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BrentJ 02-10-2008 23:16

2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
On Bills Blog the announcement was made that New Zealand won't have a regional in 2009 as originally proposed. :(

They believe that there is not enough time to get it organised. They are hoping to have a 2010 New Zealand Regional.

They will try and have some activity for the teams.

This is going to disappoint a lot of teams who have been working hard to raise money, build Vex robots etc.

I hope First will still let the New Zealand teams have access to the controllers, KOP etc so they can at least gain experience.

R.C. 02-10-2008 23:28

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Are you kidding, I was looking forward to going. Our team raised all the money for it. Well, Maybe next year then. =(

dtengineering 02-10-2008 23:59

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
It was great to meet members of the New Zealand delegation in Atlanta last year. I'm sure they are very disappointed by this news, as, I think is everyone. But it is far better to take the time and "get it right" the first time than to put together a rush job.

It would be great if some of the Kiwi teams could find a way to get to a regional somewhere in North America. I know Vancouver to Auckland is about $1700 (we did, at least, contemplate the possibility of going), but maybe it isn't so expensive to fly from N.Z. to Hawaii or L.A.? Billeting arrangements can not only help bring down travel costs, but can also create some lasting friendships.

Jason

JoshD 03-10-2008 01:18

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Aww that stinks. I definitely think the teams should take this opportunity to go to the airlines to ask and see if they can get donated or discount tickets so they can compete. I'm not quite sure how all of that would work out, but it would be VERY cool if they were able to make something happen.

=Martin=Taylor= 03-10-2008 01:33

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
If they're are enough teams, and enough interest, you could just host your own unofficial regional :cool:

Now that would gain you a LOT of experience, and make starting an official regional in 2010 easier.

BrentJ 03-10-2008 02:41

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Hachiban I think they may be thinking something along those lines.
At the moment every month is a Vex competion.

I am not sure if any teams will go over to other regionals. It'll depend on cost etc.

It would also depend if First holds an official kickoff here.

I don't know if the teams would go just to watch even if they had the money.

Jason does make a good point about getting more time to learn next year with out the pressure. Hopefully they will put on some more mentor training.

We have a school year that runs from late January until early December. So may be next year we could spread the training / fund raising.

Here's a question for you guys.

Do you have on your teams, students who have basic metal working skills such as turning metal on a lathe, milling machine operation etc. I am not thinking about the whole team but maybe a couple of people on the build team or do you tend to use mentors or outside companies?

Thanks for all your support. I must admit to being disapointed as I had hoped to be making that trip to Atlanta.

Brent

Al Skierkiewicz 03-10-2008 07:48

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BrentJ (Post 768461)
Here's a question for you guys.

Do you have on your teams, students who have basic metal working skills such as turning metal on a lathe, milling machine operation etc. I am not thinking about the whole team but maybe a couple of people on the build team or do you tend to use mentors or outside companies?

Thanks for all your support. I must admit to being disapointed as I had hoped to be making that trip to Atlanta.

Brent

Brent,
Each team is different but most teams have students working on machines. It depends on the insurance structure and school district policy. Most would agree, the maximum benefit is with students working next to mentors. It is a team after all.
I am saddened by the this announcement. It was one of those signs that First is branching out to reach all of the world's youth. I would hope that perhaps travel for your teams might be a possiblity and I certainly look forward to meeting up with Kiwi teams in the future.

ChrisH 03-10-2008 11:20

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Well, if anybody from down there can make it to Los Angeles, they are welcome to come. We should have plenty of room for you.

lynca 03-10-2008 14:30

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Travel costs are most likely a major cause.

Does this mean FIRST will add another regional somewhere else ?

EricH 03-10-2008 14:45

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lynca (Post 768522)
Travel costs are most likely a major cause.

Does this mean FIRST will add another regional somewhere else ?

I doubt it, at least for this year. If New Zealand, with at least since Championsip (and probably before) to plan, couldn't do it, where is there an area that can do it this year?

Now, let's see how many NZ teams decide to come to the States or Brazil to compete this year, just for the experience.

chaoticprout 03-10-2008 17:14

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
This is so disappointing...=(

Wetzel 03-10-2008 17:27

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lynca (Post 768522)
Travel costs are most likely a major cause.

Does this mean FIRST will add another regional somewhere else ?

Not this year.

Wetzel

Qbranch 03-10-2008 17:33

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Only two letters and one punctuation mark can describe my feelings about this...

NNNOOOOOOOOOOO!!! :(

-q

dtengineering 03-10-2008 20:00

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BrentJ (Post 768461)
Do you have on your teams, students who have basic metal working skills such as turning metal on a lathe, milling machine operation etc. I am not thinking about the whole team but maybe a couple of people on the build team or do you tend to use mentors or outside companies?


Brent

While there are teams that do amazing things with a hacksaw and a hand drill, and other teams that have mentors and sponsors quite actively involved in the production of the robot, most Canadian public high schools have some form of metal working or wood working shop with technically trained teachers and elective courses that teach students who are interested how to use machine and power tools.

The situation isn't entirely different in the USA, I believe, but perhaps varies a bit more. Our team, for instance has access to several machine lathes, two mills, TIG MIG Gas and Stick welders, sheet metal tools, and (not that we've used it for FRC yet) a forge and small foundry in the metal shop, and a full wood shop, complete with CNC router. We actually design many of our robot parts out of wood, particularly baltic birch plywood, with good success. We have also done fibreglass layup in the Engineering shop, and have built our own custom circuit boards in the electronics shop.

Other teams have more, many have much, much less. It doesn't so much seem to be what you have in your shop, but how you use it that makes the difference.

Jason

P.S. Oddly, we complain that our machine tools are so old that they are still in imperial units... doesn't hurt so much, though, when you're taking part in an American-based competition!

=Martin=Taylor= 03-10-2008 20:07

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BrentJ (Post 768461)
Do you have on your teams, students who have basic metal working skills such as turning metal on a lathe, milling machine operation etc. I am not thinking about the whole team but maybe a couple of people on the build team or do you tend to use mentors or outside companies?
Brent

The only student on our team who knew how to use machine tools was myself... Probably because they were my tools... :)

Needless to say, it isn't that hard to give people instructions over their shoulders and instruct them while they work. We only have 1 mill and 1 lathe, so it isn't too hard for multiple mentors to supervise a single student. Even if that student has no formal training.

We have a similar arrangements at our sponsor's shops (the students run the machines and the owners dictate what to do).

phr34kR 03-10-2008 21:33

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Hi im from Onehunga high school in NZ, we are not a "rich" school but we do fairly good metal working capabilities, MIG TIG welders lots of lathes band saws automatic hacksaws, CNC and allot of space. As far as metal working experience goes I am probably the most experienced in engineering and electronics, luckily I have two more years before I can no longer be on the team, but because of the way our school year works the 6th forms that are one year ahead of me will not be able to compete if this is really cancelled. Our school has done well so far in the vex (winning both unofficial competitions) but im sure allot of us will feel let down by this announcement.

DonRotolo 03-10-2008 21:36

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BrentJ (Post 768461)
It would also depend if First holds an official kickoff here.

Organizing a kickoff event is not much effort, unlike a full regional (where you need [experienced] judges, referees, etc...
Quote:

Originally Posted by BrentJ (Post 768461)
Do you have on your teams, students who have basic metal working skills such as turning metal on a lathe, milling machine operation etc.

No student so far has had advanced metalworking skills like lathe or mill experience, but some start out good with drills, saws and hand tool skills from home. We are fortunate to have a lathe, and so I teach the 2 or 3 kids each year who express an interest. Except for the rare precision work, they do it all.

The rest of the kids, we teach them at least one level of tools above where they are when they start each year (more or less). So from nothing, they go to hand tools, then to basic power tools, then to big saws, grinding cutoff saws, lathe, etc.

Some kids do know how to weld when they start, or they learn over the summer on their own. We don't have a welder, that's the only thing we farm out to a local sponsor.

Don

phr34kR 03-10-2008 21:46

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
From the person responsible for first in NZ," First robotics has not been cancelled it is being re structured at present but it has definately not been cancelled".

:)

apparently they have got half the money they need, enough to hold the competition and to get the kits but not enough to get everyone to america. so eitherway we will all be able to build the robots and compeate which will be awesome and im looking forward too it.:)

BrentJ 03-10-2008 22:17

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by phr34kR (Post 768584)
From the person responsible for first in NZ," First robotics has not been cancelled it is being re structured at present but it has definately not been cancelled".

:)

apparently they have got half the money they need, enough to hold the competition and to get the kits but not enough to get everyone to america. so eitherway we will all be able to build the robots and compeate which will be awesome and im looking forward too it.:)

I never said First Robotics was cancelled but that there won't be a 2009 regional like in the States. This information came from the Head of First, Bill, from his blogspot.

Unless it is an official regional I am not sure how teams could compete to be selected as one of 3 to be sent to the Atlanta .

So from what the person told you will it be run just as if it was a regionel ie kick off day, 6 week build etc?

Phr34kr is next Saturday's competion at Westlake still on?

Brent

phr34kR 04-10-2008 01:50

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
It is my understanding that it will be run as if it was a regional (6 week build etc) i have gotten this information from Bill Smale. And yes as far as i know next saturady (the 11th) competition at westlake girls is still on.

-Tim

Sorry i have just realised that the information may have not come from him but i do know it has come from a person assosiated with the running of the competition. The teacher running it at our school contacted them for me.

Koko Ed 04-10-2008 16:59

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Qbranch (Post 768553)
Only two letters and one punctuation mark can describe my feelings about this...

NNNOOOOOOOOOOO!!! :(

-q

Technically that's 14 letters, three punctuation marks and an emoticon in need of a hug.

Trueliez 05-10-2008 04:28

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
I haven't heard anything through my team about the regional being cancelled, though perhaps I'm just in denial! haha
BrentJ, could you post a link to the blog where you read about this?

In terms of NZers coming over to international competitions, I know a lot of my fellow team members will be gutted about this, so we'll probably do some fundraising to come over and see you guys compete. It's expensive to travel to anywhere from New Zealand though!

BrentJ 05-10-2008 04:41

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Trueliez (Post 768719)
I haven't heard anything through my team about the regional being cancelled, though perhaps I'm just in denial! haha
BrentJ, could you post a link to the blog where you read about this?

The info comes from the First Director's ( Bills ) Blog, the entry for Thursday 2nd October 2008, second paragraph.

http://frcdirector.blogspot.com/

From what the guy from Onehunga said it sounds like we might still have a kick-off , build , competion etc but it won't give the winners an entry into the Atlanta champs.

We might be able to find out more at next Saturdays Vex comp at WestlakeGirls.

Trueliez 05-10-2008 06:33

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Cool, thanks.
It does sound as though we'll still have a national competition, they just won't do another 'all expenses paid' trip to the US which, to be honest, is a very big ask.
Mmm, hopefully the westlake competition will shed some light on the situation.

BrentJ 21-10-2008 15:15

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled - Update
 
Hi

Just letting everyone know what is happening with down here in New Zealand with regards to FRC.

Instead of being part of the FRC from the January Kickoff we will have a New Zealand only FRC competion starting about April. So obviously this won't count to the 2009 FRC season. Maybe 2010 will be our first offical FRC year.

But the good news is we are having an official VEX regional in March.
The winning teams will be going to the World Vex Championship.

While not doing FRC from kickoff is a bit of a disappointment I think in the end it will work out for the best.

This will give our students the chance to work on the small scale Vex to develop their skills.

Even some of the veteran teams are stressing over just the new controller so imagine how it would be to have over thirty new rookie teams trying to get to grips with everything involved in the FRC. Especially when the nearest veteran team is a couple of thousand miles away.

So in the end I think this will better in the long run.

Brent

Bob Steele 21-10-2008 16:29

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
hi Brent,

Glad to hear that FIRST FRC is still alive and well in New Zealand.

I am curious as to why you chose to do VEX rather than FTC?

FTC would give your teams more experience in the LabVIEW environment and you could have sent a team to Atlanta for the championship.

thanks

Good luck!!!

R

BrentJ 21-10-2008 17:43

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Hi Bob

I am not quite sure why Vex over FTC.
But I think it is probably because as part of our FRC preperation, Vex kits were supplied to the participating schools.
So we are just using what we have got.

But the main thing is the students have the Vex World Champs as a goal to aim for.

Brent

Bob Steele 21-10-2008 19:12

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Good luck to you!!
No reason to buy more stuff if you already have VEX!!
That's a good reason..

I wish you the best in your quest for the VEX World championships!!

Maybe I will still see a few of you in Atlanta!!

R

Al Skierkiewicz 21-10-2008 21:57

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Brent,
Please encourage your students to check in here on Chief Delphi during their season. There is some great tech support and a good way to feel connected from so far away. I hope all goes as planned and Kiwi's will be part of the 2010 season. Looking forward to that time.

Akash Rastogi 24-10-2008 15:37

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
So...I just saw that a NZ team is reg. for NJ. Is this correct?

https://my.usfirst.org/myarea/index....event_type=FRC

This would be huge for the NJ regional :D

phr34kR 24-10-2008 16:24

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Um im a little confused, how can you tell it’s a NZ team from that information?

Our team tried to register but were unable to. (This is before we found out that NZ wasn't a region)

And a little off topic i know but as NZ teams may be watching the thread, do the Westlake boys compeate in VEX? I havent noticed them, but then again i may have been assuming they were from another school.

EricH 24-10-2008 16:27

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by phr34kR (Post 771913)
Um im a little confused, how can you tell it’s a NZ team from that information?

Our team tried to register but were unable to. (This is before we found out that NZ wasn't a region)

They're going to New Jersey, so you go to the FIRST regional event list and find New Jersey (or any other event that you may be interested in). Click the Team List link and it takes you to a team list, which tells you number, official name (sponsors, schools), and location. The team in question is from Manchester, Other, New Zealand.

phr34kR 24-10-2008 16:43

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Okay yea i found it. But i cant find of any place called Manchester in NZ? Also as far as i know every team in NZ is starting their six week build from the 20th of april, wouldnt this give us an unfair advantage? This team might be getting their robot dilivered early though. Also there will be NZ teams compeating in the VEX regionals in Dallas and possibly Hawaii.:)

Madison 24-10-2008 16:51

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
It's not a real team. It's left over from testing before registration opened.

Note that its sponsors are "Wally World & Joe's Garage."

Akash Rastogi 24-10-2008 20:34

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Madison (Post 771916)
It's not a real team. It's left over from testing before registration opened.

Note that its sponsors are "Wally World & Joe's Garage."

Awwwww :(

BrentJ 24-10-2008 22:08

Re: 2009 New Zealand Regional Cancelled
 
I agree with Madison it would've been only a test team.

For 2009, New Zealand competion registration they'll be done in New Zealand as group and then passed on where appropriate.

I suppose if a school had the money for a FRC regional entry
plus transport, sponsorship etc they might be able to register for an overseas regional. But that would have to go through NZ FIRST. I can't see anyone doing this for FRC 2009.

The plan is to have NZ compete in FRC 2010 as a standard regional.

Al good suggestion about gettting team members onto Chief Delphi.
I have already mentioned it to the teacher in charge and will let the students know.

Brent


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