in the engineering field, and this system will prepare us for the future where we will all probably work with National Instruments products.

All the features sound great, but my one question is, theoretically, if the control system was on and connected to a 802.11 hotspot, could you have your laptop connected to a 802.11 hotspot and use the wi-fi to wirelessly program the control system? And I'm not thinking of across the room programming, I'm thinking of the laptop and robot being in separate hotspots programming, let's just say, the robot is in Detroit and the laptop is in Atlanta! I know that similar things have been done in different fields, but did NI put that capability into the system?

Overall, this will be quite a leap forward with FIRST, I only wish I could have seen the testbed robot in Atlanta (but no, I had to listen to a boring health lecture!) ;)

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

From blowing up the pictures the $50 sidecar hooks into a 9203 module ($349 list) using a $149 (List) cable. The module provides 32 i/o's which is what the 10 + 8 + 14 add up to.

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

Hmm, so we could take a mechanical pit crew to the actual competition venue, while the programmers go to Starbucks and fix all the software problems from there?:cool:

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

Finally somebody understands how I roll.:p

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

The other thing with the weight is who says it is 5 less pounds of robot than can be used? Did anyone think FIRST might have noticed the weight differences. Perhaps the weight limit will be raised 5 lbs. next year to offset the increase.

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

PREDICTION TIME!!!!!!

my prediction:
in previous years (including this year), elite teams have been defined by mostly previous experience, mechanical design, and some software development. with this new PLC running the robot, for the most part, i'd say the majority of teams will be somewhat in the dark until one is shipped out. next year, i predict that what will make or break all of the veteran teams (therefore leveling the playing field) will be how well they can learn this new system.

for rookie teams, things shouldn't be much different, as they still have to learn the entire system. but, for non-rookie teams, i know for me, the biggest challenge will be learning the new system, essentially putting me in the same position as a rookie team. for this year, at least, i think EVERY team, rookie or not, will have EXACTLY the same chance (or better odds) at success, which, in my opinion, is AWESOME!!

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

Regarding the speed controllers being hooked up to the SideCar:
That's fine, but what do we do with the pins on the analog input module? I doubt it's supposed to be a non-functional decoration...
http://first.wpi.edu/analog_bumper_side_in_case.jpg

And I have a feeling that some party will release default code as a starting point for novice teams. Not starting everyone with some code to work with would create a huge imbalance between some teams, and I don't think FIRST wants that. Someone is going to write default code to start people off. Gracious professionalism. Need I say more?

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

Looks like a busy summer for the mentors..Start putting together your programming and electrical curriulums now.

Brian

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

I assume you meant 9403 not 9203?

Anyways...my vague point was that it seems a bit odd to use a controller that requires plug in modules for I/O, and these plug in modules require further custom plug in modules to actually interface with the stuff on the robot.

I guess it simulates the research world pretty well, but not the consumer product world.

Fortunately we're a bright bunch of folks and we'll make it work!

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

About the playing field being leveled is true.

It's kind of a bummer that this came out now for us. Just after we get used to working with the IFI system, a new system comes out. It really doesn't help that our team is so small, and we are going to lose all of our programmers because they graduate this year and are going to colleges out of state. :ahh: I'm gonna work really hard on learning C and how to program this system over the summer, because I think that next season, the teams that perform really well well be the ones who can master this code during the off-season.

Hopefully the summer will be enough to get a grasp on this! :(

Re: NEW 2009 Control System Released
 

Input analog things? Potentiometers, gyros, accelerometers, etc.